Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.
The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights
a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.
I took my car to have an MOT on feb 14th and it failed. It is an S reg high miliage peugeot 306 estate. I sort of guessed it would fail! so I said when I took it in that I wasn't sure it was worth bothering with it as its not worth it. We were thinking of either getting another car, or going to a cheaper garage if it was to have been expensive as we still had 2 weeks of the old MOT available to us to make a descision.
It was MOT'd at 11.15am and I rang at 12 to see what the damage was, the receptionist said it had failed, not sure what on but "Andy" (the garage owner would call me and let me know. At 2.45pm no one had rung and I had to go to get my kids, so I rang again and asked again what needed doing to the car, and again no-one knew and Andy would call me back!. got back from school and rang again , and the man I spoke to said Andy was working on it,doing a bit of welding. But they wanted the courtesy car back and it closed at 6pm...So I took the car back at 545pn and collected mine. Andy came out and told me he had changed two flexy hoses and welded a bit round the cat. Nothing major.
The bill arrived a few days later for £321.75 - we were shocked as I had been told it was minor work, and I had not given them permission to do the work.
My husband rang and said the bill was huge , they asked him to write in to them, he did. on the 5th march. On the 7th March they sent a letter saying they acknowleged there was a Breakdown in communication and they appologised for that. they then said they told is last june (!?)that the car would need work doing soon. They told us that the cat was an expensive part and they welded it to save on cost. they charged us for labour at 171.00 + VAT(£45 per hour) "we hope this clarified any misunderstanding and loook forward to receiving payment shortly"
On 14th March we got an "unpaid invoice" letter saying that we have 7 days to pay or the matter will go to court, and bailiffs may be called in to seize goods form our home to the value of etc etc
they also said that it is unreasonable for them to have to spend inordinate amounts of time chasing up overdue accounts etc.
We are shocked at their attitude, we never asked them to do any work on our car and only asked them to do an MOT. The attitude is amazing as I have been a customer since the early 90's and we have always got on well before this. we have never said we wouldn't pay, but I feel like letting them explain why they did the work in court! My husband has emailed them our intent to pay at the end of the month, but what if they carry out their threats?......I was thinking that I should go to a solicitor and get a letter from them pointing out that I never asked for the work to be done and point out to them how unreasonable they are being....What does anyone else think???
If it was my car, I would stick by my guns and not pay for the work carried out, only the pay for the mot and let them take it to court if they want to get the rest.
But am I right in thinking that the £171 was the labour charge to fit two brake hoses and weld up an exhaust?
Well, i doubt it would have taken them nearly 4 hours to fit two rubber brake hoses and weld up an exhaust. For that sort of money I would have expected the garage to fit a new catatlytic converter. A genuine peugeot cat would be expensive, but nowadays the price of after market cats has dropped pretty significantly. .
But I would still let them take you to court if thats waht they are threatening and thats the way they want to go, I can't see they would have a leg to stand on. Hopefully someone will be along shortly who knows the technicalities of this and be a bit more use than me.
don't know what happened to my last post #3 i spent ages writing out the whole bill!
I will do it all again
mot 50.35
brake hose 14.15
brake hose 13.00
wheel cylinder 29.22
brake fluid 3.47
brake cleaner 3.82
12v 5w w2 1x9 5d capless 1.29
bulb and holder 5.52
retail rate 200.93
----------------------
parts sub total 59.97
labour charge 171.00
(parts and labour 230.97)
----------------------
VAT 40.43
mot total 50.35
Invoice total 321.75
description of work is as follows
Carry out MOT
Replace temp. and clock panel bulbs
replace NS wheel cylinder
Replace OS front position lamp bulb
Replace NS registration lamp bulb
Replace NS and OS rear brake hosees
Weld up split behind catalytic converter.
Point is they didn't get permission to do any work - although I did point out to them the bulb in the clock had gone! and I did ask them to fix that! And theyy didn't let me have a quote or estimate for the work.
I am worried that my husband panicked and emailed them he would pay on 29th.. But thats what you do when you panic!
Thankk you for your reply petej2811,
very helpful, I will get another estimate for the work, at the cheaper end of the market, where obviously we would have gone had we decided to have the work done on such a knackered car!
I was thinking of having a solicitor write to them informing them of what you have put above, but you seem to have covered it all!
I will get back to you
D1
you really dont dont need further estimates for comparison, the point is you dont have to pay if you did not agree to the work being done, DONT pay anything and if the think they can take you to court then let them try, because it will just end up costing them not you!!
they had no agreement in place and you gave ample opertunity for them to ask after phoning twice, so its there problem and there loss!!
Today we delivered by hand a letter saying that we will pay £100.00 in Full and final etc, for the MOT (50.35) and the repalcing (6.81)and changing of a light bulb and any labour that that would have taken .we have told them that they have agreed that there was a lack of communication on their part in their letter and have told them that my OH emailed and agreed to pay in error, before he had taken advice and because he was concerned for the walfare of the family.
We have let them know that they had tresspassed on our property (car) and that before threatening us further they would have to take the matter to the court!
We also pointed out that mentioning 10 months ago our car may need some work, was not an OK to go ahead , without seeking permission.
We have also told them that having been a customer for 2 cars for over 10 years we are saddened that they thought in neccessary to threaten us in such a manner, without having first trying to settle the promblem in an amicable way.
We felt that we had to delilver the letter yesterday as my OH agreed to pay on the 29th, but we have aslo sent a copy of the letter with a Cheque for £100.00 by recorded delivery this morning.
Hope we done good?
Now we are just worried sick about the responce!
dont worry, you have done the right thing and the labour for your bulb change should 0.2 hrs according to icme labout times (this is not 2 minutes its 2 tenths of a minute) so work it out yourself based on there hourly labour rate.
there really is nothing for you to be saddened about though after using them for ten years, in real terms if they had your custom for that length of time then they should have shown you more appreciation in dealing with your car.
let them sit it out now, you will either get a responce denying it a still wanting the other money but will probably hear nothingafter that (just a last tactic in the hope of getting it) or you will get no responce at all.
sit back now and forget it, they really dont stand a chance of getting money from you.
put it like this , you dont go into a pub/restaurant and have a waiter put a 3 course meal in front of you and epect you to pay for it afterwards if you did not order it in the first place
put it like this , you dont go into a pub/restaurant and have a waiter put a 3 course meal in front of you and epect you to pay for it afterwards if you did not order it in the first place
Only if you ate it
Seriously, though - everyone is right, if you have not authorised the work there was no contract for it and you should not be liable to pay. They could (in theory) have said at the time that they would put your car back into the position it had previously been in, i.e. put the old part back in, but it's unlikely they would bother as (a) they may not have kept the part and (b) it would be additional labour for them. Welding obviously cannot be undone anyway.
You've done fine, try not to worry about the response.
Please note I'm not insured in this capacity, so if you need to, do get official legal advice.
Thanks for all the above posts - it is such a relief to know that I have done the right thing - still abit worried that my OH said he would pay them via email - but as I have told them he did this when he felt intimidated and concerned for the family, I hope I have got away with it!
but, and its a big but(t)! - they did apologize in thier letter for the lack of communication, so I think they shot themselves in the foot with that line!!
I am still worried - but im afraid that I am prepared to go to court if necessary over this, and if it comes to that I will ask for help with legal papers!!!! Hope it doesn't come to that, I will update if anything else happens>
Thanks again
Sue
noclue £11 for sundries is a joke
i must admit that sometimes we do add £2 for sundries but this is to cover everthing like seat cover, floor mats, top up of antifreeze /brake fluid ect, and we feel this is a reasonable figure to work with, (what do you think??)
we do remove this from the bill though depending on the job (i.e. we are not going to put sundries if were changing a couples of bulbs or something like that)
I assume from the above comment that you have or work at a garage gbjadyy, can I ask what kind? how big? is it an independant one or one attached to a group? I am glad if you are the biz as I feel you really will know your onions!!! ( Im in catering - can you guess?)
noclue £11 for sundries is a joke
i must admit that sometimes we do add £2 for sundries but this is to cover everthing like seat cover, floor mats, top up of antifreeze /brake fluid ect, and we feel this is a reasonable figure to work with, (what do you think??)
we do remove this from the bill though depending on the job (i.e. we are not going to put sundries if were changing a couples of bulbs or something like that)
darling i work for an independent but we do many dealing with both fleet companies and warranties, we are iso registered and the new pass 80 certified and have to abide by certain rules and safety procedures, we also have many dealing with brekdown clubs, AA and RAC are only 2 of many, we always offer what we consider to be sound advise to our customers and dont make a habit of trying to ripp poeple off, We have no need for endless advertising technics either as most custom comes from word of mouth
Hi,gbjadyy. thanks for that!! Hope I didn't offend by asking what it is that you do!!! I am obviously NOT in the garage world, but what is the oddest thing about my case is that I have been a customer for many many years, and it came as a huge shock when the garage decided to send me such a rude and agressive letter, pointing out that they should not have to spend their time chasing up non payers! that ontop of doing the work with out permission is an insult to injury!
The thing is this garage has a very good reputation usually, and I went to them via word of mouth in the first place, but in more recent years they have had an "office manager" - lady on the front desk, who is sour facesd and does not seem to have a personality at all! - Once I had agreed to take the car in after the school run and she rang me at 9.05 to complain that I was late!! Oh well, no word from them yet! Thankyou for all your help
dont worry about the sour face on the desk, if she continues to cause problems for the garage i am sure she wont work there for too long and calling you at 9.05 and complaining is just arrogant.
we like to have cars in between 9 and 10am but if someone arrives after that (depending on whats booked in) we will usually say leave it with us and we will see what we can do but cant promise repair that day due to time constraints, but promise we will trey to at leastfind out whats wrong even if we dont have time to do the repair!!
its simple about trying to do your best to help rather than just seeing people as a money bank and this approach pays off in the long run with repaeted business.
Also if you do have a problem on the front desk always ask to speak to manager and let them know you are not happy, most managers will take note and reflect on whether the person is suitable for the job if enough people complain (you might believe your complaint is ignored but it usually is not as its in the interest of the company to ensure there customers are happy)
Garage has done work without permission
in communication and they appologised for that. they then said they told is last june (!?)that the car would need work doing soon. They told us that the cat was an expensive part and they welded it to save on cost. they charged us for labour at 171.00 + VAT(£45 per hour) "we hope this clarified any misunderstanding and loook forward to receiving payment shortly"
Reply With Quote
Originally Posted by gbjadyy
)
Thankyou for all your help