Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.
The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights
a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.
Hi,this is a bit of a saga,so please be patient with me.In April 06 i started work with a small transport company as their manager and had a company vehicle,by 1st July 06 i had left the company as their business practices were somewhat unusual - i.e people did work for them and never got paid! and being the manager i did'nt want to be any part of this once i found out.The company were based over 200 miles away from me.In mid July 06 i sent them a registered letter asking for the rest of my wages and expenses owed (around £350),the letter also stated that the vehicle needed to be picked up or i would be charging £7 per day storage (in my garden) for it.Over the next few months the company and Directors seemed to dissappear into thin air from their unit and no contact could be made with them,their registered address at Companies House is actually their accountant,someone has also put a Winding up order on them but with all of this including several CCJ's from outstanding creditors,no one has been able to contact them or get any money.What i'm actually asking is,is there a way i can legally claim their vehicle which is still in my garden as the storage fees i'm charging them and my outstanding money now mount up to more than the vehicles worth.Thanks for your patience.:grin:
Not officially - and you also run the risk of being accused of obtaining the vehicle by deception - especially if the Receiver/Liquidator becomes involved. The chances are they didn't own the vehicle themselves, and it was Leased or under a Contract hire agreement. Since the only way of taxing it is to get it rehisted in your name, this will alert both these companies that something is amiss, and drop you right in it.
I appreciate you are owned a lot, but you'll not be able to jump the queue of creditors - of which there will probably be many. Saying that your were only holding onto the vehicle as security for repayment won;t wash in court. (Unfortunately).
Hi,the vehicle is wholly owned by the company,there has been no one in contact with me or anyone that i know is owed money by this company,i have tried to contact them the company to make them aware of the storage charges.As a matter of interest i wonder what would happen should the Official Reciever or whatever body takes responsibility for a failed company's closure,tries to collect the vehicle and i don't let them take it because of the monies owed to me,anyone have any views on this?.
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Re: Not exactly a Consumer question but....
Originally Posted by buzby
I appreciate you are owned a lot, but you'll not be able to jump the queue of creditors - of which there will probably be many. Saying that your were only holding onto the vehicle as security for repayment won;t wash in court. (Unfortunately).
See above. Sorry. The company will have priority creditors (possibly even including the Inland Revenue).
Sorry - you're coming at this the wrong way round. YOU cannot levy storage charges unless you have got written agreement from the directors to pay such fees, you are not permitted to arbitrarily set your own tariff and attempt to extract payment, that's looked upon as extortion. YOUR claim is added to the pile of creditors and if there's no money lefy after the preferential creditors, Revenue, Banks, Landlords etc, the unsecured creditors are next - but often there's not enough to go round.
Bearing in mind the way the company has been run (and the way you've been treated) how do you know the vehicle was wholly-owned by the firm? This can only be found by using an HPI check, the Registration document in its printed form doesn't show this.
Sorry - you're coming at this the wrong way round. YOU cannot levy storage charges unless you have got written agreement from the directors to pay such fees, you are not permitted to arbitrarily set your own tariff and attempt to extract payment, that's looked upon as extortion. YOUR claim is added to the pile of creditors and if there's no money lefy after the preferential creditors, Revenue, Banks, Landlords etc, the unsecured creditors are next - but often there's not enough to go round.
If thats the case i'm wondering why,if your car is ticketed,clamped and then towed away to a pound,you are given a certain time to pay the release fee and collect it,if you don't you are charged a daily storage fee,OR if a garage does work on your car and you can't immediately pay the bill,the garage (apparently!) may charge storage after a certain time.Both these cases do happen and the person who the car belonged to would'nt have given either organisation permission to charge storage initially.I've never heard of any kind of case like these to be put down to extortion - sorry i'm not trying to be awkward but showing similar situations.P.S - the vehicle definately,100% belongs to them as i know its history.P.P.S - to my knowledge the Taxman and V.A.T are no longer "Preferential" creditors in cases like these.
Easy, in the first case, a law has been enacted to give lawful authority to the council to do exactly this, and to this end millions of signs have been erected and paint laid to advise when/where this restriction applies.
In the second case, garages invariably get the customer to sign an agreeement on accepting the vehicle that the work will be undertaken, and in addition to the usual disclaimers about not being responsible for the vehicle contents, if you do not collect the vehicle after the service/repair, storage charges 'may' apply and ultimately, the vehicle could be sold to recover these fees if you do not comply. Again, the customer's agreement is on the form before the work commences, so it is all above board.
As to the vehicle's ownership - at least that's more money available to be distributed to creditors, however the Taxman and Banks remain preferential creditors and will always be ahead of the ordinary claimant. The first is covered by Act of Parliament (which hasn't been altered), and the second by contract (with the bank) which the directors would have freely entered into, probably also being secured on their personal assets.
If you retain a vehicle (which is not yours) it will become a liability as you will not be able to tax or insure it, so as security against money owed it's not ideal. You may end up providing free storage and run the risk of being accused of being cavalier with the firms property.
To protect yourself, I strongly suggest you write to the firm, explaining that you have the vehicle and are still awaiting its uplift from your address (you can't take it as you're not insured to drive it). Also use this opporetunity to remind them you have money owed to you and would appreciate this by return. You CANNOT say the vehicle is being held as security for the payment. Send this by recorded delivery, and keep a copy - this way if there is any comeback, you've done all that is reasonably possible to ensure their property was returned.
Not exactly a Consumer question but....
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Originally Posted by buzby
