Last year we were more than happy when we bought our home, our house is a fantastically converted house, which was renovated 3 years ago, prior to these renovations, it was 2 back to back houses, however this was changed to being one large open plan house.

As such we have 2 addresses.

Now the problems come :

Before we even moved, being law abiding people, we bought our TV license, in adress 1, all was fine for a month or 2.

Then we received HIS ADDRESS IS UNLICENCED then in about 40pt font in bold red letters YOUR DETAILS ARE BEING PASSED TO OUR ENFORCMENT OFFICERS

Now we were a bit scared by this, and had to ring a 0870 number, when we did so, we were told the incompetant that he had linked both address's together so now would only show as needing 1 license for both address's, nad not one for each.

Fine you would think, all is now sorted.

NO a while later we received a knock at the door at about 8pm, opened it to be greeted with someone claiming to be from TV licensing, and wanted to know if we had a TV, to which i naturally said yes, he then asked to come in, to which i said no, he proceeded to say that i have a TV in the house in which case you are currently commiting a CRIMINAL OFFENCE. I dont think so i replied, i have a license for address 1 which following a phone call had been ammended on their computer system, he was insistant that we didnt have a license. I told him he needs to contact his office, which he did, during this conversation he said he had made sure that they had ammended my details on the computer system and i will not have any further problems.

I then received a letter indentical to the first in address 1 again saying i didnt have a license, again i had to phone the 0870 number, the idiot on the other end of the phone said, when the enfocrment officer called in he changed the address on the license from adress 1 to address 2, i said this is not good enough, it both address's need to be LINKED, not a difficult thing to do. He replied with "i cant change anything it has to be an enforcement officer" i did try to tell him that an enforcment officer had allready told me he had done that, and it was clear to see that as he had changed from address 1 to address 2 this surely shows that it is a single house. All i got was there is nothing can be done, i will get letters thretening action but i was simply to ignore them.

Obviously the result of this call changed the license back from address 2 to address 1, as i have this morning received a further threatening letter from TV licensing.

When i asked the enforcement officer if this happened a lot he said yes he had loads of cases where he has had to link address's as they had been "knocked through".

I am at the stage where i am going to refuse to open the door anymore, i have had enough, the worst part is the conversion work took place 3 years ago, how long does this need to go on for, the person we bought the house from said she had had troubles with TV licensing.

I think i am going to photocopy the letter and scrawl across it in large red marker THIS HOUSE HAS A TV LICENSE CHECK YOUR RECORDS PROPERLY

:mad: :mad:

Do i have a case for harrasment and threatening behavior, or should i let it go to court and show the courts just how incompetant they really are, i have no doubt at all that it would be thrown out immediatly on production of license and property deeds, i have tried this with licensing but they are taking no notice of me.

If advice is not to let it go to court is anyone able to draft up some sort of letter of official complaint, i am not good at wording things like this, and also dont know if there is any legal bits i could quote to them?

Help please

Ian

PUT IT ALL IN WRITING, send it to them, and make sure you send an copy of the letter to the OFT

No you don't have a case for harassment - but since they work on postcodes, if you contact Royal Mail and get them to remove the number from their PAF (Postcode Address File) due to it being a combined property, the additional address will cease to exist and TVL will not have an address to pursue you.

Of your sorry tale, after the enquiry agent asked if you had a licence (the firstr time) did he not ask for you to show it to him? This is standard practice before any unpleasantness kicks in.

yes he did ask to see it, but we werent sure were it was, he contacted licensing by phone in front of us who confirmed we had a license.

I am nor prepared to remove either postcode as both are address's on different streets, why should i have all the hassle of doing this just because TVL are unable to sort their files out

I have done nothing wrong, everything has been above boad, the house has two address's that it, i am not going to be penalised for TVLs inablity to carry out a simple task

Oh agreed - but I was in a similar situation, and the two things that we did that saved blood pressure all rouns was having the address remoived from the Council's Valuation database and the RM. All the duplication of junk mail, speculative billers (utilities etc) ended because the address ceased to exist. Bliss.

Even if the TVL weren't incompetent, there are plenty out there who still are!

I appreciate what your are saying, but all the utilities ect have it listed as one complete house, i use the address for the back house (Fox Street) for everything, so would be a complete pain changing everything from that to the much less worse sounding rochdale road lol, the only official thing registered in rochdale road is the mortgage and i certainly aint messing with that again lol

It is only the TVL who seem to not understand something which in essense is very very simple, and is resolvable simply by a few mouse clicks.

Hi

I know that you have proberly resolved the issue with TVL,

but consider the cost of havig to use premium rate numbers

to contact them.

I had simlar problems with utility companies, it costs extra to

contact them stating the same information.

However I discovered SAYNOTO0870.COM - Non-Geographical Alternative Telephone Numbers, and found

landline numbers for these idiots, saving a small fortune.

Hi

I know that you have proberly resolved the issue with TVL,

but consider the cost of havig to use premium rate numbers

to contact them.

Do TVL have a premium rate number then? I was always under the impression theirs was 0870.

Do TVL have a premium rate number then? I was always under the impression theirs was 0870.

Hello

Actually there is quite a misunderstanding of 0870 numbers.

They can be very expensive to call.

I was once in business with, ( who turned out to be), a rather shady individual and I learnt that he purchased an 0870 number from a company and put clients on hold for a few minutes and would be making money from it.

I believe it can cost about a £1 a minute!

If you have to ring them again, see if you can find an alternative number on SAYNOTO0870.COM - Non-Geographical Alternative Telephone Numbers or co.uk

Hello

 

Actually there is quite a misunderstanding of 0870 numbers.

They can be very expensive to call.

 

I was once in business with, ( who turned out to be), a rather shady individual and I learnt that he purchased an 0870 number from a company and put clients on hold for a few minutes and would be making money from it.

 

I believe it can cost about a £1 a minute!

You believe wrongly ... the fee was initially set equivalent to local and national rate calls for 0845 and 0870 respectively. The fees for the redirector numbers haven't changed noticeably but those for the 01 and 02 numbers have gone down in most cases and in some cases are free.

So they are more expensive to their geographical equivalents but strictly by definition they are not premium rate, as they do not begin 09 and do not require licensing by Icstis.

Admittedly slightly hair-splitting, but it really annoys me when people call them premium rate (because they aren't, even if they are more expensive than landlines on some packages).

hi Forrestchav

How right you are premium rate number begin with 09, however for some individuals on low income such as pensioners the fact that are being placed on hold when calling 0870 numbers generates increased cost.

I would be nice if people were to log on to SAYNOTO0870.COM - Non-Geographical Alternative Telephone Numbers as they have a petition about this matter, with the office of prime minister.

Maybe they should investigate changing to a package which includes 0870s then?

Ooh shock horror the day you have to pay to make a phone call. Seriously. I don't see the big deal with 7p a minute. If you're on 20 mins that is only £1.40.

HI

Forrestchav I think that 1.40 to a pensioner for a telephone cal is 1.40 too much,

Still we will have to agree to disagree.

I see forrest are doing quite well 44 points lets hope they keep up the momentum

Don't forget 0870 was set originally at an equal rate to your standard national rate calls. As the latter is now included in your inclusive minutes or free under some phone packages and the former isn't often then of course they're going to be expensive. I suppose it depends how much you're willing to pay for a 20 minute call. If it was 3p a minute (which used to be the ntl 02/01 national rate, no idea if it still is) for 20 mins then that would be about 60p. It's hard to predict the call costs these days due to the plethora of different rates and packages.

I don't see how one can expect not to pay for a phone call though - even if you have "free" calls my guess is the line rental or monthly fee will be upped to cover the cost of this (or no reductions on calls to mobiles, NGRs etc). The telcos still have equipment which you are using to make the call, and associated costs.

Unless they have since changed it I think it still costs me the same rate per minute to call a number from my mobile (barring evening and weekend concessions) - 01/02, 07, 0800, 0845, 0870... Yes, last time I checked 0800 numbers were chargeable. Thing is, they're not geared up to be and the companies treat them as a free call. Or used to, anyway.

(I'm still not convinced... We have 44 points but don't forget Leeds should have 15 more and win a lot of games late. Forest always seem to slump second half of the season as well, we need to not sell anyone in the window and buy a decent striker - Holt still doesn't convince me despite 2 goals on Saturday, Agogo is at the African Nations Cup, Tyson always seems to be injured... Time will tell but we do seem to be playing better this season.)

hi just came on this site to tell people that i had a tv licence which i used to pay all off. Then came the recession and I had to cut back like everyone else. I asked TV licensing can i pay my license in monthly instalments not by direct debit but by your cash payment plan. basically a card like a credit card which is registered to your address and you can pay off a set amount of money every month. I took this option. Where the first month i would pay something like £24 which would cover me for 2 months the 2nd month another 24 so I would be covered for 4 months until 6 months later I have paid off the whole years license. Sorted bobs not my uncle. Then I thought they will send me license request next year but lo and behold tv licensing send me a letter 6 months in advance and ask me to start paying for next years license SIX months in advance. Now under normal circumstances (no recession) i probably wouldn't have given it a second thought but these are tough times everyone is watching there pennies let alone their pounds.

So I harassed TV licensing and said to them that gas electricity & water do not ask for payment six months in advance so why should I pay you. TAKE ME TO COURT. I knew the courts will have throwed it back in their face as no organisation does this. I have succesfully kept my tv license payment card and pay the way I want to pay not letting them dictate how they want payment. i.e. one month pay for two 2nd pay upto 4 and so on until the 6th month I have paid for the whole years license which is the payment I heve adhered to and so should tv licensing rather than ask everyone payment 6 months in advance and make you feel like a criminal.

I strongly urge everyone out there to do exactly the same as what I have done and stop this daylight robbery. 30 million households businesses pay for their tv licenses. someone some where is making some serious money by taking money so much in advance. You can only win by giving this organisation a piece of there own medicine.

When they have asked you to pay for the next licence, you will only pay one month at a time so after 6 months you will only have paid 6 months licence. You will then receive the licence for 1 year but still owe 6 months so it works out you pay 6 months in advance and 6 months in arrears. You have to pay many things in advance such as car tax and car insurance, thats how some things work....quite normal and quite fair:-(.

i agree you have to pay for some things in advance. car insurance to keep you road legal and car insurance monthly/yearly to also keep you road legal. But not many people I bet pay there car insurance six months ahead before its due do they? NOT fair and NOT normal. Gas, Electricity & Water we might as well pay them off for the whole year. Council Tax might as well pay that off 6 months in advance to keep us legally council taxed. We don't because its just too much money. Well your tv license is still a considerable sum of money. I choose to pay the way I did the first time pay one month for two then pay again in the 2nd month for 4 until 6 months later you have paid for the whole year sounds like a fair deal to me. Does everyone agree? Thats the payment system I believe TV licensing should adhere to.

What you fail to appreciate is payment by installments is not a right, but a waiver. ON the assumption more people will pay up because making payments are made 'easier', then they are prepared to accept your part-payments providing you agree to their rules of engagement. If you do not, then the ability to pay in this way can be revoked and you have to do what the licence requires, pay in full for an annual licence.

Just because you or others believe a different system should prevail is your right, but by the same token, the BBC Trust is just as right to reject such a payment scheme as impracticable. I doubt they could arbitrarily withdraw the part-payment system because they didn't like it anymore - but all part payment schemes bring with it a cost, so if they introduce (as insurers do) a higher licence rate for those who do not pay anually, or provide a discount for those of us who do pay annually, the licence payer is in no position to object in any meaningful way. You play by their rules, or not at all.

I have merely pointed out the fact that I believe that taking license payments six months in advance are wrong rules or no rules. Car insurers may pay interest on monthly payments because they have no option. If they could I bet they would pay off the whole years insurance in full. Insurance companies still DON'T start taking payment 6 months in advance like the BBC Corporation. Tell me the name of any other company that does, please.

I do not believe the existence of a different system is my right. The existing system simply does not work in this climate. Unless someone can afford to.

This website was setup so people like us could voice our opinions and experiences and hopefully raise awareness of what is going on around us. The Government can make cuts. Do we as individuals have no right to control our expenditure within the boundaries of Law.

This website provides debate. The licence is a government tax, not a product. If you have the relevant equipment, you pay. If you don't you don't. It works the same as a Firearms licence. Just because you dislike the way they administer it, complain to your MP and get it changed. Wanting parity with an insurance company scheme is (frankly) perverse.

If you want to make a change, use the proper channels otherwise you're wasting your time.

Firstly I would like to point out I am still legally licensed to receive television broadcasts. No enforcement officer has or ever will turn up at my home because they have no need to as my license is up to date. THE WAY I WANT IT TO BE.

I paid my tv license for 2009 as follows October 2009 £20.40. November 2009 £20.35. December 2009 £20.35. January 2010 £20.35. February 2010 £20.35. March 2010 £20.35 and finally April 2010 £20.35. Totalling (142.50) This final payment covered me until October 2010. However like everyone else they sent me a schedule to pay in the following way 6 months in advance.

May 2010 £12.18. June 2010 £12.12. July 2010 £12.12. August 2010 £12.12. September £12.12. October 2010 £12.12. November £12.12. December £12.12. January £12.12. February £12.12. March £12.12. April £12.12.

Everyone else pays this off when they get a letter from tv licensing which isn't threatening in any way or form, but when I realised that I had still six months left on my license I simply refused to pay and can also succesfully tell YOU that I have received a new schedule to pay my TV license in the following way.

License for 2010/2011 payments are as follows. 28 November £24.25. 28 December £24.25. 28 January £24.25. 28 February £24.25. 28 March £24.25. 28 April £24.25. Totalling £145.50. I have written proof of this. If there was anyway I could put this on I would show it but unfortunately cannot.

I would also like to point out My license expired in October 2010. I made my first payment on 28 November 2010 so technically was unlicensed but since tv licensing asked for their first payment on November 28. I paid them on November 28th.

I don't need to complain to my MP because I don't need to. I AM paying the way I want to. I have used the proper channels to complain and next time if I get the BBC asking payment again six months in advance. I will take it to the next level.

Hope that answers every thing.

Actually it doesn't. You have a broadcast Recieving Licence, not a 'BBC' licence. The fact that one of the governments thought it was a good idea that as the BBC got 100% of the funding, they might as well collect it too, but that has nothing to do with your complaint. The fact that some droid working for Crapita has arranged a particular payment plan that you felt was unfair is hardly an issue for doubt. If they're (BBC) is outsourcing work to the lowest firm tendering for it, I have no doubt the situation will be as chaotic as you describe, however by all means complain to the BBC if you feel it'll do any good, but I know it'll be seen as a Crapita admin query and you're out the loop.

Your MP, however, is something the BBC Trust is very cagey about, especially if there is something that could be seen to be unfair or unreasonable. Avoid the monkey at all costs, as dealing with the organ grinder often brings the results you want to achieve.

ICY, you made one big mistake here and that was engaging with them at all.

You know you are on the right side of the law. Bin the letters without reading them (they are clearly marked as being from TVL on the envelope) and if you get anyone at your door claiming to be an inspector shut the door. Don't even engage in conversation with them. Not a single word.

These "inspectors" are powerless. It is not the BBC but a company hired by the BBC who earn commissions on sales (hence their forcefulness - they're glorified salesmen). Please do not help or assist them in any way. You should never have said you had a TV at the address but just shut the door on their face, knowing you have paid. If they try to take you to court then they end up with egg on their face and have to pay the expenses. Great!

Thank you everyone for their replies especially pmarmalade. Again I would like to point out here. I am still legally licensed. An enforcement officer from Capita shall only turn up at my doorstep if I wasn't. Any correspondence which was sent to these people was all with the traditional snail mail but hey I got a result. I am a firm believer in the Pen is greater than the Sword. I just hope that I am able to pass this on to all out there by every single mode of communication out there.

The TV licensing payment card scheme allows a licence to be paid for half in advance and half in arrears. That is, weekly or fortnightly payments totalling half the fee, are made while there are still six months left to run on a current licence, and the remaining instalments are made in the six months after the licence is issued.

Customers can join this scheme when they are unlicensed. They are asked to spread the cost of their first licence over 6 months, or 26 weeks. they are then in a position to pay for future licences over a year, half in advance and half in arrears as described above. This is what I disagree with.

The IRONY is that they say, " the amount of money that people pay on a TV licensing instalment scheme is detailed in LAW. We can only offer payment schemes that are IN LINE with the amounts and frequencies as stated in LEGISLATION". What rubbish. I just want to pay my tv licence the way they let you the first time. So I cancel my licence every six months and let it run the course of the 12 month period without asking for money back. Then I ring up on 01772552400 not some non geographical number or 0300 7906030 and get myself a new licence reinstated. Simples. Yours Truly.