Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.
The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights
a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.
I sent my initial letter from the template to First Direct in November along with my £10 fee. I got a reply within a week promising all statements would be sent by signed-for delivery and enclosing the £10 postal order I had sent to them, with explanation that they don't charge for providing the information.
However, it was several weeks before the statements arrived--just as I was on the verge of chasing them up.
With Christmas I wasn't able to devote sufficient time to beginning my claim proper but have now begun, today, with the preliminary letter drafted from the provided (and fantastic) templates. I removed the stuff relevant to default notices as I've never had any from First Direct--it's all bounced debits, overdraft fees.
I am going through my statements marking off any charges FD has made, and also making sure I deduct from the tally those charges that have been intermittently repaid in part (when this has happened, I have, for example, been given £30 back when complaining about £150 charges!). At no stage did I ever accept any partial repayments as anything approaching final settlement, nor did I make any promises not to pursue the remaining amounts. So I think I am okay there.
At the end of these calculations, I am sure I am going to have one heck of a shock both positive and negative. Negative, in that it's going to be a lot of money over the past three years I've had taken from the account; positive, in that I am now going to claim it all back.
I will keep this thread I have started updated so that I may be able to give others a sense of the timeline and any obstacles and encouragements I come across.
I would appreciate any and all helpful input, and want to thank everyone who contributes to and maintains this site.
Okay, I've done my calculations. It worked out just under £2,900 including interest to date. I won't use precise figures in case of banks monitoring.
I used the Standard overdraft Rate for Cheque Accounts, which is 18.37 per cent, to calculate interest. In my spreadsheet, I've got columns for the items, the charges per item, the interest, the charge plus interest, and a cumulative column. This means if they make any part-payments in an attempt to dissuade going for the full amount, I can easily total up from the earliest charges how many to remove as I go on to claim the rest outstanding.
I know to make it clear any part-payments will not be accepted as final settlement, and that only the item, charge per item, and interest column need go to the bank attached to the letter.
Now the letter has to go off tomorrow, signed-for delivery. And then it's wait and see. I will report back here as and when I have more news... x
Thanks so much! I got a standard form letter, I think, back today. It was from a 'Maureen Watson' in 'Credit Services Customer Relations'. It said:
***********************
Thank you for your recent letter.
I am sorry to learn of your concerns and I will ensure that a full investigation takes place. Please be assured that you will receive a response shortly, certainly within the next ten working days.
For your information, I have enclosed a copy of our leaflet 'listening to your comments', which provides further details about the bank's complaints procedure.
***********************
Now, they seem confused. I'm not making a complaint. I am neither assured nor do I care that she is sorry. And I am not interested in an investigation, that's for them if they want to do one. Put simply, I've made the demand for payment, in accordance with all the advice from this site, with the interest calculated correctly, with a clear 14 day deadline for the bank to respond to that letter properly and with a settlement offer.
They either do or they don't, in which case the next letter goes out giving them one more 14 day period.
No ifs, no buts, no B*S. Am I too harsh here? Am I missing anything?
The leaflet is a limp joke.
I take it I ignore this letter and keep the clock ticking down?
Thanks Claire. The goodwill on this site is amazing. I only hope I can be of such help to others over time.
I am posting the following link, to another section of the forum where I have been posting in relation to disability benefits being taken by the bank in respect of charges, leaving me with nothing to live on.
As it's a sideline from my primary action against FD, I thought it would be useful to cross-reference. My (currently) two posts on the benefit situation are (at time of writing) at the very end of that forum section, as there are lots of contributions thereon. x
I was forced into a corner by Nat west and they let me with no money to live on. These 'suits' dont live in the real world and seem completely devoid of all reality.
If you havent any alternative may I suggest you do as I did and open a Post Office Card account,get your money paid in there, this way you can be certain that you will recieve all your money. Phone the relevent DSS officies and until the post office ac is open they will pay by Giro This will give you some breathing space and if there are any payments imminent ask the DSS to recall them and tell them why you need to be paid by giro
I know that you have posted relevent info on other threads,the moderators can only help you properly if you keep all the posts to one thread. I hope I am of help to you
If You are on benefits you must read this
Social Security Administration Act 1992 Miscellaneous Certain benefit to be inalienable **
187- Subject to the provisions of this Act, every assignment of, or charge on-
(a)benefit as defined in section 122 of the Contributions and Benefits Act;
(b)any income-related benefit; or
(c)child benefit,
and every agreement to assign or charge such benefit shall be void; and, on the bankruptcy of the beneficiary, such benefit shall not pass to any trustee or other person acting on behalf of his creditors
I have a Smile account (Co-Op) which I could switch to having my benefits paid into, though I am quite prepared to send out fortnightly letters of appropriation to them to ensure (a) they don't keep doing this anymore and (b) are in clear line of fire for any action taken against them, if they choose to defy those letters. A part of me thinks, this will hopefully make them less inclined to abuse those on benefits in the future besides myself.
You are indeed of great help, and I am very grateful for your input, and everyone's. Thank you!
I know that you have posted relevent info on other threads,the moderators can only help you properly if you keep all the posts to one thread. I hope I am of help to you
The reason I cross-reference is because this is primarily the thread I created to deal specifically with my claim for all charges against FD - the other forum I am contributing to specifically because it's all about claiming back benefit payments wrongly taken, and that aspect of things is in many ways a separate issue. Benefits as such certainly don't come up in my preliminary approach letter, but rather charges overall.
So, FD charges claim in the FD section but benefits taken by FD in the benefits taken section, as it might help (and I might be helped by) others thereon with regard to that stuff.
Well, I got a response with an offer of final settlement yesterday from First Direct - they sent it on the very last day of the 14 day period following the first demand for payment sent to them.
They have offered me just over £1,600 but for that, I have to sign away my right to make further claim and accept it as final settlement. They enclosed a form for me to sign.
No way. My claim is for just over £3,000. So my question is, how do I respond to this offer? I know I don't sign, but how do I approach it? They make no reference to how the monies would be paid, or when.
Do I just ignore the letter and write the second? Or do I state that amount would be accepted as a partial contribution to the final settlement, and if the money is paid to me, I would deduct it from the balance claimed?
Any help would be appreciated as always! They certainly play sly but I'm surprised they've responded, to be honest, with an immediate offer albeit a derisory one. While admitting no liability, of course. What, they think I'm going to think I'm in the wrong and they're just going to give me money for writing to them?
Hi Fox - they did exactly the same to me. I'm after the same amount. Received a offer for £1600 after two weeks which I rejected and another offer for £1900 which again I rejected.
Go to this link it has the letter template you need and I used (twice!). http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...ng-offers.html
It's scary turning down money isn't it, but might as well get all your money back.
Dubliner
PS If this has been useful click the scales of justice below my name on the left
First Direct - S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent 29/12/06
Statements recieved 15/1/07 - >£3000 owed
Prelim sent 16.01.07
Partial offer received 01.02.2007
LBA and letter rejecting paltry offer sent 02.02.2007
MCOL filed mid Feb 07
AQ 26th March
BoS - S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent 29/12/06
Statements received 1.02.2007 - Prelim sent 02.02.2007
This happened to me too. I wrote back accepting as part payment and that I wanted the rest. I then sent my lba and they sent another letter offering me the full amount (just under £3000). All in all it took 5 weeks.
Hang on in there - you WILL get it all!
BM
PS If this has been useful click the scales of justice below my name on the left
This happened to me too. I wrote back accepting as part payment and that I wanted the rest. I then sent my lba and they sent another letter offering me the full amount (just under £3000). All in all it took 5 weeks.
Hang on in there - you WILL get it all!
BM
PS If this has been useful click the scales of justice below my name on the left
Hi everyone! First, let me start by saying thank you so much for your input, it's hugely appreciated.
It's good to know this £1,600 offer is pretty formula - I was worried after reading they usually offer 80 per cent, and their offer to me to date is less than that.
My letter before action is ready, as is my upwardly-revised statement (as other charges have gone on since the first one). I'm posting it Monday - only because the bank took all my disability benefits, aagh, and I don't have cash to send out a signed-for letter until then. Still, a few days won't be too long to wait...
dubliner10: Scary? Absolutely! It's very weird saying no to that kind of cash... And ta for the link!
Stornoway: My claim includes interest too, charged at their advertised authorised overdraft rate of 18.37 per cent. I think what they are saying to you is, um, BS basically. I read elsewhere on the site it is entirely legitimate in the eyes of the court to claim interest, and doing so on the authorised overdraft rate is considered reasonable - claiming the higher unauthorised rate would be seen as greedy and work against a claimaint.
The reason it's valid to claim interest is because of whenever they took the money. My claim spreadsheet calculates interest per item on that rate I quote about - for example, a £30 charge incurred three years ago would be a lot more in real terms today because of the interest you could have accrued on it were it not taken from you, than a £30 charge taken yesterday.
What stage are you at? I'd issue the claim. The only bit that confuses me on that stage - not having got there yet - is how we switch to 8 per cent, and why? As in, do we reach a point at which we stop calculating using the unauthorised overdraft rate, take that 'final' figure and then from that calculate 8 per cent of the total amount, including the interest we're claiming?
Sheesh. It's as confusing to write about as it is to understand!
Social Security Administration Act 1992 Miscellaneous Certain benefit to be inalienable **
187- Subject to the provisions of this Act, every assignment of, or charge on-
(a)benefit as defined in section 122 of the Contributions and Benefits Act;
(b)any income-related benefit; or
(c)child benefit,
and every agreement to assign or charge such benefit shall be void; and, on the bankruptcy of the beneficiary, such benefit shall not pass to any trustee or other person acting on behalf of his creditors
Yup Fox, thanks for the click, and good luck. I filed my MCoL today, time to sit back and wait now.
First Direct - S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent 29/12/06
Statements recieved 15/1/07 - >£3000 owed
Prelim sent 16.01.07
Partial offer received 01.02.2007
LBA and letter rejecting paltry offer sent 02.02.2007
MCOL filed mid Feb 07
AQ 26th March
BoS - S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) sent 29/12/06
Statements received 1.02.2007 - Prelim sent 02.02.2007
You certainly have. I'm now waiting on the end of the 2nd 14 day period, then I'm gonna file the MCOL faster than you ever see a policeman arrive at the scene of a crime, that's for sure!
I hope you dont mind me commenting but you have in past postings you have implied that you are on benefits.
If I am correct in my assumption then you may not have to pay for your court action, but this can only be done at your local Court not on line.
You will need a letter from the benefit people dated within the last 28 days showing what benefits you recieve and you will need a form N1, which can be downloaded from this site (dont forget both sides).
Then later on if you get to the aq stage this form cost normally £100 to submit, dont assume that you are covered by the letter you took in originally. You again have to prove that you are on benefits with a letter again dated within 28 days of your submission of documents.
It seems a bit more complicated than on line but it does give you much more room for your POC.
If You are on benefits you must read this
Social Security Administration Act 1992 Miscellaneous Certain benefit to be inalienable **
187- Subject to the provisions of this Act, every assignment of, or charge on-
(a)benefit as defined in section 122 of the Contributions and Benefits Act;
(b)any income-related benefit; or
(c)child benefit,
and every agreement to assign or charge such benefit shall be void; and, on the bankruptcy of the beneficiary, such benefit shall not pass to any trustee or other person acting on behalf of his creditors
Fox Mulder vs First Direct *** WON! ***
fees.
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Originally Posted by johnwilsonstorey
