Thread: mcuth v Egg ****won****

DPA letter sent 25/04/06 for:
1 x loan a/c
1 x credit card a/c

Will split threads accordingly when DPA details received

They have until 5th June to reply - bring it on!

Cheers

Michael

Similar Threads:

• mcuth v A&L pII ***WON***

In response to my DPA request of 25th April (which was delivered by special delivery on the 26th), yesterday I received a letter from Egg:

Dear {mcuth}

Your Data Subject Information Request

Thank you for your request for details of the personal data Egg holds about you. To enable us to process your request, please complete the enclosed form and return it to us along with one of the identification documents listed below, and the appropriate fee. In the case of joint accounts all the account holders (who must each provide a separate item of identification) must sign the form.

Identification
Any of the documents listed below may be used for this purpose:

• A bank, building society or credit card statement
• A store card or catalogue statement
• A utility bill

The document must be an original, not a photocopy, and dated within the last 3 months. It must show your full name or first initial and surname and your current address. All documentation will be returned to you. If you are unable to provide any of the above items, please attach a letter confirming your identity. This must be an original, typed on headed paper, dated within the last three months and authenticated with an official stamp if applicable. It should be from your employer, solicitor or other professional body or person.

Fee
There is a charge of £10 for this service. Please send a cheque made payable to Egg.

What information will be included in the Data Subject Information Request?
We ask you to complete the DSIR Application Form accompanying this letter, to help us provide you with the data that will be most helpful to you. Within the categories you select on the form, you will receive a copy of all personal data we hold about you on our computer or paper files, along with explanatory notes. This data may include, as applicable, the following Egg products:
Egg Savings Account
Egg Invest
Egg Card/Egg Card Blue
Prudential Banking loans and mortgages
Egg Loan
Egg Mortgage

Completion of the form is not compulsory and choosing not to do so does not affect your right to a copy of your personal data. If you do not intend to complete the form but still require a copy of your personal data, you should inform of us of this and provide details of the data you require, along with the £10 fee and identification documents. We will begin processing your request on receipt of your fee, identification documents and details of the data you require.

What information will not be included?
The following will not be included in the information you receive from Egg:

Recent transactional information for Egg Card and Egg Card Blue
Customers can access the previous 12 months' statements online, so we do not provide copies of statements issued within the last year as part of your DSIR. For other products, we may limit the amount of transactional information provided. If you have a query relating to transactions or statements, please contact our call centre on 08451 233 233 where one of our associates will be pleased to help you.

Recent E-mail Correspondence
Emails you send to or receive from Egg remain in your Secure Messaging inbox for a period of 90 days so we do not include them as part of our response to your DSIR. E-mails more than 90 days old will be provided if you have requested them on your DSIR application form.

{mcuth note: the following sections all have notes on where to get the information from, but as it's not relevant to the cc/loan stuff, I've not included it here}
Prudential Assurance
Egg Term Assurance/Critical Illness Cover
Egg home insurance
Egg motor insurance
Egg Travel Insurance
Mortgages with External Providers arranged through Egg
Card Protection Policy
Credit Reference Bureaux
Staff Files
CCTV Footage

What happens now?
On receipt of your completed form we will send you a letter of acknowledgement, return your identification documents and begin processing your request. We will provide your data within 40 calendar days of receiving your completed form and fee.

The data you receive will be in paper format. If you are visually impaired and require the data to be provided in Braille, large print or audio format, please let us know.

Yours sincerely

Personally signed, and they included a pre-paid envelope for the return too
(Happy to scan the form & letter in if it's wanted?)

They have noted on the form that they received the fee with my original request, so I don't need to include that. It's a bit strange really - they have my current address, which was on my DPA request, so why do they need ID and should I provide it? The DPA request also referred to the information I require, so why the form?

My initial thoughts on a reply include: I'm not going to fill in the form, send me the info I requested; The 40 days started when you received my initial request. Thinking that the ID required is unreasonable given that I'm at the same address on file - any thoughts?

Cheers

Michael

Originally Posted by thecornflake

I sent my DPA request using secure messaging on the website, which of course proves I am who I say I am. You could do this and just send them a message -

In reply to your letter of x/x/x I hereby confirm my identity and that I made a DPA on x/x/x. Because they promise to confirm a message recieved within 24 hours, this will not give them any extra time and save you a lot of bother.

Oooh now, that's a good point - thanks.
I'll try that one first.

Cheers

Michael

Ok, sent Secure Message tonight as follows:

Your reference: XXXXXXX

Dear Sir/Madam

Thank you for your letter of 26th April, in response to my Data Protection Act request dated 25th April.

Given that I sent my letter from the address that you have on file, signed it, provided the address that the accounts were opened at, and quoted both the loan & credit card numbers in the original letter, I see very little need to send further proof of identification. However, I trust that this Secure Message will provide proof enough of my identity to satisfy your needs.

My Subject access request was clearly laid out in my letter dated 25th April, along with the account numbers for the loan & credit card I held (for reference: Credit card XXXXXXXXXXXXX, Loan XXXXXXXX). As such, I expect you to provide this information as requested without the need for me to fill out your DSIR form.

May I remind you that the 40 days to respond under the Data Protection Act (1998 ) starts from the date you receive my request and payment, which was 26th April. You therefore have until 5th June to reply with the requested information.

Many thanks

Yours sincerely

{mcuth}

Let's see if that's enough for them

Cheers

Michael

Egg's reply to my Secure Message:

Subject Data Subject Information Request

Dear {mcuth}

We have 40 days to respond to your DSIR request after receiving confirmation of your payment and your signed letter.

Until we have this information we can't process your request.

Once we have this information we will process this within the 40 day timescale.

Please ensure you send back the all the required information asked for.

Regards

{name}
Internet Customer Services

Uhuhuhuh, so this is what they got back:

Dear {name}

You already *have* received my signed letter and payment - this was a perfectly valid request under the Data Protection Act and was delivered to your offices on 26th April. Your letter of 26th April confirms that payment was received with my initial request.

As I requested below, kindly confirm that the Secure Message will satisfy your identification requirements - especially given the additional information that I included in my original letter (note, the address I sent the letter from is the one you have had on file since I moved here in November 2004).

Kind regards

{mcuth}

I foresee an interesting exchange.....

Cheers

Michael

Grrrr, these people just don't get it - reply from Egg to my last SM:

Dear Jennie {mcuth: Jennie? WTF is Jennie?}

To be able to send out Data Subject Information we need to receive a completed form. I can see that the Data Subject Information Request form was sent to you on the 26th April 2006.

You'll need to fill in and sign the form and return this to us so that we can action your request.Thanks for your message, if you've any further queries please feel free to contact me again and I'll be happy to help.

Regards

{name}
Internet Customer Services

And here's my reply to them:

Firstly, my name is *not* Jennie!

Secondly, as you yourselves state in your letter, completion of the DSIR form is *NOT* compulsory and you request that I let you know what information I require if I'm not going to fill it in. As I have stated below, my original request letter covers this information in full and as such I see no need to fill in your DSIR form.

Thirdly, as I'm sure you can see below, my query is relating to the identification requirement. I do not see a need to supply identification when I have supplied the information that I have previousy done. I am using Secure Message to clarify that I am who I say I am and want your confirmation that this will suffice.

Please pass this on to someone that actually deals with DSIR/DPA, so that I can get a definitive answer - your continued obstruction of my request may result in a complaint to the Information Commissioner.

Many thanks

Kind regards

{mcuth}

I think the phrase rhymes with Clucking Bell

Cheers

Michael

Keep at it mate - Egg are scum, and their customer serivce is awful - I got through it by getting the BBC involved in my case and then they soon bucked their ideas up - Best of Luck.

Thanks guys - am keeping on at them...
Received the below via SM yesterday...

Dear Michael

I'm sorry that we referred to you with an incorrect name, this was a genuine mistake and I apologise on behalf of my colleague for this error Michael.

I'm very sorry about the delay with this and I can tell you that I've forwarded this onto the Data Subject Information Request team for them to deal with and they'll get a Data Subject Information Request sent out to you.

Thanks for your message.

Regards

{name}
Internet Customer Services

Cheers

Michael

Hi Angry Cat

Still awaiting their reply to my last SM - I just can't believe what a PITA they're being over it. Obviously just another attempt to obstruct & confuse......still, they're picking on the wrong folks here

Oh & yeah, my handscrawled envelope has the same on it


Cheers

Michael

Still no reply to last SM, so I feel like there's a nice stroppy letter being drafted.....

Cheers

Michael

My thunder got stolen! Because Egg had waited for a month to bank the cheque, I'd forgotten all about it and it bounced

Anyway, they sent a letter asking for a new cheque, even though the old one clearly says "PLEASE RE-PRESENT" in nice big letters So, new one sent today, along with a letter & copies of the SM exchange above, tacitly impying they're just stalling....

Cheers

Michael

Originally Posted by DazNorthants

Hey good news about the cheque bouncing - Now you can probably claim from your bank too - Ohhh dear.

Yup, will be doing that too

Egg wrote and said thanks for the replacement cheque, and that the info would be sent within 40 days. It seems that the replacement cheque bounced too while I was in hospital the other day (thanks A&L, &*^%ers). So, have written back to Egg saying please represent this time, and btw, your 40 days started when you received the original request & cheque (can you imagine how many organisations would delay banking a cheque for 6 months if cleared funds was the requirement?) - but with the cheque circumstances I'm prepared to accept 30th June as a new deadline.

Cheers

Michael

Amazingly, after all that hassle, in today's post I get a block of info from Egg
On first glance though, it doesn't appear to contain any info relating to my Egg Loan - only the Credit Card. Another letter coming up *sigh*

Cheers

Michael

Originally Posted by mcuth

On first glance though, it doesn't appear to contain any info relating to my Egg Loan - only the Credit Card. Another letter coming up *sigh*

Scrap that - I found the info further on in the pack.
Only £40 of charges in total though

Cheers

Michael

Prelim letter sent today by RM Special Delivery:

Account Servicing
Egg PLC
Point North
Brierley Hill
DY5 1LY

By Royal Mail Special Delivery

Dear Sir/Madam

Credit Card Account Number XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

REQUEST FOR REFUND OF CHARGES

My request
I am writing to ask you to refund the charges which you have levied from my account since inception. I now understand that the regime of fees which you have applied to my account in relation over limit, late payment and so forth are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent consumer regulations. If you say that they are not, then will you please demonstrate this by letting me have a full Breakdown of the costs to which you have been put by as a result of my breaches, in order to reassure me that your penalties really do reflect your costs.


I am of the view that your charges represent a penalty and are therefore unrecoverable at Common Law. In the Scottish case of Castaneda and Others v. Clydebank Engineering and Shipbuilding Co., Ltd. (1904) 12 SLT 498; the House of Lords held that a contractual party can only recover damages for actual or liquidated losses incurred from a breach of contract. This is also the position in English law: Wilson v Love [1896]; Dunlop Pneumatic Tyre Co Ltd v New Garage and Motor Co Ltd [1915] AC 79; Ford Motor Co v Armstrong [1915]; Bridge v Campbell Discount Co. Ltd [1962]; Murray v Leisureplay [2004].

Your charges do not reflect any actual loss; instead they appear to represent a lucrative profit-making scheme. In
particular, charges were applied after I entered into transactions without sufficient funds in my account and also when I have gone overdrawn without authorisation. The actual loss is the cost of automatically sending me a computer generated letter. I would respectfully submit that is valued at no more than 50 pence.

UK banks have recently given evidence to the House of Commons Treasury Committee on how bank charges are
calculated: "The costs are going to pay for all the people we have who pursue debt, collect debt, speak to customers and chase payments. The way these charges are arrived at is by taking these total costs and making some assumptions about the volume that is going to come through to arrive at the individual charges" (2nd report, 25 January 2005, paragraph 50).

Accordingly, the charges applied to my account are not a reasonable pre-estimate of your loss in relation to my account. No-one has had to look at my account or telephone me. No one has had to collect anything. Your
charges would appear to represent a device to recover global losses (for example, loan defaulters, bad debt write off, including commercial lending in, and outwith, the UK).

On a separate note, your charges appear to represent an unfair term of contract which is contrary to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (SI. 1999/2083). My account falls within the scope of Regulation 5 of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 as I am a consumer. Your charges constitute an unfair
penalty under reference to paragraph 1(e) of schedule 2 of the said regulations:
‘Indicative and non-exhaustive list of terms which may be regarded as unfair - 1. Terms which have the
object of effect of - (e) requiring any consumer who fails his obligation to pay a disproportionately high
sum in compensation’.

0n 26 July 2005, the OFT stated that 'a charge is likely to be disproportionately high if it is more than a court would
be likely to award if the lender sued the cardholder for breach of contract'. Because your charges include a large
profit margin, in addition to actual loss, they are unrecoverable as an unfair term in contract. I believe that your
charges require me to pay a disproportionately high sum in compensation for incurring transactions which were
ultimately declined by an automated computer system. In addition, it is unfair to require me to subsidise your global debt recovery costs and debt write-off.

It has now been confirmed that your particularly high level of penalties are considered to be unfair per se by the OFT who reported on the 5th April 2006 and are therefore presumed to be unlawful in the absence of specific proof to the contrary..

Your responsibilities
I would draw your attention to the terms of the contract which you agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law.

I am frankly shocked that you have operated my account in this way as I had always reposed confidence in your integrity and expertise as my fiduciary. I consider that your repeated representations that your charges are fair and reasonable are deceptive and that they have deceived me into agreeing to pay them. Your concealment of the true nature of your charges has prevented me from asserting my right until now

What I require
I calculate that, as at today’s date, you have taken a nett total of £40.00. As advised in my DPA request, I am also reclaiming the statutory £10.00 DPA fee. This makes a total of £50.00. I request that you refund this amount in full and enclose a schedule of the charges which I am claiming with this letter.

Targets to resolve this matter
I hope that you will enter into a sincere dialogue with me about this matter and write on the assumption that you will prefer to do this rather than merely respond with standard letters and leaflets.

You have 10 working days, from receipt of this letter (i.e. by Wednesday 5th July 2006), to reply unconditionally accepting my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive payment.

If you do not respond, or do not respond positively, within this time period, I shall send you a further letter before action allowing a further 10 working days in which to reflect. I believe that these targets are more than sufficient for a large company such as yours with dedicated staff and departments.
After that will be no further communication from myself and I shall issue a claim at the expiry of the second deadline.

I look forward to hearing from you by return.

Yours faithfully,

Cheers

Michael

Recieved letter today "We've received your complaint". "I'm sorry that you have had to complain to us....blah blah blah.....Financial Services Authority....blah blah blah.....4 weeks...blah blah blah.....unable to resolve within 8 weeks.....blahhhhhhhhhhh"

Aye, like you're getting that long

Cheers

Michael