Marc Gander - The Consumer Survival Handbook


A 220 page introduction to all things consumer related by our own BankFodder.

Includes energy companies, mobile phone providers, retailers, banks, insurance companies,debt collection agencies, reclaim companies, secondhand car sellers, cowboy garages, cowboy builders and all the rest who put their own profits before you.

£6.99



Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)


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  1. #21
    Basic Account Holder D P Dance Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    You were prepared to pay 181 + VAT before so why not now?


    Where did I say that? In any case that figure included vat.


    Bear in mind that locksmiths undergo training of between a few days and less than a year. It is hardly rocket science.


  2. #22
    Basic Account Holder 416GSi Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    I see that there are three issues here, admittedly connected, but need to be treated separately.

    First potentially criminal behaviour , the OP claims that he/she was threatened by this locksmith. This an issue surrounding Criminal Law, as such is not a Civil issue. Report the alleged instance to the police and let them sort it out.

    Secondly the issue of I am now negotiating a further discount on the basis that, if I make a complaint to the Police about Reading locksmith's threats it could hurt their business. My view is that this is unethical and potentially criminal behaviour on the part of the OP, and he/she should cease this course of action immediately. Irrespective of the alleged action of the locksmith, to try and extort money or services through the use of threats is in breach of Section 21 of the Theft Act 1968.


    Finally the OP refusal to pay for worked carried out by this locksmith. As the OP, by his/her own admission did not have a quote prior to commencement of work I see that there he/she has little choice but to the pay the invoiced amount in full. If payment is not made a can see that the OP would be taken to court, which would likely increase the overall liability as costs would most likely be incurred.


  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    You are being naughty, I mentioned plumbers as an analogy.
    Ohh, after I posted I wondered if autocorrect had changed a mis-spelling of "owner" to "plumber", but you have confirmed that wasn't the cause.

    You've "used plumber as an analogy"?

    Funny that, it looked like you were describing the events again, but slipped and made up "plumber" instead of saying "locksmith".

    Why would you even need to use an analogy when you say you were describing actual events............. that doesn't make sense, and as Judge Judy says ............

    Are you sure it is me being naughty?. People can make up their own mind.


  4. #24
    Basic Account Holder D P Dance Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    Thank you GSi416, (Rover?) I agree with para 2 it was unethical and I have decided to report the matter to the police and inform Trading Standards.

    My position is, if chummy rejects my offer of 140.00 IFAFS I shall pay a lesser amount (s ay 125) into his bank account and he can sue me for the balance if it wants to. I am no stranger to the CC and my hobby is helping people battle the private parking cowboys. I very much doubt that HH will view his behaviour with approval.


  5. #25
    Royalties Account Holder ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    worse than that, if it is viewed as a B2B matter the court may well decide the OP's behaviour is enough to grant a full coats recovery order and will certainly take the contract at face value as agreed at the outset. If the locksmith is reading this thread then your record in court is about to change
    If the OP was a little old lady with a problem I would be amongst the crowd baying for the blood of the locksmith but if you are in business then you cant afford to be "too busy" to miss the vital details that save you or cost you dear. The behaviour of the locksmith after the event is though, irrelevant.
    Quote Originally Posted by Consumer dude View Post
    I see it like this. You asked some one to do a Job, they do the job, you don't like the price. A court might take the view that you, by accepting the work to be done, you have agreed the final invoice irrespective if you knew what the amount would be.



  6. #26
    Basic Account Holder 416GSi Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    Yes guilty I’m a Rover enthusiast.

    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    ...My position is, if chummy rejects my offer of 140.00 IFAFS I shall pay a lesser amount (s ay 125) into his bank account .....
    Why a lesser amount to your proposed settlement? The courts would look unfavourably on you with this course of action.

    ......into his bank account .....
    Why into his bank account? In my view you would be better sending him a cheque for the amount your proposing with the condition if he presents the cheque he is accepting that amount in Full and Final Settlement.

    ......I very much doubt that HH will view his behaviour with approval.
    From what you say this is a B2B issue. The courts won't intervene to the value of work done. Sorry for you but ericsbrother and Consumer Dude are correct on this one.


  7. #27
    Basic Account Holder D P Dance Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    As HMRC do not recognise small landlords as a business for tax purposes, a court is unlikely to either.


    I very much doubt if chummy will take me to court over a few pounds, in any case the police or TS may save him the bother.


    Also he appears to be unfamiliar with the process, I sent him a letter marked "without prejudice" and he accused me of being prejudiced. He is also unlikely to be able to produce a compliant LBA without legal assistance. I do not think that, with his rapsheet, CPR27.14(2)(g) costs are likely.


    Why a lesser amount? Perhaps not, perhaps a fiver more, and a cheque in full and final settlement is a good idea, let us see if he has the cojones to return it uncashed, but not until I have received a letter from a DCA. .


  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    As HMRC do not recognise small landlords as a business for tax purposes, a court is unlikely to either.
    The court can reach its own decision, and isn't bound by HMRC's opinion.

    You own several properties, engage tradesmen several times a year to them, and have traded for 40 years (according to your own posts).
    If it looks like a duck, quacks, and waddles when it walks : chances are it's a duck.
    Sounds like a business to me, and the court can reach the same conclusion.


  9. #29
    Basic Account Holder D P Dance Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    Of course letting properties is s business, but HMG do not think so. I am taxed on SA and the properties are not incorporated into the company. I suggest that it is a platypus.

    In any case would chummy pass the "clean hands" test?.


  10. #30
    Basic Account Holder 416GSi Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    Of course letting properties is s business, but HMG do not think so...
    No....HMRC might take that view (I've not checked so can't confirm), that does not mean the the independent courts have the same view.

    In any case would chummy pass the "clean hands" test?.
    Could be irrelevant if not directly linked to the case.

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  11. #31
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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    ....I very much doubt if chummy will take me to court over a few pounds...
    I'm not clear why its worth your time either.


    ....Also he appears to be unfamiliar with the process, I sent him a letter marked "without prejudice" and he accused me of being prejudiced...
    Now that is funny!

    ....He is also unlikely to be able to produce a compliant LBA without legal assistance...
    Thats not difficult he only needs to Google LBA and he will get loads of templates.


  12. #32
    Basic Account Holder sgtbush Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    I fear its going to be 5 and 1 if you go to court...
    In all honesty I hope the locksmith does take you to court by your answers on here


  13. #33
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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    You were prepared to pay 181 + VAT before so why not now?


    Where did I say that? In any case that figure included vat.


    Bear in mind that locksmiths undergo training of between a few days and less than a year. It is hardly rocket science.
    Not sure why I received no further notifications regarding this post so apologies for the delayed reply.

    My mistake, 181 incl VAT, but the point in my post remains...

    Quote Originally Posted by D P Dance View Post
    That afternoon he phones me, office has reduced the cost to 181 including v.a.t.
    Ask for an invoice. Invoice arrives next day for 254.00

    Query this with head office, (a one man micro company), and next day they send a revised bill for 181.
    So you asked for a 181 invoice after the alleged threats he made, (eventually) got a 181 invoice, but now want to pay 140... or 125... or some other amount.

    Again, anything else is just handbags... In your first post you said when he was going to charge you 281 and you asked for a VAT invoice which is when he turned nasty... Nastiness aside - were you ever going to pay the 281 if he sent you the VAT invoice?

    In any event you got him down by 100 to 181 and are now, for want of a better word, extorting him for a further discount...

    My suggestion - pay the 181 and get on with your life.


  14. #34
    Basic Account Holder PIXeL_92 Novitiate



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    Default Re: Ripped off by Locksmith

    "I complain to the company and the customer service chappie sends (to the wrong address), an insulting reply saying they are not charging me and offering 15% discount on future work (as if)." - https://uk.trustpilot.com/users/55b2...00ff0001cf0f1b

    Looking at your other review and replies in this thread you seem to think the world owes you something, you need to grow up and get a grip. An insulting reply ? They aren't charging you and offering you a discount for a mistake that in all honesty has probably cost you nothing. What is more insulting is the way you treat these people that are trying to do a job you have asked them to do. As others have said just pay the 181 and stop with the small willy waving thinking you are the better man, because from here you just come across as a complete and utter fool.



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