it was business to business

Doh!!!

doh what????

what's going on here??

Consumer rights act..

not Business to business

a business is not a consumer.

court route I think

ok-but what laws do i have to back me up. i know i have to go to court because they arent providing a refund as explained. what laws do i have to support my claim?

retitled and moved to general legal forum.

contract law?

Is this connected with your thread last month?

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?476178-How-to-sue-someone-that-won-t-receive-physical-mail-and-won-t-acknowledge-receipt-of-emails&p=5012394#post5012394

HB

I don't know whether it is the same company and set up. But there is an agency that advertises that they have celebrities who will provide media such as an online video wishing someone happy birthday or mentioning a companies business.

The agency does not seem to represent the celebrities at all or the arrangement is not fully committed to. They take the booking and they might get the celebrity to do a quick video on a mobile phone. But it is not really the celebrity actually promoting a companies business or endorsing their product/services. They are simply getting paid a small fee by the agency and providing a video clip that lasts seconds. There is no guarantee that the content of such videos will be beneficial to the business being mentioned.

Is this what the complaint is about ?

No. It wasn't about the result. It was about the fact that they did not post in the way that was agreed in emails.

They posted something, it was incorrect, I told them they need to correct it, they removed the post, then said they was report correctly the next day, they didn't do this, instead they posted a competitor product, people were commenting that they were confused about whether she liked the competitor product or ours, all credibility was lost. In the meantime, the agent said they will not post exactly as agreed and that they never do that, I said well you should have said that from the start instead of agreeing to something you were never going to adhere to. Then I said that I have no confidence that you will actually do what was promised even if you repost, so I want a refund. In addition, a repost would not have been as effective now because she had by now posted about 3 different products that do the same thing, claiming each was her "go to" brand for that thing-which is obviously ridiculous. This was all in the space of a few days.

I had then reached the end of my teather and requested a refund due to the fact that I had no idea what they were going to post and when because they failed to keep their promises numerous times now.

Can someone sort this please???

If you want people to comment on the contract with the agency, then post up a copy of the contract with any personal details removed.

If the contract specifies an exact action of performance and this was not done, then send a letter before action to whoever you had a contract with, stating a breach of contract. But it must be very clear that the breach happened or no point issuing a court claim. These contracts normally are written in a way that is pretty vague. The celebrity endorser is probably not that interested and is half hearted in taking a fee from the agency.

I don't think you have any particular statutory protection. This is just a breach of contract question. If you wanted to get any money back you'd have to prove that the services provided were not as agreed.

Do you actually have an express statement from the agent stating that the celeb would post exactly what you requested? If not, I struggle to see how you have a claim.

There is a statutory requirement for services supplied by a business to be performed with reasonable care and skill under http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1982/29, but I'm not sure how helpful that would be here.

there is no "official signed contract". it was all in emails. it was essentially me requesting what i wanted done very explicitly, then the agent saying "yes ok we can do this". it was pretty much that simple. it then got messy when the post was done and it wasnt done as agreed, then the agent said that she didnt agree to what was a agreed although its all very clear in emails. it was as if she was agreeing to things without really even reading what she was agreeing to.

Emails can form the basis of a contract.

You would need to post up copies of all emails with personal info and email addresses etc removed, so people could comment. If you don't want to do this, then i am not sure what can be said that has not. If it is clear that the agency has not delivered on what you paid them for, then send to their registered address a letter before action stating breach of contract reason, requesting the fee paid to be refunded. I don't think you can sue for more than the fee, if what was done was not helpful to your business.

ok will post up emails a bit later, thanks!

pleases see pdf attached.

read from the bottom up to read it in chronological order.

email chain to post.pdf

What is missing, is what happened before 11th of March. The communications about what was being offered. This is the crucial bit.

The PDF you have posted is organising the promotion activity and follow up when it went wrong.

And very important is information about what the agency is claiming about this celebrity relationship with the agency. I am not sure the agency has any contract with the celebrity. It is simply a case of the agency saying they have a relationship with x celebrities, they are approached by companies to promote x products and they then try to get the celebrity to post on social media for a fee. Now i suspect that many of these celebrities refuse to do it. Those that do might not really want to, but if they have a chance of earning £xxx for 10 minutes work, then they might take a chance. But if they get it wrong, they are not bothered about doing anything more.

Post up the missing info about their exact 'offer' as that is key.

Well I won't ever be able to get my hands on any contract the agent has with the celeb.

Regarding what was offered. It was "a post on Instagram"-the detail of which was to be clarified later (as you can see being done via email).

The agency say they manage the celeb-there no doubt about that. There is no indication to the contrary.

Well I won't ever be able to get my hands on any contract the agent has with the celeb.

 

Regarding what was offered. It was "a post on Instagram"-the detail of which was to be clarified later (as you can see being done via email).

 

The agency say they manage the celeb-there no doubt about that. There is no indication to the contrary.

You don't need the agency contract with the celebrity and i personally doubt it exists. You probably have enough with the instagram, emails, agency advert and payment of a fee to the agency to prove a contract existed.

Up to you what you do. I don't think i would pursue, as even if you got a CCJ against them, you might not get paid the agency fee back and costs of issuing court claim. Does this agency have an office with any assets that could be taken by enforcement agents if they refused to pay you ?

It you want to issue a court claim, you need to send a letter before action to the agencies registered address, stating a breach of contract in not ensuring the service was delivered as promised. I doubt they will respond and if you want to proceed then you issue a court claim using MCOL. The particulars of claim would be straightforward, that you the claimant paid the defendant a fee of £x for their celebrity client to post a recommendation for your companies products on social media and the defendant breached the contact in not ensuring their celebrity client satisfactorily fulfilled the contract. ( warning, i am not an expert on this, so do get advice about exact wording you might use)

BUT do make sure that it is 100% clear that the celebrity did not post what was asked. If they posted something about your companies product, even if they got it wrong, it might be enough.

Well yes they did post something. But it was not correct or as agreed with the agent as you can see in the emails. Why would them just posting anything be enough? I prescribed something, they agreed-surely they have to stick to what was agreed. And if they did something significantly different then there should be a refund no?

It is never straightforward. If it is open for someone independent ( Judge) to consider that the agency did enough to justify their fee, then you might not get the whole fee refunded or your claim would be totally rejected. They might decide that your product having any mention by this celebrity on social media would be enough.

I think it is a mistake to pay celebs in this way to mention a companies products. If they don't believe in or use the products, then they won't be committed and worse they might go on to mention later all of your competitors products. I bet you did not gain anything in writing saying this celeb should not mention or endorse a competitors products within x time period.

"I bet you did not gain anything in writing saying this celeb should not mention or endorse a competitors products within x time period." correct about this.

however my argument to this would be that the celeb is not the same as the one i paid for in their status/perception of them by the public-which is of course the only reason to use a celeb for promo. i'm not paying her for anything else. if she says 3 days in a row that she uses 3 different products for the same thing and each of them is her fav, all credibility and therefore influence is lost.

if nothing at all, they posted incorrectly-something was prescribed by me at their requested, they agreed, they did not follow through and it was significantly different. and on top of this, the other products were promoted which meant zero credibility.

that would be my main arguement

"I bet you did not gain anything in writing saying this celeb should not mention or endorse a competitors products within x time period." correct about this.

 

however my argument to this would be that the celeb is not the same as the one i paid for in their status/perception of them by the public-which is of course the only reason to use a celeb for promo. i'm not paying her for anything else. if she says 3 days in a row that she uses 3 different products for the same thing and each of them is her fav, all credibility and therefore influence is lost.

 

if nothing at all, they posted incorrectly-something was prescribed by me at their requested, they agreed, they did not follow through and it was significantly different. and on top of this, the other products were promoted which meant zero credibility.

 

that would be my main arguement

It is now up to you to decide to pursue it or not.

I don't think you will gain satisfaction from such action. You might gain a CCJ by default, if they don't bother to defend any claim. But getting paid may well not prove easy.

These promotion agencies probably don't have any contracts with these celebs. Those that agree to the work and fee offered by the agency, are highly unlikely to just add a tweet or other social media entry word for word as instructed. I suspect they deliberately added the other entries about other products, because they are not that bothered.

Why is whether they have a contract with the celeb something that matters to me? Surely that's their issue. If they can't fulfil a promise, they shouldn't make one.

Why is whether they have a contract with the celeb something that matters to me? Surely that's their issue. If they can't fulfil a promise, they shouldn't make one.

It matters only in so far as, the agency is unlikely to have much influence over performance of what they are offering. They tried, the celeb has not fully played ball and there is b*gger all they can do about it.

If the agency defended the court claim, they will say that the celebrity did perform promotion activity on social media and there was no breach of contract.