Hello

I hope you can help please.

I signed as a guarantor for my daughter on a property share in June 2014, there were 5 tenants and each had their own guarantor.

The claim is for unpaid rent of £1261.82, £3206 for cleaning, repairs and damages + admin fees, court costs & interest totalling £5127.

The contract stated that each guarantor was jointly and individually responsible for each tenant.

My daughter did not owe any outstanding rent (well documented), the home was not very well looked after but I feel the £3k+ figure highly exaggerated, most damage was caused by cats none of which belonged to my daughter. The security deposit of £100 each was retained by the landlord.

The claim form says the date of service is 21st March and the particulars of the claim states: Particulars of Claim (attached)(to follow).

I am not and have no way of being in touch with the other guarantors though the claim form appears to have been served to at least two other parents.

Do I need to respond within 14 days or await further information?

What would be the best defence in this situation?

All advice gratefully received

The contract stated that each guarantor was jointly and individually responsible for each tenant.

Do you mean 'Jointly and Severally liable" as guarantors for all the tenants?. Were the tenants themselves also jointly and severally liable?.

If so, the claimant can go after any one (or more) of the guarantors for all of the debts due from any of the tenants, and then let the guarantors sort it out between themselves.

If jointly, but not severally (as guarantors) : the sum owed gets divided equally between the guarantors.

Thanks for replying.

Do you mean 'Jointly and Severally liable" as guarantors for all the tenants?. Yes Were the tenants themselves also jointly and severally liable?. and yes

Thanks for replying.

 

Do you mean 'Jointly and Severally liable" as guarantors for all the tenants?. Yes Were the tenants themselves also jointly and severally liable?. and yes

So, if (and it is a big IF), the money is due, the claimant can go after any of the guarantors, if the guarantee is enforceable.

Next step: await the PofC.

Then post up (personal details redacted) a copy of the tenancy, a copy of the guarantee, and a copy of the PofC.

Any might present a viable defence / way to find a flaw in the claim.

Thanks again so I definitely don't need to respond yet despite that there are some PofC stated and it says both (attached) and (to follow)?

Assuming there are no issues of jurisdiction (so all parties are in England / Wales, for example) you should acknowledge service.

You then submit a defence later (watching the dates : if the full PofC doesn't come through you note this in your defence!)

Odd that it says both (attached) and (to follow). Was this Money Claim Online (MCOL)?

Have they reached the character limit so are sending the full PofC separately?

Was the brown envelope from northants or Salford court?

Probably wise to scan and upload a copy of the N1 claim form (redacted)...then we have all the information in one post.

Also a copy of the tenancy agreement and your Guarantor authority

Regards

Andy

Thread moved to General Legal Issues

Thanks. envelope is from Salford.

I will redact docs and post today though I don't have the former I signed.

I did it have it previously but this was so long ago I thought it was settled with security deposit

This is the claim form and this is the signed agreement.

I don't have a copy of the form I signed though I think it was the same as this.

agreement.pdf

salford claimform.pdf

the date of service is today - your first step is to acknowledge the proceedings.

The Court Form is N9 (response pack) and there should be a copy included with the Court Papers.

There will be a tick box asking you if you wish to defend the whole claim

- I presume from the above that you do.

Complete this form, scan and send to the Court by email - [email protected] - put in the subject line "[Claim No as per claim form] - AOS".

This will give you further time to prepare the defence - until the 18th April 2017 by my calculation...

Without filing that document at Court, by my calculation you have until 4th April 2017 to file a Defence.

" I don't have a copy of the form I signed though I think it was the same as this. "

Well thats the one the whole claim relies upon.....without proof of that with your signature...their claim against you falls flat.

Andy

" I don't have a copy of the form I signed though I think it was the same as this. "

 

Well thats the one the whole claim relies upon.....without proof of that with your signature...their claim against you falls flat.

 

Andy

Does that mean there is no signed guarantee?

Or just that the OP hasn't kept their copy of it, but the claimant might!

Does that mean there is no signed guarantee?

 

Or just that the OP hasn't kept their copy of it, but the claimant might!

CPR 31.14 request may reveal one...put them to proof...unless the OP unearths his own copy

I did sign a guarantor agreement identical to main agreement but do not have a copy. Shall I request this from the rental company?

Thanks so much for your advice so far, I really appreciate you taking the time.

You will have to request it using CPR 31.14...link below...although you will have to adapt it to suit your claim as its been drafted for loans and credit cards.

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?387484-LEGAL-CPR-31.14-Request-Request-for-information-when-a-Claim-has-been-issued.

The OP says theirdaughter paid all her rent and wasn't responsible for the damage to the property.

Due to the joint and several liability issue could they consider claim for contribution or indemnity from the other guarantors if held liable? Or perhaps consider a small settlement offer to try and extricate themselves from this claim at an early stage...

The OP says theirdaughter paid all her rent and wasn't responsible for the damage to the property.

 

Due to the joint and several liability issue could they consider claim for contribution or indemnity from the other guarantors if held liable? Or perhaps consider a small settlement offer to try and extricate themselves from this claim at an early stage...

They certainly could claim a contribution / indemnity, but that leaves the OP chasing the other potential defendants, not the claimant having to do so.

They could also offer a settlement in return for being "let off the hook".

However, if the claimant has a weak case : they might not get anything at all, and if they have a strong case : why would they settle for a small sum?

It is early days - better to get an idea of the strength of the claimants case first?

OK, I'm about to acknowledge the claim, do you recommend that I accept no liability at this stage? If this is the case do I need to complete details of my financials?

Is it a good idea to accept 1/5 of the claim for damage and offer this?

In the worst case scenario is there any way that I can avoid a CCJ?

Also the CPR 31.14 request - there are no solicitor details on the claim, this part is blank. Where do I send the request?

To the claimant...I would be defending all this claim ...irrespective at this stage..anything less will result in a CCJ

Thanks Andy

I have submitted AOS.

I have altered the CPR31.14 request as follows, do you mind telling me if this looks ok?

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest all of your claim.

Please treat this letter as my request made under CPR 31.14 for the disclosure and the production of a verified and legible copy of each of the following mentioned in your Particulars of Claim:

1: The agreement as signed by The Tenants

2: The agreement as signed by guarantors

3: Copies of the letters sent and details of who they were sent to and when as mentioned in the particulars as “By letters and telephone calls from The Claimant requesting payment, The Defendants have not paid the arrears, leading to notification of litigation to the Defendants.”

4: Details of the time telephone calls were made and who was spoken to as mentioned in the particulars as “By letters and telephone calls from The Claimant requesting payment, The Defendants have not paid the arrears, leading to notification of litigation to the Defendants.”

5: A full breakdown of arrears and full details of which tenant each arrear pertains to

6: A full and clear breakdown of cleaning, repairs and damages totalling £3206.10 Including photographic evidence and receipts.

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 31 duties and ensure that the document(s) I have requested are disclosed at your earliest convenience. Your CPR 31 duties extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for the originals of the documents I have requested, the better for you to be able to verify the document's authenticity and to provide me with a legible copy. Further, where I have requested a copy of a document, the original of which is now in the possession of another person, you will have a right to possession of that document if you have mentioned it in your case. You must take immediate steps to recover and preserve it for the purpose of this case.

Where I have mentioned a document and there is in your possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

In accordance with CPR 31.15© I undertake to be responsible for your reasonable copying costs incurred in complying with this CPR 31.14 request.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request please confirm this in your response.

Yours faithfully

My daughter has just 'found' an email from a solicitor instructed by another tenant last year to the claimant and my daughter is CC'd. They are asking the landlord for a check out report or inspection form and also an incoming and outgoing schedule of condition, neither of which are forthcoming so I will request this also in CPR as item 7.

Solicitor also notes that maintenance/cleaning company is owned by letting company. Is this allowed? Should I bring attention to the fact?

Thanks Andy. Feeling more positive now

Can I ask a question please? If any of the other defendants no not acknowledge the claim will judgement be entered against them automatically and would that mean I am off the hook?