Marc Gander - The Consumer Survival Handbook


A 220 page introduction to all things consumer related by our own BankFodder.

Includes energy companies, mobile phone providers, retailers, banks, insurance companies,debt collection agencies, reclaim companies, secondhand car sellers, cowboy garages, cowboy builders and all the rest who put their own profits before you.

£6.99



Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)


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  1. #1
    ilx ilx is offline
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    Default PCN Validity

    Hi everyone, I've recently received a PCN from Camden council on 17/03/17 at 22:45 for briefly stopping at a bus stop to pick somebody up.
    My query is whether or not the PCN is valid on the grounds that the field entitled "Make and colour" has been printed as "Unknown NOT STATED"
    All other information like vehicle registration, time, date and place seems to be correct, supplied with still images taken from video footage.
    According to this website
    trafficpenaltytribunal.go v.uk

    "The relevant traffic regulation order (TRO) is invalid
    There has been a procedural impropriety by the council
    This means the council have not complied with the relevant regulations. For example:
    the penalty charge notice or another document did not give the required information."

    I'm not sure if the make and colour is regarded as "required information" if the vehicle registration has been provided.
    Has anybody else encountered something like this before ?
    Any help will be gratefully appreciated!


  2. #2
    Gold Account Holder Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative



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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Colour of vehicle is not required but I believe 'make' is. Unless there is a reason why 'unknown' was selected - eg, is it a kit car?


  3. #3
    ilx ilx is offline
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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Thanks for your reply Jamberson, no it's not a kit car, it's a standard Toyota Prius
    Sorry for the late reply, i think there is a delay on the site as your message appeared recently as i have been refreshing page since my post.

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  4. #4
    Royalties Account Holder ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative ericsbrother Authoritative



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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    how is the bus stop marked out? Some are an absolute no stopping and others arent, just no parking, which is different. the paintwork and signs will determine which is which.
    The identification is needed in case you challenge the ANPR's accuracy in picking out your reg number so if the car on the CCTV is say obviously a Morgan 4+4 then it is likely that an error has been made as you have a Prius. However, as you recognise the incident that isnt going to be arguable.


  5. #5
    ilx ilx is offline
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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Here is a copy of the actual PCN, showing images of the alleged contravention.
    I think the state of the PCN accurately reflects my mood at the time!
    tinypic.com/r/jacgp2/9


  6. #6
    ilx ilx is offline
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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Thanks for your reply ericsbrother, i believe that there is no stopping at the bus stop in question, hopefully the image provided helps.


  7. #7
    Gold Account Holder Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative



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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    If you turn up nothing else, and even if you do, I would appeal on the fact that 'make' is not stated. I believe it's a requirement, so if the CEO left it blank, then he/she's not completed the PCN correctly.


  8. #8
    Basic Account Holder Oddfellow Novitiate



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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Does an ANPR operator count as a CEO? Would the operator be able to identify any model of car from all angles? That said, it should be on the data supplied by DVLA, shouldm't it?


  9. #9
    ilx ilx is offline
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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Thanks for your replies everyone!
    I have decided to appeal the PCN on grounds of Procedural impropriety as they have not fulfilled the requirement of stating "Make and colour" of vehicle
    I have received an email from Camden council stating:
    "Please note that your challenge has been received and we will respond within 10 working days"
    I will update the thread once decision is received.


  10. #10
    Gold Account Holder Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative Jamberson Authoritative



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    Default Re: PCN Validity

    Colour is not required.



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