Hi everyone,

I missed a payment due to insufficient funds in my account on the 4th of December 2016 for £9.99.

I have been reading a number of the threads in this forum detailing similar issues of having a £25 "administration fee" placed on top of that £9.99 I owe them for a total of £34.99 to come out of my account today.

I have since contacted my bank and cancelled my direct debit with Harlands. I am happy to pay the £9.99 that I owe them, but I am not happy to pay a penalty charge of £25 (which I have read in other threads is unenforceable).

I have cancelled my Xercise 4 Less membership today and I am due to pay them £9.99 for December, and another £9.99 in January to finally end the membership. I am happy to pay both of these payments of £9.99

My question is do I need to be worried about cancelling this direct debit, causing any further problems, or can I simply pay them the 2 payments of £9.99 and be done with this shady company?

Thanks in advance for your time.

Hello and welcome to CAG.

As long as you pay and fulfil the terms of the agreement regarding the monthly fee for the gym, then I don't see any issue, other than they will claim that you need to pay via DD.

The penalty charge is just that, a penalty and is unlawful, if they question you as to why you have cancelled the DD, then simply tell them this is the reason, and you are more than happy to pay for the remaining months, but ensure you give them 30 days notice that you are cancelling the agreement, which needs to be 30 days prior to your last payment.

Stay off the phone, keep everything in writing or email, if you send anything via post, then obtain ''proof of posting'' which is free from the PO counter.

Hey, thanks for your response.

I called Xercise 4 Less earlier today and was told that the £25 fee was enforceable by law due to the contract I filled out when I signed up. However, I do not have a copy of this contract either in paper form or by e-mail, but was told that they would have it on file. Specifically they said that "you giving us your bank details implies an agreement". To me, this doesn't sound very legal and if it is not enforceable then I definitely won't be paying them. Kind of a nightmare and I'd advise anyone who is thinking of signing up to Xercise 4 Less to reconsider.

I called Xercise 4 Less earlier today and was told that the £25 fee was enforceable by law due to the contract I filled out when I signed up.

Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha, dear oh dear!

The clown you spoke to knows nothing of Law, they just wanted to sound like they did, this is why you NEVER discuss this over the phone.

They will tell you the moon is made of cheese just to get money out of you, stay OFF the phone.

that's why you don't ring these fleecers

because just like any DCA they'll say anything on the phone to spoof money out of you.

there a slick132 letter running around threads here

simply write harlands

OFFER them the 2*£9.99

refuse the admin fees as they are unlawful

then see what they say back

if they don't respond with a yes

that's all you need to do

then ignore them totally

Thanks everyone, I'll get a letter drafted up to send to them and post it here. Thought there was a bit of daylight robbery going on here haha.

Hi Applefat,

You're right to cancel the DD mandate. If it was left active, Harlands would try to collect £25 admin fee(s) as well as further monthly fees.

You only need to write to X4Less Head Office saying :-

I was unable to pay the DD due on xxdate due to personal circumstances but Harlands have tried to charge an unlawful £25 penalty on top of the gym fee.

Because of this, I hereby cancel my gym agreement with immediate effect. If you allow Harlands/CRS to harass me for payment, I will make formal complaints to The CMA and Trading Standards.

There are similar drafts here in the last month or two that you can use or adapt.

Stay OFF the phone and if Harlands/CRS call you, hang up.

Keep us posted.

I have drafted the following e-mail but haven't sent it yet.

To whom it may concern,

I was unable to pay the direct debit on 4/12/16 due to personal circumstances. However, Harlands have tried to charge an unlawful £25 penalty on top of the gym fee. Because of this I hereby cancel my gym agreement effective immediately. As these administration fees are unlawful by FCA regulations, I will not be paying the £25 administration fee, but I am more than happy to pay the £9.99 payment from 4/12/16, and the £9.99 payment due on 04/01/17 in order to cancel my membership. If you allow Harlands/CRS to harass me for payment, I will make formal complaints to the CMA and Trading Standards.

Yours sincerely,

XXXXXX

Is there anything I should add/remove from this email or will this do? Cheers for all your help.

Letter not email

With free proof of posting from po counter

Letter not email

With free proof of posting from po counter

Can always send both mind.....but hard copy is best.

Send by letter to X4Less Head Office in Leeds. Don't email as it's too easy for them to fire a reply back.

Leave out the bit about FCA Regulations - not sure where that came from.

I'd send exactly what I drafted above and forget offering to pay more.

Get a free Certificate of Posting at the PO and keep it.

So I e-mailed them what I showed you all previously and this is the reply I got:

"Dear XXXXXX

We write in relation to your membership with Xercise 4 Less.

Your account is currently in arrears for the month of December 2016.

These arrears stand at £59.99. Your next instalment falls due on: 4th January 2017.

We can confirm your arrears include £9.99 for your monthly instalment plus 2 x £25 administration charges for the missed payment.

It does state in our terms and conditions, which you have agreed to be bound by, is that "If you fail to pay any monies due under this agreement or if any Direct Debit is returned unpaid or any cheque is returned unpaid or if any other form of payment is not honoured for whatever reason, you shall pay us on demand an administration fee of £25.00 (which we require to cover our costs of seeking to pursue such payment from you).”

Please contact our offices on the HARLANDS HELPLINE - 01444 449166 to clear your arrears with your debit or credit card (and reinstate your direct debit) by 4th January 2017 as you may otherwise incur an administration charge."

It seems as if they should only add administration charges once every 30 days, but they have instead been adding them once every 7 days. In addition to this, they also want to reinstate my direct debit, probably so they can attempt to take the payments from me without my consent. How should I reply to this e-mail? I am concerned about them taking me to court to pay my arrears.

then you need to read a few threads here

no gym has done court since 2012

admin fee are unlawful and they know it.

if you've offered the missed membership

then you now ignore them

dx

Hi Applefat,

DX is right that you now need to ignore further comm'ns from Harlands/CRS.

You've not offered to pay anything because you simply cancelled after they tried to charge you unlawful admin fees.

You've no need at all to reply to their email. Let them make all the demands they want - they will do nothing to enforce them.

After Harlands and CRS, you may hear from Zinc and Spratt Endicott (Harlands current pet solicitor). Keep us posted about further demands or contact but don't reply to them unless we tell you to.

And avoid sending any further emails. If you need to make any contact, do it by posted letter.

How should I reply to this e-mail? I am concerned about them taking me to court to pay my arrears.

IGNORE it, that's how to respond.

Court, pa ha ha ha ha ha ha not a cats chance in hell!

They'd be ridiculed and thrown out.......

Alternatively IF you wish to have some Xmas fun...?

Dear Bill & Ben,

Thank you for your template email response, the contents of which have been noted, laughed at, and ignored.

You are at liberty to add all of the unenforceable and unlawful penalty fees as you wish, I look forward to embarrassing you in court and exposing your unlawful penalty fees you con customers out of.

I look forward to your timely template response,

Much love!

Small update as I have received a few letters in between my last post.

The most recent letter is from CRS, which I can see at the bottom of the letter, and from reading other threads, is a trading title of Harlands. The letter says:

"We have been advised by Harlands that you have stopped making payments under your membership agreement with Xercise 4 Less.

Your balance of £129.97 is now due to be paid no later than 2 February 17.

Call Harlands etc etc and pay the balance

Harlands would like to resolve this matter before further action is needed. However, under your agreement with Harlands, you have promised to pay this debt. If you continue to refuse to honour that commitment, Harlands will have no option but to take legal steps to collect the outstanding balance."

Call it £130, take away the 2x £10 payments I owe them, and you're left with £110. £110 doesn't divide by their £25 admin fees, so I have no idea where this extra £10 has come from. Do I need to respond or do anything with these letters? I'd rather not have any "legal steps" taken against me. Cheers in advance.

willy waving

go read again from post 13

Harlands and CRS are the same outfit !

Read post #14 again too

No need to reply to CRS's begging letter at all.

Received yet another letter of threat on 9th March 2017:

"Following our initial letter, we are disappointed that your account with Xercise 4 Less is still in arrears and our fee has not been paid.

We would still like to reach amicable (lol) resolution to this, however, if you fail to respond to this letter, we will have no option but to commence further action to recover the monies owed. The options available to us are:

1. Legal action

We believe you are in breach of a legally binding contract with Xercise 4 Less because you have not paid your membership and our fees. We may pursue a claim under this contract through the Courts. If we do so the following process would apply:

1. We will write a formal letter explaining what we are demanding and give you a final opportunity to pay/repay

2. If this failed to settle the matter we would issue proceedings against you in the County Court

3. You could then either:

a. make payment, ending the legal process, or

b. dispute some, or all, of the amount was owed

4. If you dispute the amount was owed the Court process would continue, at the end of which the Court would make a decision on our claim

5. A strict Court timescale will apply in relation to the Court process.

Were we to be successful in our claim, or if you ignore the claim, a County Court Judgement (CCJ) may be registered against you requiring you to make payment. You may also be liable for our costs of pursuing legal action and interest on the amount owed.

If you then fail to pay the amount covered by the CCJ we would take the next steps required to enforce the judgement. To do this we would have to make an application to the court.

2. Outsource to external agents

Your account would be passed to another Collection Agency who will take further action to recover the monies owed.

You can avoid this happening if within the next 10 days you contact us on 01444 449165 to arrange payment with us"

Does this threat have any legal backing or is it simply another means to attempt to extract payment from me?

I (and I assume many others) am not too fond on the idea of having a CCJ against me, but I feel as if they may actually issue one. Any advice would be appreciated, cheers in advance.

willy waving

they've not done court in +5yrs

ignore.

Just called trading standards and they advised that I get a copy of my contract and also proof of where the amount owed has come from. They also recommended that I pay the fees as if it went to court I would be in a breach of contract as it does state in the contract that there is a £25 administration fee.

rubbish!

its in the T&C not the contract

[deleted]

Does the signing of the contract not mean I agreed to the T+Cs?

not if you didn't read them or weren't given them

T&C 's are questionable hence the bank charges reclaiming debacle

and penalty fee are unenforceable as they are unlawful

even the FCA say so.