Depends MB whether the claimant proceeds with the initial claim....it could either be discontinued or simply withdrawn...CPR 38 and CPR 20 come into play.

Thanks for everyone's input on this one. For what its worth I've sent off a CCA request today recorded delivery.

With Highbridge's previous input I get the impression it has made things more difficult for me. I'm not sure about anything else- is there merit in seeking profession mediation to negotiate the debt?

I'll get the forms sent off for mediation this week.

as post 20

dx

Thanks for all your help on this one.

As mentioned I'll be returning all the forms opting for mediation

- to buy me more time initially.

I've got a few questions/comments

1) If mediation fails due to me saying I'm awaiting a copy of the CCA

does this look bad that I've only recently requested this within this last week?

2) Assuming mediation fails, is next step a hearing in front of the district judge

- assume mediation can't be re-introduced once already offered?

3) Given the apparent complexities of the case (with Highbridge's 'input')

would it be worth opting for a reduced settlement at mediation or me seeking professional advice.

I've been quoted £500 for an initial look through the paperwork with a solicitor that specialises in consumer credit law.

Its a lot of money for me but I could get hold of it.

4) Can I instruct legal representation after I've sent these 'Notice of proposed allocation to small claims track' forms.

Sorry for all the questions but I'm just genuinely worried.

Thanks in advance everyone.

Thanks for all your help on this one.

 

As mentioned I'll be returning all the forms opting for mediation

- to buy me more time initially.

 

I've got a few questions/comments

 

1) If mediation fails due to me saying I'm awaiting a copy of the CCA

does this look bad that I've only recently requested this within this last week? no

2) Assuming mediation fails, is next step a hearing in front of the district judge

- assume mediation can't be re-introduced once already offered? no point

3) Given the apparent complexities of the case (with Highbridge's 'input')

would it be worth opting for a reduced settlement at mediation or me seeking professional advice. no

 

I've been quoted £500 for an initial look through the paperwork with a solicitor that specialises in consumer credit law.

Its a lot of money for me but I could get hold of it. you dont need it - waste of money

4) Can I instruct legal representation after I've sent these 'Notice of proposed allocation to small claims track' forms.

you dont need it - waste of money

 

Sorry for all the questions but I'm just genuinely worried.

 

Thanks in advance everyone.

well stop being worried.

its no big deal

Claims questionnaires were completed and return to the court and sent recorded.

Copies were also sent to the claimants recorded delivery.

I also received a copy of the claimants questionnaire and they also consented to mediation.

Today I received the following letter today from the Courts 'Notice of Transfer of Proceedings'

'This claim has been transferred to the below County Court Hearing for allocation.

On receipt, the file will be referred to a procedural judge who allocate the claim to track

and give case management directions.

Details of the judge's directions will be sent to you in a notice of allocation.

If you would like further information you can contact the local County Court Hearing Centre

directly but please await the Judges directions '

Am I right in thinking that mediation will be next step that is likely to be offered or has this been skipped now?

Thank you

No not skipped.... details will arrive with your Notice of Allocation.

Andy

Thanks for the swift response. I'm expecting this to go to a hearing so I'm mentally trying to prepare myself and get up to speed on process and law.

I was looking through all my old credit card statements recently and found consecutive credit card statements where my credit limit had been increased without my asking. I've also got a load of old credit cheques that were sent to me in the post by the claimant/representatives Would any of these docs help my case to help show that the contract was unfair.

(Incidentally I've had no response to my CCA request sent around 2 weeks ago sent recorded delivery).

not really

but anyhow

plink have gotta find the agreement yet.

Fab thanks. Puts my mind at ease

Hi

Just received a further letter from the County court today. I've copied the contents below. (On the directions questionnaire I sent back in April, I ticked the box 'yes' to refer to the mediation service. However the Claimant ticked the 'No' box. Not sure if their preference not to go through mediation has had any impact on the contents of the letter below?)

p.s. I've still not received any response from the claimant from my CCA letter sent sent and received by their offices in April.

Date 23rd May

District Judge XXXXX sitting at XXXXXXXX Courthouse, considered the papers in the case and

ordered that:

1) The Claimant shall by 4.00pm 13 June 2016 give to the Defendant copies of all the documents upon which it proposes to rely, accompanied by a disclosure statement. In default of strict compliance the Claim shall stand struck out without need for further Order.

2) This claim is stayed until 4 July 2016, during which period the parties shall try to settle the case or narrow the issues.

3) By 4pm 18 July 2016 the Claimant must notify the court in writing of the outcome of negotiations (without disclosing any matters which remain subject to 'without prejudice' terms) and what, if any, further directions are sought. Failure to comply with this direction or to engage properly in negotiations may result in the application of sanctions. If settlement has been reached, the parties must file a consent order signed by all of them.

4) Because this Order has been made without a hearing, the parties have the right to apply to have the order set aside, varied or stayed. A party making such an application must send or deliver the application to the court (together with any appropriate fee) to arrive within seven days of service of this Order.

Dated 16 May 2016

Notice of Allocation.....sooo if by 4.00pm 13 June 2016 the claimant has not disclosed the documents to you...." the Claim shall stand struck out without need for further Order."

Regards

Andy

Thanks Andy- It would be great if they don't reply and the claim is struck out.

Unless the claimant has recently informed them,

I've not informed the County Court that I'm awaiting a response to a CCA request.

If the claimants does send 'all the documents it proposes to rely'

but does not include a copy of the original signed credit agreement

- I'm assuming it would still go to mediation and then a hearing assuming mediation fails?

Many thanks

No mediation has passed and failed now...hence the Notice of Allocation and directions.They either comply or its gone.

Ok thanks for clarification. I'll let you know what happens- hopefully nothing from claimant arrives in post over next couple of weeks..

I've just received an email with an attachment of 51 pages.

It includes a copy of the credit agreement as well as T&C's.

Email says hard copies are also on the way to me in the post.

They were emailed me to me just after 3pm. (4pm was the deadline).

Feeling gutted right now.

With 51 pages to redact there's a lot of personal/identifying info on most pages

- is there anyway I could email them for anyone familiar with the case to have a look at?

Andyorch or Dx perhaps? Thanks in advance.

Just a copy of the agreement (redacted) will suffice

signed credit agreement by you or application form?

dx

Will do..thank you..

Hi DX - Application form is signed by me ..- back in 2004. I've scanned at highest DPI- but resolution is the same as on original email.

Redacted docs - Disclosure 13062016.pdf

Inception copy of application form...not an executed agreement as per the N265...and the T&Cs are illegible.

Thanks Andy, how does an inception copy differ from any other type as (I'm guessing) I never signed any other set of application docs? Copies of the T&C's were sent to me by the original creditor much earlier on in the process- not sure if this would make any difference?

Pre 2007 agreements require that all the prescribed terms are included within the 4 corners of the agreement or on the same page as the signatory area.That's an application at the inception and therefore cannot be executed version as it is devoid of the prescribed terms.

That's why they have listed it as the executed agreement but have also stated its the inception application within the N265...it cant be both.and its certainly not an executed version.

not sure if you are merging documents from differing time periods or providers..?

ignore, delete, keep your mouth shut...

about anything you have NOT received directly from the claimant.

the claimant can only rely upon what they have supplied since the claimform..

which as andy point out,...is bog roll

always the same with link.

dx

Pre 2007 agreements require that all the prescribed terms are included within the 4 corners of the agreement or on the same page as the signatory area.That's an application at the inception and therefore cannot be executed version as it is devoid of the prescribed terms.

 

That's why they have listed it as the executed agreement but have also stated its the inception application within the N265...it cant be both.and its certainly not an executed version.

Well I'm going to play devil's advocate here Andy really to illustrate to people why anyone who ends up in court with what we might call a dodgy cca needs to be familiar with the carey vs hsbc judgement as the claimant will almost certainly bring it up.

So on that basis from the carey judgement para 110

"the application form which is the document actually signed by the debtor will constitute all or part of the executed agreement. It must “contain” all the prescribed information and terms and “embody” the rest which can be incorporated by reference."

and par 112

"And if the application form contained the Prescribed Terms on the front, for example, they would not need to be reproduced as such if they were present in the full terms and conditions already provided as part of the reconstituted agreement."

Now in relation to 127(3) using carey again.

para 173

"(2) A document need not be a single piece of paper;

(3) Whether several pieces of paper constitute one document is a question of substance not form. In particular a physical connection between several pieces of paper is not necessary in order for them to constitute one document;

(4) Additionally, a physical connection (or one or more physical connections) between several pieces of paper does not necessarily constitute them as one document;

(5) Accordingly, where the debtor’s signature and the Prescribed Terms appear on separate pieces of paper, the questions of whether those pieces of paper together constitute one document is a question of substance and not form"

Then I would add that the supplied form clearly states its a credit agreement and is signed by both parties.