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    • 4 means that they need to name and then tell the people who will be affected that there has been an application made, what the application relates to (specificially "whether it relates to the exercise of the court’s jurisdiction in relation to P’s property and affairs, or P’s personal welfare, or to both) and what this application contains (i.e what order they want made as a result of it) 5 just means that teh court think it is important that the relevant people are notified 7 means that the court need more information to make the application, hence they have then made the order of paragraph 1 which requires the applicant to do more - this means the court can't make a decision with the current information, and need more, hence paragraph one of the order is for the applicant to do more. paragraph 3 of the order gives you the ability to have it set aside, although if it was made in january you are very late. Were you notiifed of the application or not?    
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    • Hi, In my last post I mentioned I had received an email from SS who were asking me to hand over the keys to my mother’s flat so they could pass them to the Law firm who have been appointed court of protection to access, secure and insure my mother’s property.  Feeling this, all quickly getting out of my hands I emailed ss requesting proof of this. I HAVEN’T HEARD BACK FROM SS.  Yesterday, I received an email (with attached court of protection order) from the Law Firm confirming this was correct (please see below a copy of this).  After reading the court of protection order I do have some concerns about it:   (a)   I only found out yesterday, the Law firm had been appointed by the court back in January.  Up until now, I have not received any notification regarding this.  (b)   Section 2   - States I am estranged from my mother.  This is NOT CORRECT    The only reason I stepped back from my mother was to protect myself from the guy (groomer) who had befriended her & was very aggressive towards me & because of my mother’s dementia she had become aggressive also.  I constantly tried to warned SS about this guy's manipulative behaviour towards my mother and his increasing aggressiveness towards me (as mentioned in previous posts).  Each time I was ignored.  Instead, SS encouraged his involvement with my mother – including him in her care plans and mental health assessments.   I was literally pushed out because I feared him and my mother’s increasing aggression towards me. Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
    • Unless I've got an incorrect copy of the relevant regulation: The PCN is only deemed to have arrived two days after dispatch "unless the contrary is proved" in which case date of delivery does matter (not just date of posting) and I would like clarification of the required standard of proof. It seems perhaps this hasn't been tested. Since post is now barcoded for the Post Office's own tracking purposes perhaps there is some way I can get that evidence from the Post Office...
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Powergen + Prepay Electricity Meters


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Hi...

 

Having just had a prepay electricity meter installed at my property, I'm looking for some further information on the way they operate.

In my case, the consumption appears to fluctuate fairly drastically with no apparent cause (ie extra equipment being operated etc). If I'm to believe my meter my bill for a year will, at the present rate, be in excess of £1000, which is ridiculous in view of the nature of electricity usage at this property.

To further complicate matters, it appears that this increase in consumption goes hand in hand with an investigation into the whereabouts of former tenants, who have left substantial bills outstanding.

I'm awaiting a response from Powergen regarding this problem, but I'm interested to know if the tariff on a prepay meter can be altered without manual intervention, or if I should be looking closer to home for faulty equipment etc?

Debt free, partially thanks to CAG forums.

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Oh dear - a prepay meter is a complex device, and it's programming owes more than just charging for the electricity that flows through it. For example, it can be programmed to deduct cash amounts from each power card inserted, that goes into a seperate fund - say for reducing a previous balance owed. The remainder is then decremented from the power actually consumed, so it is not possible to correlate the money paid in with the consumption used.

 

However, to check your consuption, all you need do is take a reading every seven days, and jot down all the digits, including those after the decimal point, and write them on a calendar. (I always do mine on Sundays, gas too!). The second week, do the same, then take the first figure from the second to get the consumption that week, note this on the calendar also. You will have been given the cost of the tariff you are on (or find it on the PG website). You can then work out the cost of all electricity used that week, and how much you should have paid. Do this every week, and if you are putting in more money than the consumption shows, you ask for the meter to be checked. Keep your figures safe (I keep mine online with a Google Spreadsheet).

 

With the recent clock change, costs can increase dramatically because of the loss of light - but after this major changes in consumption can be easily spotted, and if you didn't have 7 baths that week, there is a possibility someone is stealing your power.

 

Start by keeping the figures I mentioned, as a barganing exercise, it's well worth the 2-3 minutes it takes to keep you money where it belongs. In YOUR pocket! :)

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Hi...

 

Having just had a prepay electricity meter installed at my property, I'm looking for some further information on the way they operate.

In my case, the consumption appears to fluctuate fairly drastically with no apparent cause (ie extra equipment being operated etc). If I'm to believe my meter my bill for a year will, at the present rate, be in excess of £1000, which is ridiculous in view of the nature of electricity usage at this property.

To further complicate matters, it appears that this increase in consumption goes hand in hand with an investigation into the whereabouts of former tenants, who have left substantial bills outstanding.

I'm awaiting a response from Powergen regarding this problem, but I'm interested to know if the tariff on a prepay meter can be altered without manual intervention, or if I should be looking closer to home for faulty equipment etc?

 

Each time you "top up" your prepayment card with credit, the server that issues the credit can store extra information on your card, including the instruction to change the charge per unit. However, the information about current charge per unit can be obtained by cycling through the options using the two buttons on the meter. I think it would be worth while making a note of these values, and if Powergen change them dramatically you can query the reason for the change with them. On occasion I've had a situation where they raise the unit cost to defer a debt on the property, and they don't always notify the current billpayer; this could well be what's happened here.

 

If in doubt, get a new owners card from them which will reset the meter.

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The new owners card will only work if it is a powercard meter, depending what area you are in it will probably be a key meter that has been fitted.

 

As previously advised Powergen can change the tarrif, standing charge and debt at any time that is collected through the meter. They do not need to attend your property to do this as messages are passed on when you top up.

 

If their is as you say a dispute on debt from previous tennant etc then they cannot take this debt or set this debt on the meter untill dispute is resolved, however check as they might do just that.

 

Let us know if key or powercard and we will give you more info.

 

 

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Thanks for your responses, sound advice.

The fact that Powergen are both able and known to alter tarriffs etc electronically doesn't surprise me one bit, and is about as much confirmation as I need of what I already suspected.

We use a stick/key style meter, charged at Paypoint outlets, in answer to Ozzywolf's question.

Its likely then that we're being penalised for the several thousand pounds outstanding in the name of former tenants, until such time as an ongoing investigation into the movements of said tenants is concluded and proper liability apportioned.

Having just had a dispute with my water company regarding their similarly arbitrary behaviour, I'd like to know if anyone has had experience arguing these points with Pgen or similar.

I suspect the justification will be the old "You agreed to us being able to do that by signing up with us and havig a meter installed" verbal/contractual tosh.

Debt free, partially thanks to CAG forums.

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Okies so its a key meter, kinda new in most areas. Put your key in the meter then press the blue button. Here near the bottom of all your settings you will see somthnig like WKFXCH This meens weekly fixed charge. Check how much debt it is collecting.

Or just phone them and ask them. I doubt anyone would actually lie and say it is not collecting a debt when it is, if you ask them directly. Only probs you may get is getting through to an advisor that doesnt know how to check.

Displays for a one rate meter are:

  • Available credit
  • Test display
  • Time Date
  • Total credit accepted
  • Total weekly fixed charge
  • Day unit reading
  • Day time pence per unit
  • Value of emergency credit
  • Total debt outstanding
  • Weekly debt repayment amount

Displays for a two rate meter are:

  • Available credit
  • Test display
  • TimeDate
  • Total credit accepted
  • Total weekly fixed charge
  • Day unit reading
  • Day time pence per unit
  • Night unit reading
  • Night time pence per unit
  • Value of emergency credit
  • Total debt outstanding
  • Weekly debt repayment amount

 

 

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Thanks for that, a valuable chunk of information.

I've pulled all the figures off, calculated the matter and checked all the tariffs etc online, and it would appear that theres nothing out of the ordinary.

My house must just be bloody expensive to run and, as stated earlier in the thread, the loss of light etc must've been the contributing factor.

Just goes to show, I'd probably be bankrupt if it weren't for these energy saving lightbulbs...

Thanks a lot though, I'll remember the advice in future.

Debt free, partially thanks to CAG forums.

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I'm not sure if this was mentioned earlier - your consumption should be 'typical' ask a neighbour what they consume a month, and see how you compare. It won;t be for the first time that some flat dweller has discovered some 'creative rewiring' has resulted in another owner not getting any bills! (Espoecially for communal meters! - but that doesn't appear to be an issue in your case!)

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  • 1 month later...

I thought this one was over with, but it would appear its not.

Having recently ascertained that our households current consumption of elecricity is 3 and a half times the typical amount in our area, and having ruled out our heating and appliances as the cause of this, we've contacted Powergen and asked them what they propose to do about this.

The first round of calls produced a new 'recalibrated' payment stick, and the promise of quite a large refund.

Said stick turned up, made absolutely no difference to our consumption, and of course no refund arrived either.

We've now been told that our consumption 'must be correct', and that theres nothing further they can do for us.

So here comes the first nasty letter...

Debt free, partially thanks to CAG forums.

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Energywatch are a waste of space - as I had to go it aslone without their 'help', all they did was 'watch' whilst I took the company to Court. The consumption may well be correct, but it doesn't mean YOU used it. It has bene known for other residents or flats to have access to your supply. If you go away for a day or so, turn off the power at the meter, and see if anyone complains!

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  • 2 years later...

I am a husband with 3 kids.

We missed one month payment back in november when i lost my job as a bricky and we were forced into having prepay meters installed by swalec, we were told that it would work out cheaper for us monthly but AFTER they were installed we were told that a mistake had been made and infact the amount we were putting into the meters each month was correct...

 

via direct debit....

 

£75 per month for gas

£75 per month for electricity

 

now via prepay meters we are putting in over £200 per month! and this is with me still out of work and us living on my wifes wages.

 

I would like to know that when i move at the end of the month into our new house (rented, lost family home) can swalec force us to have prepay meters installed or can we refuse?

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You have responses on your own thread oopa.

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Should you be offered help that requires payment please report it to site team.

Advice & opinions given by Caro are personal, are not endorsed by Consumer Action Group or Bank Action Group, and are offered informally, without prejudice & without liability. Your decisions and actions are your own, and should you be in any doubt, you are advised to seek the opinion of a qualified professional.

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