Jump to content


  • Tweets

  • Posts

    • love the extra £1000 charge for confidentialy there BF   Also OP even if they don't offer OOC it doesn't mean your claim isn't good. I had 3 against EVRi that were heard over the last 3 weeks. They sent me emails asking me to discontinue as I wouldn't win. Went infront of a judge and won all 3.    Just remember the law is on your side. The judges will be aware of this.   Where you can its important to try to point out at the hearing the specific part of the contract they breached. I found this was very helpful and the Judge made reference to it when they gave their judgements and it seemed this was pretty important as once you have identified a specific breach the matter turns straight to liability. From there its a case of pointing out the unlawfullness of their insurance and then that should be it.
    • I know dx and thanks again for yours and others help. I was 99.999% certain last payment was over six years ago if not longer.  👍
    • Paragraph 23 – "standard industry practice" – put this in bold type. They are stupid to rely on this and we might as well carry on emphasising how stupid they are. I wonder why they could even have begun to think some kind of compelling argument – "the other boys do it so I do it as well…" Same with paragraph 26   Paragraph 45 – The Defendants have so far been unable to produce any judgements at any level which disagree with the three judgements…  …court, but I would respectfully request…   Just the few amendments above – and I think it's fine. I think you should stick to the format that you are using. This has been used lots of times and has even been applauded by judges for being meticulous and clear. You aren't a professional. Nobody is expecting professional standards and although it's important that you understand exactly what you are doing – you don't really want to come over to the judge that you have done this kind of thing before. As a litigant in person you get a certain licence/leeway from judges and that is helpful to you – especially if you are facing a professional advocate. The way this is laid out is far clearer than the mess that you will get from EVRi. Quite frankly they undermine their own credibility by trying to say that they should win simply because it is "standard industry practice". It wouldn't at all surprise me if EVRi make you a last moment offer of the entire value of your claim partly to avoid judgement and also partly to avoid the embarrassment of having this kind of rubbish exposed in court. If they do happen to do that, then you should make sure that they pay everything. If they suddenly make you an out-of-court offer and this means that they are worried that they are going to lose and so you must make sure that you get every penny – interest, costs – everything you claimed. Finally, if they do make you an out-of-court offer they will try to sign you up to a confidentiality agreement. The answer to that is absolutely – No. It's not part of the claim and if they want to settle then they settle the claim as it stands and don't try add anything on. If they want confidentiality then that will cost an extra £1000. If they don't like it then they can go do the other thing. Once you have made the amendments suggested above – it should be the final version. court,. I don't think we are going to make any more changes. Your next job good to make sure that you are completely familiar with it all. That you understand the arguments. Have you made a court familiarisation visit?
    • just type no need to keep hitting quote... as has already been said, they use their own criteria. if a person is not stated as linked to you on your file then no cant hurt you. not all creditors use every CRA provider, there are only 3 main credit file providers mind, the rest are just 3rd party data sharers. if you already have revolving credit on your file there is no need to apply for anything just 'because' you need to show you can handle money. if you have bank account(s) and a mortgage which you are servicing (paying) then nothing more can improve your score, despite what these 'scam' sites claiml  its all a CON!!  
  • Recommended Topics

  • Our picks

    • If you are buying a used car – you need to read this survival guide.
      • 1 reply
    • Hello,

      On 15/1/24 booked appointment with Big Motoring World (BMW) to view a mini on 17/1/24 at 8pm at their Enfield dealership.  

      Car was dirty and test drive was two circuits of roundabout on entry to the showroom.  Was p/x my car and rushed by sales exec and a manager into buying the mini and a 3yr warranty that night, sale all wrapped up by 10pm.  They strongly advised me taking warranty out on car that age (2017) and confirmed it was honoured at over 500 UK registered garages.

      The next day, 18/1/24 noticed amber engine warning light on dashboard , immediately phoned BMW aftercare team to ask for it to be investigated asap at nearest garage to me. After 15 mins on hold was told only their 5 service centres across the UK can deal with car issues with earliest date for inspection in March ! Said I’m not happy with that given what sales team advised or driving car. Told an amber warning light only advisory so to drive with caution and call back when light goes red.

      I’m not happy to do this, drive the car or with the after care experience (a sign of further stresses to come) so want a refund and to return the car asap.

      Please can you advise what I need to do today to get this done. 
       

      Many thanks 
      • 81 replies
    • Housing Association property flooding. https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/topic/438641-housing-association-property-flooding/&do=findComment&comment=5124299
      • 160 replies
    • We have finally managed to obtain the transcript of this case.

      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
      This is generally speaking the problem with using PackLink who are domiciled in Spain and very conveniently out of reach of the British justice system.

      Frankly I don't think that is any accident.

      One of the points that the judge made was that the customers contract with the broker specifically refers to the courier – and it is clear that the courier knows that they are acting for a third party. There is no need to name the third party. They just have to be recognisably part of a class of person – such as a sender or a recipient of the parcel.

      Please note that a recent case against UPS failed on exactly the same issue with the judge held that the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 did not apply.

      We will be getting that transcript very soon. We will look at it and we will understand how the judge made such catastrophic mistakes. It was a very poor judgement.
      We will be recommending that people do include this adverse judgement in their bundle so that when they go to county court the judge will see both sides and see the arguments against this adverse judgement.
      Also, we will be to demonstrate to the judge that we are fair-minded and that we don't mind bringing everything to the attention of the judge even if it is against our own interests.
      This is good ethical practice.

      It would be very nice if the parcel delivery companies – including EVRi – practised this kind of thing as well.

       

      OT APPROVED, 365MC637, FAROOQ, EVRi, 12.07.23 (BRENT) - J v4.pdf
        • Like
  • Recommended Topics

Orange Charging for Delivery Reports


maybox
style="text-align: center;">  

Thread Locked

because no one has posted on it for the last 6354 days.

If you need to add something to this thread then

 

Please click the "Report " link

 

at the bottom of one of the posts.

 

If you want to post a new story then

Please

Start your own new thread

That way you will attract more attention to your story and get more visitors and more help 

 

Thanks

Recommended Posts

Orange have been charging for delivery reports (1p per report) since July 2006.

 

At no point did orange inform me (or any other customers I imagine) that this would happen and I only noticed it after agreeing to renew my contract and looked at my bills. Nowhere in the T&Cs of Orange's contracts does it say it charges for delivery reports.

 

Can I get out my contract charge free on the basis they have broken their agreement to inform me of new charges?

Link to post
Share on other sites

It probably does say in your T&Cs that call charges may change etc. However, this is disgraceful IMO - how on earth can they charge for delivery reports without warning you? Doubt you can legally get out of your contract free however.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

Please click the star if I have helped!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd keep quiet. 1p for a delivery report? They charge me 10p! Delivery reports have always been a chargeable service - there is a system generated SMS sent to you when the message you sent has been safely delivered to the distant terminal (but not necesarily read). This acknowledgement to you incurs a charge, usually the same cost as the message you sent outbound. I am unaware of any network that provides these reports FoC, and having been with Orange since 1996, the charge has been in place ever since they ended their free SMS service.

 

As for them not informing you - it's in the Price List, and not really Orange's fault if you didn't notice it. If you don;t need these reports, why not turn them off - that way there is no charge!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd keep quiet. 1p for a delivery report? They charge me 10p! Delivery reports have always been a chargeable service - there is a system generated SMS sent to you when the message you sent has been safely delivered to the distant terminal (but not necesarily read). This acknowledgement to you incurs a charge, usually the same cost as the message you sent outbound. I am unaware of any network that provides these reports FoC, and having been with Orange since 1996, the charge has been in place ever since they ended their free SMS service.

 

As for them not informing you - it's in the Price List, and not really Orange's fault if you didn't notice it. If you don;t need these reports, why not turn them off - that way there is no charge!

 

I'm not sure you know what I'm talking about. No other network charges for delivery reports to the best of my knowledge. If orange have been charging you 10p for them, then you're being ripped off BIG TIME!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure you know what I'm talking about. Vodafone and O2 also charge for this - I also explained precisely what I meant by a 'delivery report'. It is an inbound SMS that is billed to my account that confirms an SMS message has been delivered. Why do you think you should get a service like this for free? If you don't think it's worth 1p - stop using it.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Having been an orange customer for 6 years, there certainly has never been a charge for delivery reports before.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

Please click the star if I have helped!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

Having been an orange customer for 6 years, there certainly has never been a charge for delivery reports before.

 

I'm afraid it depends on many variables - espcially the mobile tariff your handset it on - just because some people don't receive a charge for a particular call or service, does not mean others do not... as you recall, this thread was stared by someone complaining they were chargesd 1p. My Tariff - OVP charges 10p, and is itemised as such.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure you know what I'm talking about. Vodafone and O2 also charge for this - I also explained precisely what I meant by a 'delivery report'. It is an inbound SMS that is billed to my account that confirms an SMS message has been delivered. Why do you think you should get a service like this for free? If you don't think it's worth 1p - stop using it.

 

Can you link me to a site that confirms this for me? Sorry I'm not convinced any other operators charge for delivery reports and Orange charging you 10p?? Where's that come from? Orange used to be free - I should know, I've been a customer since 2000.

 

Orange have never charged for delivery reports before. Why some customers are now being charged and others not is a mystery (read the comments at the bottom of this page Weblog - Money - Times Online: New Orange charges: fair or foul? )

 

Also the service should be free. Why should I not be entitled for free to know whether or not a message gets delivered? I'm paying for a service and I should be entitled to know whether or not that service is correctly implemented. The actual cost of informing me is probably 100 times less than the 1p they want to charge anyway.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Can you link me to a site that confirms this for me? Also the service should be free. Why should I not be entitled for free to know whether or not a message gets delivered? I'm paying for a service and I should be entitled to know whether or not that service is correctly implemented. .

 

In order;

 

1) Regarding some customers being charged and others not - it's because of a thing called tariffs. All customers are NOT the same, only those in the same groups. I was told Orange have in excerss of 158 different tariffs (some still running since 1996). You get what you sign up to. There is no mystery.

 

2) Tariff details are only shown on websites relating to the currently available product. The actuall tariff and attendant costs are loaded into each network's billing system with the relevant code, which pulls up the costs for that customer. You can request your own tariff be notified to you, but for 'competition' reasons, networks do not issue a grid showing the differences of their previous offerings, old or new.

 

3) Why shouldn't everything be free? If I post a letter, should RM send me a postcard saying they delivered my letter successfully, and do it for free. No, wait - they charge (or used to) 49p for advice of delivery. If a text message costs X to send and a network has the ability to advise said message has been delivered, and YOU want to know it has - it's only reasonable the thae cost of so doing is billed to the person requesting the service.

 

4) You are paying for the sending of an SMS. If you wish the confidence of knowing it has been delivered, that's an extra. Looking back at some earlier bills, I note that I had 'inclusive' texts, and the the cost was 0.00, however it came out of my allocation, so inclusive, not 'free'. On switching tariffs and being charged 10p a go, I turned off Receipts. IF the system coud tell you when the message was READ, I might reconsider, but all these are additional services, and nothing to do with the basic SMS service.

 

5) As to the latest news that Orange will be charging for itemised billing - again, Free Itemised Billing is part of my tariff and they cannot change this unless/until they force me off onto a different one.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Flippin' ek - i wish people would get off their 'look at me being cutting' puerile horses and try read things both properly and in context.

 

Incidentally, Royal Mail return mail for free if it is undeliverable. If Orange informed you automatically that text messages are undeliverable I'd have no qualm here. Fact is they don't - you have to switch on delivery reports for the luxury of this service.

 

I was put on to new "better" tariff after threatening to leave Orange. I did not incur any new charges for itemised billing nor delivery reports in the 1st month. Second month and onwards I've been charged for delivery reports. This to me is not on and must breach their side of the contract somewhere. I don't think it's any coincidence that the timing of delivery report charges comes in alongside their new parent company Wanadoo - who have massive debts to pay off.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Differnet issues. Delivery reports have been charged for long before France Telecomn thought it was a great idea to buy the network from Vodafone - the Wannadoo nonsense has probably resulted in the imposition of the £1.50pm charge for itemised billing - the fact that Orange appear to have imposed this by default on those customers without giving them a chance is a scandal - especially if they're not going to be prepared to show that it actually COSTS them £1.50 to collate the data and add X number of pages to a bill they're sending out anyway. But I digress.

 

Royal mail may indeed return mail that is undeliverable, but that's not the issue - at least compare like with like! We're talking about delivery of the item (not its return) so the networks charge for this because they can, and some of us are happy to pay the price.

 

As for switching to a 'better' tariff - I have a number of mobiles on Orange and the 'best' tariffs available are those that you cannot sign up to anymore! (The best being contract rates for making calls, but NO line rental) it was only offered for about 14 months, but there's no way I'm switching tariff. When you do switch, all the prices change to a new level - and whilst you may be told of the 'headline' rates, the boring stuff like delivery receipts, free calls to 0800/0500 and/or voicemail are seldom hilighted, but change nonetheless. That's why a bland statement that your network charges someone X for a particular feature or service doesn't meant they do the same to everyone else. Having been a customer of theirs for the last 10 years, I learned the hard way!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had about 6 different tariffs on Orange during my time with them - none of them charged for delivery reports. Of course, I can't say that none of them do, but I would be very surprised. I would be even more surprised if these charges are on contracts but not PAYG, which they aren't.

7 years in retail customer service

 

Expertise in letting and rental law for 6 years

 

By trade - I'm an IT engineer working in the housing sector.

 

Please note that any posts made by myself are for information only and should not and must not be taken as correct or factual. If in doubt, consult with a solicitor or other person of equal legal standing.

 

Please click the star if I have helped!!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had about 6 different tariffs on Orange during my time with them - none of them charged for delivery reports. Of course, I can't say that none of them do, but I would be very surprised. I would be even more surprised if these charges are on contracts but not PAYG, which they aren't.

 

Well 6 out of 158 can hardly claim to be representative, of my 8 network connections, 2 are PAYG and only use SMS, but as these are telematics devices, they don't generate delivery requests, 4 are on the OVP tariff and charge 10p per report, so they're not used. The last two have bene ported to Vodafone, and they charge 5p. In each case, when the charge was discovered, the service was discontinued.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • Recently Browsing   0 Caggers

    • No registered users viewing this page.

  • Have we helped you ...?


×
×
  • Create New...