Hi, I have gone through various threads on this site regarding this ridiculous "admin fee" which harlands charge, however I'm still unsure what to do.

I joined the gym a month ago now and my first payment was due on the 20th, however I had misplaced my card on the 18th (I later found my card.)

After misplacing my card I did not add any funds into my account because I was worried someone would use my card if found. I added funds into my account on the 24th after I finally found my card again (it fell out of my jeans pocket in my cupboard!) I thought the DD payment for gym would be taken a few days late with no hassle. As last year I made 2 late payments with my student accommodation rent and all was fine.

Although a few days ago I was shocked to find a letter from harlands stating that they will be charging me a £25 admin fee for missing my payment. I was completely unaware about this admin fee until I read the letter and don't understand why they charge so much for a late payment.

I am unsure what to do as I want to continue going to the gym and I am happy paying the original £22 DD I have set up, but I refuse to pay this £25 "admin fee" which harlands have charged me.

Thanks in advance for your help.

Hi Zain and welcome to CAG

Harlands admin fees are not enforceable as they are effectively unlawful penalties.

Unfortunately, Harlands can be very stubborn and may be unwilling to waive the admin fees. This leaves you with a dilemma - pay the fees or leave the gym.

The following could be sent to Harlands, if you agree the content :-

I refer to your demand for a £25 admin fee.

This is effectively a penalty and, as such, it is unlawful and not enforceable.

It does not matter whether the admin fees are contained in the gym's T&C's. They remain unlawful.

If you insist that I pay any admin fees, I will cancel my gym agreement direct with the gym immediately. The grounds for cancellation are breach of contract on your part, by trying to charge me fees that are unlawful, thereby failing to treat me fairly as a consumer.

If you agree to waive this £25 fee, I will be happy to remain a member at the gym. I will also do my best to see that future payments are made on time.

Please note, however, that I will also refuse to pay any other admin fees that you charge in the future.

I require your response within 14 days and will have to cancel the DD mandate if I do not hear from you by then.

Hi Slick thanks for your reply.

I posted this thread too late as I checked my bank account in the morning, unfortunately Harlands have already taken out £47 (£22 + £25 admin fee.) Is there any way I can claim this back?

Yes, certainly.

Under the DD Guarantee Scheme, you can tell your bank Harlands have taken money in excess of what you agreed to. They should refund the payment to you immediately. Sort this by phone or at a branch (take photo ID) on Monday.

You can then send Harlands the letter above but with an additional paragraph :-

...... T&C's. They remain unlawful.

 

In this connection, you chose to take the £25 admin charge in addition to the normal gym fee using the DD mandate. As I did not agree to the admin fee, the DD payment is being returned to my bank account.

 

If you insist that I pay any ......

Send the letter off to Harlands on Monday too.

Hi slick thanks for your help.

I went to the bank today and claimed back the money which Harlands took.

I now need to send the letter above which you have wrote, although I was wondering if I should send the letter to Harlands or just e-mail them. As they have provided me with an e-mail address at the bottom of the letter which they sent. ([email protected])

Hi Zain,

I would use normal post but get a free Certificate of Posting from a PO when you send it.

If you give them your email address, they may flood you with demands.

Hi,

I sent the letter to Harlands which Slick kindly wrote out for me. I have a attached the letter which Harlands sent me as a response to the letter I sent.

I don't think Harlands will waive this admin fee, I think I may have to cancel the direct debit.

I would really appreciate any advice on how I should respond to Harlands.

EDIT : the attachment image is too small and I can't embed a link from imgur as I don't have 10 posts

Hi Zain,

PDF images work best when needed. See the guide at post #5 here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?415909-Blemain-problem&p=4463217&viewfull=1#post4463217

Or just tell us the gist of what they say.

Did you get the bank to refund the full DD from Harlands of £47.

Hi slick,

Thanks for that link I managed to convert the letter to pdf along with another letter I received today.

Yes I managed to get the £47 refunded back from my bank, thanks for the advice! I told the bank what you said and had the money refunded the same day.[ATTACH=CONFIG]49867[/ATTACH]

Hi Zain,

Letter to Harlands :-

Dear sir or madam,

I refer to your letter of xxdate.

Despite the suggestion that your admin charges are "fully enforceable by UK Law", I have good reason to believe you are wrong. The admin charges are penalties and, as such, they are both unlawful and unenforceable.

As per my earlier letter, I hereby cancel my gym membership with immediate effect on the basis of your breach of contract, by trying to make me pay unlawful penalty charges.

My bank properly reclaimed the £47 DD that you took without my consent and this will not be reversed.

If you contact me further making any demands, either as Harlands or as CRS, the matter may be reported to The OFT as a formal complaint.

Yours faithfully,

[ATTACH=CONFIG]51116[/ATTACH]Hi Slick,

After sending the letter to Harlands which you posted above, since then they have not sent me anymore letters. However yesterday, I received a letter from the Credit Resolution Services (CRS) stating that I owe the gym £427.04 (£113.04 of which is some fees, I'm assuming they are admin fees).

Any advice on what I should do? As I am unsure who this company are and if I have to pay this debt. I have attached the letter which I received.

Thanks in advance for your help. [ATTACH]51116[/ATTACH]

Hi Zain,

As I am unsure who this company are and if I have to pay this debt.

You need to do more reading about this matter ! If you did, you would know that CRS are simply Harlands, wearing a different hat, working from the same office, pretending to be a separate DCA.

Hence my opinion that this is not a "debt" that you should pay, particularly as it's loaded with unlawful penalty charges.

I would simply ignore this letter.

;-)

Hi Slick,

I have received a few letters from CRS, one of them was threatening to pass the account i apparently owe to Zinc Group LTD. I decided to ignore the letters from CRS, however today I received a call from Zinc stating that I owe this debt to Harlands. I explained to them the reason for cancelling the DD however they go it still must be paid. Are Zinc Group LTD pretending to be just another DCA?

Any advice will be greatly appreciated.

Hi Zain,

Zinc ARE a separate outfit from Harlands/CRS.

As with any DCA, if they call you, you should ALWAYS refuse to talk to them and insist they put anything they need to say in writing. Then hang up !!

Have Zinc written to you yet. If so, what have they said.

If they haven't written, do nothing more until they do.

Also, keep a written log of all calls from Harlands, CRS or Zinc, just in case you need to make a formal complaint in the future.

Thanks for the advice, I will bear this in mind if they call again and will tell them to contact me via e-mail or letter.

Zinc e-mailed me once 4 days ago with the following;

"Dear Mr,

I am now your allocated Customer Account Manager and have been assigned your CRS on behalf of Fitness For Life account (Zinc Reference 2106946.)

Please can I ask that you call me on 0141 301 1055, visit WeWantToSayYes. to update your account or email me by return to confirm receipt of this message, I am here to help you so please don't hesitate to ask if you need anything.

Many thanks,

Maria Crawford"

I ignored the e-mail and didn't ring, this is why I'm assuming they contacted me today.

Hi Zain,

As Harlands have not replied properly to your letter in post #10 above, you are right to ignore demands from Harlands and CRS.

On this occasion, reply to Zinc saying :-

I refer to your email of xxdate.

This matter is in dispute with Harlands/CRS and they had no right to pass the matter to Zinc.

If you contact me again, you will be included in my Formal Complaint to Trading Standards for breach of OFT Debt Collection Guidelines.

Hi Slick,

Thanks for the template e-mail I sent it to Zinc, I will aware you if they respond to it.

Hi,

It has been over a month and I have had no contact from Harlands, CRS or Zinc. Therefore I was considering joining my previous gym where I cancelled the DD as it is really close by. The gym never contacted me after I cancelled my DD, so I'm assuming it may not be an issue joining again.

However, the only payment options there are DD (which I'd prefer not to do again) or payment in cash for the whole year. I'm just curious as to whether there could be any issues in the future if I join the gym again and pay in cash. I know this is not a usual question on here, but any advice will be helpful!

Hi Zain,

Do you know if Harlands run the admin for the gym you now want to rejoin ?

What gym is this ?

The only problem in paying up front by cash or by debit card is that you may not get any refund in the event of loss of job, relocation, illness or injury. You need to check the gym's T&C's about this carefully and DO NOT just take the word of gym staff as they tend to tell you whatever gets you to sign up and pay.

Hi,

The gym is called "Fitness for Life" and is a local one, however I am unsure if Harlands run the admin for the gym.

I will read the T&C's carefully to see what the conditions are regarding a refund before paying up front. One thing I was concerned about is that the gym may take my money later down the line and say that it is used for when I cancelled my membership.

I could set up a DD using a family members DD as the gym allows this and I don't think Harlands will try to take the money from another persons DD?

Hi Zain,

I suggest you contact the new gym and simply ask them exactly who runs the admin side of things because you want to avoid Harlands due to your past experience.

It may be MCA that deal with Fitness for Life but please check.

If Harlands is not involved, I would definitely use a DD membership, unless the one-off payment up front gets you a better and affordable deal.

Hi Slick,

I contacted the gym regarding who runs the Admin side of things. They go that part is actually run by themselves and Harlands only do the DD stuff. Harlands are still involved with the DD stuff as they was when I cancelled my membership from the gym a few months ago. So I think that best option to join the gym would be cash upfront, as they said Harlands will not be involved with that.

Hi Zain,

So you've spoken to the gym and they say that Harlands DO handle their admin.

Odd, cos that's not what one of their gyms told me 2 days back when I called to enquire - they said MCA ran their admin. Maybe you should double check if you're concerned.

In any event, a new DD set up for the new gym will NOT enable Harlands to take anything other than what is due each month per the new agreement.

So I would be inclined to start a new m/ship on a monthly DD. If Harlands raise any objection based on the previous dispute, go for the Cash Up Front option.

Hi,

I'm not quite sure what the admin is, but I asked if Harlands run the admin for the gym and the person said that Harlands only do the DD but the gym do the admin. I'm assuming now that the DD is the admin.

I think the gym you may of contacted that was being run by MCA was possibly a different one, as Fitness for Life is a local one in Rochdale.

Also I was worried that Harlands may start hassling me again as it is the same gym where I cancelled my DD a few months ago.

Again, thanks for your help Slick much appreciated!

Hi Zain,

I looked up Fitness for Life and called a gym in Essex who said it was MCA that dealt with the admin. If you were told differently for your gym, you should trust what they say.

But my advice above remains - try and sign up with the new gym on a monthly DD and see how you get on.

Harlands CAN'T take any money for the old DD using a new DD that you sign for a different gym. If they did, you can very easily get it refunded using the DD Guarantee Scheme with your bank.