Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)




BAILIFFS - The Law and Your Rights

Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.

The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.

£13.95 + £2.00 (P&P)
+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    Basic Account Holder BiasFirey Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    1

    Default TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    Hi Everyone,

    I need some advice and confirmation that I should be ignoring a Parking Enforcement Notice which I received from TnC Parking Services on behalf of their client P4 Parking.

    I live Edinburgh (EH11) and the fight for parking spaces is a daily battle. I'm a musician and after returning home very late one night from work, I parked in the only place available within a two mile radius of my flat. I parked on the street, not in a bay and was not obstructing or impacting access to the car park in anyway. There are just two signs within that area of the car park however nether are on the side of which I parked and none are visible at night due to low lighting. The area in which I parked is used on a daily basis by others and their inconsistencies in who they choose to ticket is somewhat baffling.

    After reading many posts on here, I have chosen to ignoreicon the two demands they have sent me so far via the personal information they acquired from the DVLA, as there are no trespass laws in Scotland and I believe that only police or council have the right to issue such demands.

    So my question is, am I right? Should I keep ignoring or do I contact them with my despute?

    I have no intention of paying this so called 'fine' as I believe it to be unlawful but somehow they've manage to get under my skin and I can't help but worry about it.


    Please help put my mind at ease. Many thanks in advance.


  2. #2
    Basic Account Holder Homer67 Novitiate Homer67 Novitiate Homer67's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    359

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    You said you parked on the street then later in your post refer to a car park.

    On what basis was this 'notice' issued?


  3. #3
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative Crocdoc Highly informative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jul 2009
    I am in
    Edinburgh
    Posts
    1,337

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    Have you contacted this company and can you confirm that it is headed parking chargeicon NOTICE


  4. #4
    Gold Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Download our toolbar
    ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,894

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    In Scotland there is no chance of anyone recovering anything from you as there is no such thing as trespass so just ignoreicon any letter that doesnt arrive with a red county courticon stamp on it. If they are stupid enough to issue a summons then that is easily defeated by demanding "strict proof" of claim by claimant.


  5. #5
    Basic Account Holder argyllgal Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    I spent almost 300 at Homebase in Greenock only to be hit a week later with a Contractural parking chargeicon Notice from G24 Ltd. They want 100 from me which will be reduced to 60 if I pay within 14 days. My "crime"? I parked in the Homebase car park for 143 minutes which was 53 minutes over the permitted 90 minutes. I am seething especially as the signage was very poor, I was not aware that there were any restrictions and I do not recall entering into any contract,
    I have read various opinions and have decided to ignoreicon this letter. Is this the right thing to do? Has anyone actually been taken to court? Like other people, I just need a bit of reassurance.


  6. #6
    Basic Account Holder kirkbyinfurnesslad Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    558

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    ignoreicon as in Scotland


  7. #7
    Site Team havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jun 2006
    I am in
    Crawley
    Posts
    5,071

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    I refer to your invoice dated the xxxxxx

    In response, I would ask you to note the following.
    The registered keeper/owner of a vehicle is under no obligation whatsoever to provide details of the driver or any other information to a commercial company of no legal status of any description. (Scottish Jurisdiction).

    In addition, liability for payment could only be determined by a Sherriff under Scottish Civil Law and such demands should not be confused in any way with Penalty Charge Notices issued under the terms of a Road Traffic Order.

    Furthermore,, where a ticket has been issued under the law of contract to a vehicle which although allowed to park on the land, is in breach of the conditions relating to parking, the driver could argue that the charge being demanded is so high that it amounts to a penalty and is therefore unlawful under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999.

    What the regulations state

    A contractual term which has not been individually negotiated shall be regarded as unfair if, contrary to the requirement of good faith, it causes a significant imbalance in the parties’ rights and obligations arising under the contract, to the detriment of the consumer.

    A term shall always be regarded as not having been individually negotiated when it has been drafted in advance and the consumer has therefore not been able to influence the substance of the term.
    The previous paragraphs are also supported by the Scottish case of Castaneda and Others v. Clydebank Engineering and Shipbuilding Co., Ltd. (1904) 12 SLT 498 the House of Lords held that a contractual party can only recover damages for actual or liquidated losses incurred from a breach of contract

    Transferral to a debt collection agency and the threat of additional charges is also in my opinion questionable for the following reasons taken from the Office of Fair Trading Debt Collection Guidance.


    2.6 Paragraph H.
    Ignoring and/or disregarding claims that debts have been settled or are disputed and continuing to make unjustified demands for money.

    2.8 Paragraph A
    Sending demands for payment to an individual when it is uncertain that they are the debtor in question.

    2.8 Paragraph J
    Requiring an individual to supply information to prove they are not the debtor in question.

    2.10 Paragraph B
    Misleading debtors into believing that they are legally liable to pay collection charges when this is not the case, for example, when there is no contractual provision. .

    I am also aware that I am under no obligation to engage in any way with debt collection agents.

    In Conclusion, the contents of this correspondence should not be considered as a letter of appeal, but as total denial of liability..

    I hope this clearly outlines my position.

    Yours faithfully


  8. #8
    Basic Account Holder argyllgal Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    Has anyone actually sent a copy of this letter and, if so, what response have they had?


  9. #9
    Site Team havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jun 2006
    I am in
    Crawley
    Posts
    5,071

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    The response is they go after some other easy target and not you.


  10. #10
    Basic Account Holder argyllgal Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    I sent a letter denying liability and have now received a "final notice". G24 are now demanding 100 saying that "you (as the registered keeper) are now liable to pay the parking chargeicon and we have the right to take recovery action against you". If, after 28 days the parking chargeicon is not paid they will take further steps to recover the amount owed by forwarding the outstanding amount to a debt recovery agency and additional charges may arise if they have to do so.

    I have no intentions of paying but just wondered if this would have any affect on my credit rating?


  11. #11
    Site Team havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella Authoritative havinastella's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jun 2006
    I am in
    Crawley
    Posts
    5,071

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    Quote Originally Posted by argyllgal View Post
    I sent a letter denying liability and have now received a "final notice". G24 are now demanding 100 saying that "you (as the registered keeper) are now liable to pay the parking chargeicon and we have the right to take recovery action against you". If, after 28 days the parking chargeicon is not paid they will take further steps to recover the amount owed by forwarding the outstanding amount to a debt recovery agency and additional charges may arise if they have to do so.

    I have no intentions of paying but just wondered if this would have any affect on my credit rating?
    None whatsoever.


  12. #12
    Gold Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Download our toolbar
    ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,894

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    In Scotland the PoFA doesnt apply so it is for the company to prove that you were the driver at the time. Did you admit being the driver? if you didnt their claim is dead in the water as without proof of who was driving at the time they cannot even begin to chase the RK of the vehicle, which they appear to be doing so you can claim for harassment by them. As for the rest of the wording of their letter, it is all hot air. Passing it on to a DCAicon just means that you will get some more letters telling you to pay up and probably adding another 50 to the supposed debt but this is a worthless as the original letters. This again, has no legal basis so no-one is going to take you to court because if you defend any action they may well be in BIG trouble and lose the legal right to pursue anyone for debt in the future via the court process as well as costing them good money.


  13. #13
    Basic Account Holder argyllgal Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    4

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    G24 do not know who was driving the car and I have not given them this information. I have informed them that under Scottish jurisdiction the registered keeper/owner of a vehicle is under no obligation whatsoever to provide details of the driver or any other information to a commercial company of no legal status of any description. So it does appear that they are harassing me as I haven't just rolled over and paid up. Should I write to them again or just ignoreicon?

    I just wish more people would stand up to these bullies as they are taking advantage of people's fear and/or indifference.

    Thanks for everyone's support as sometimes it's a bit worrying when you have kept on the straight and narrow all your life and then something like this happens!


  14. #14
    Gold Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Download our toolbar
    ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative ericsbrother Highly informative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    3,894

    Default Re: TnC Parking Enforcement Notice

    If you want to pay for a stamp and continue playing letter tennis then by all means reply but I think that they will cut their losses and leave you alone soon. Sending out pointless drivel costs them money so as long as it doesnt really bother you I would leave them alone and file away all the correspondence in case you do feel like hitting them back at some point if it all gets a bit too much.



Viewing CAG on a small screen? Switch to the mobile version of the site

Reclaim the Right Ltd. - reg.05783665 in the UK reg. office:- 923 Finchley Road London NW11 7PE