Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

£19.99 + £1.50 (P&P)

+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 16 of 16
  1. #1
    Basic Account Holder RealName Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    75

    Default Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    The other day when I bought a ticket, the conductor on board the train told me I was travelling in the wrong direction.
    I told him that I wasn't as I'd looked online and it suggested this route as it was the quickest on the way there.

    When he input the data on the machine he confirmed that I was correct.
    I asked if the ticket could be an any permitted route ticket as I would be travelling back the other way.
    He told me that while 'any permitted' meant I could travel in either direction,
    once I had started travelling I would be restricted to that route,
    meaning I would have to come back in the same direction.

    Is this correct?

    I suspect he might be wrong as the National Rail site says I only have to purchase one ticket to travel up one way and back the other.
    I've travelled different ways there and back many times in the past and this has never been an issue before.

    I also bought a ticket which I thought would be incredibly complicated to purchase in the past due to the fact that I was travelling to four different stations,
    three of which were on separate routes, and

    National Rail Enquiries told me I could just buy an any route permitted ticket to one of the stations I was travelling to and it would be fine.


  2. #2
    Gold Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Download our toolbar
    sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    5,637

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Sounds like you have had your question answered by National Rail Enquiries.

    Please Note

    The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

    I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

    Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  3. #3
    Basic Account Holder RealName Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    75

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by sailor sam View Post
    Sounds like you have had your question answered by National Rail Enquiries.
    Not really. That was two years ago. I don't know if the rules have changed since. Unless you're confirming that the guard on board the train was wrong when he told me I'd have to travel back the same way?


  4. #4
    Gold Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Download our toolbar
    sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam Authoritative sailor sam's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    5,637

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by RealName View Post
    Not really. That was two years ago. I don't know if the rules have changed since. Unless you're confirming that the guard on board the train was wrong when he told me I'd have to travel back the same way?
    If it's a normal A to B ticket and not an advance type, then AFAIK you can use any direct route. For example; you can't go in the wrong direction, get off and do a bit of shopping then travel back the way you came to get to your original destination but you can travel towards you destination using any 'permitted' route which includes using a return ticket.

    Must of been a new guard or something.

    Please Note

    The advice I offer will be based on the information given by the person needing it. All my advice is based on my experiences and knowledge gained in working in the motor and passenger transport industries in various capacities. Although my advice will always be sincere, it should be used as guidence only.

    I would always urge to seek face to face professional advice for clarification prior to taking any action.

    Please click my reputation 'star' button at the bottom of my profile window on the left if you found my advice useful.
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  5. #5
    Basic Account Holder firstclassx Informative firstclassx Informative firstclassx Informative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Feb 2012
    I am in
    Northern England
    Posts
    636

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Tell us the ticket you will/did have, and the exact route you wanted to to take please.

    The quickest route isn't necessarily a valid route.


  6. #6
    Basic Account Holder dreadpiratesteve Novitiate dreadpiratesteve Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    197

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    As far as I'm aware it has to be shortest, direct or reasonable route.

    So a ticket from Portsmouth to Brighton wouldn't allow you to go via Eastbourne for example.


  7. #7
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jan 2009
    I am in
    England
    Posts
    2,959

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by RealName View Post
    National Rail Enquiries told me I could just buy an any route permitted ticket to one of the stations I was travelling to and it would be fine.
    I would get National Rail Enquiries to confirm that in an email if I were you.

    As firstclassx suggests, tell us the journey you wished to make and via which stations and we'll be able to answer in more detail

    'Any permitted' does not mean you can use any route, it means you can use any of the permitted routes.


  8. #8
    Basic Account Holder RealName Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    75

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Both routes are permitted routes. The National Rail website lists both routes and the ticket costs the same price.

    The question is:

    If a journey has more than one permitted route can you travel via one of the permitted routes on the way there and via a different one of the permitted routes on the way back, providing you have an 'any permitted route' ticket?


  9. #9
    Basic Account Holder dreadpiratesteve Novitiate dreadpiratesteve Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    197

    Default

    Technically its possible, how are train/ station staff going to know which route you took on the previous journey?

    Again, which stations/ routes are you talking about?


  10. #10
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jan 2009
    I am in
    England
    Posts
    2,959

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    If a ticket is valid by either of two permissible routes then yes. I cannot see any reason why you should not go outward via one route and return via the other

    As a simple example: an open return ticket from Stevenage to London Kings Cross will be valid to travel out to London via Welwyn Garden City and to return to Stevenage via Hertford North.

    Staff can often tell which route a ticket has been used on from the codes on any stamped examination mark


  11. #11
    Basic Account Holder The Urbanite Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    147

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    The details are not relevant as the OP is only questioning the principle. If a ticket has more than one permitted route, there is no requirement to return by the same route as used on the outward portion.


  12. #12
    Basic Account Holder dreadpiratesteve Novitiate dreadpiratesteve Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    197

    Default

    Re-reading the first post it could be a simple case of the OP and guard misunderstanding each other.

    It could be read that whilst the OP meant travelling on the return portion via the alternative route, the guard thought that the OP meant stopping his outbound journey to go via the alternate route having passed the interchange station in which to do so. The latter as far as I'm aware isn't possible (if the more knowledgeable guys here would like to clarify!).


  13. #13
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative Old-CodJA Authoritative

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Jan 2009
    I am in
    England
    Posts
    2,959

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by dreadpiratesteve View Post
    Re-reading the first post it could be a simple case of the OP and guard misunderstanding each other.

    It could be read that whilst the OP meant travelling on the return portion via the alternative route, the guard thought that the OP meant stopping his outbound journey to go via the alternate route having passed the interchange station in which to do so. The latter as far as I'm aware isn't possible (if the more knowledgeable guys here would like to clarify!).

    Yes, it is not possible to use a ticket to 'double-back' unless the routeing guide specifically permits it.


  14. #14
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Dec 2007
    I am in
    Hyperspace
    Posts
    1,728

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by firstclassx View Post
    Tell us the ticket you will/did have, and the exact route you wanted to to take please.

    The quickest route isn't necessarily a valid route.
    Quote Originally Posted by Old-CodJA View Post
    I would get National Rail Enquiries to confirm that in an email if I were you.

    As firstclassx suggests, tell us the journey you wished to make and via which stations and we'll be able to answer in more detail

    'Any permitted' does not mean you can use any route, it means you can use any of the permitted routes.
    Quote Originally Posted by dreadpiratesteve View Post

    Again, which stations/ routes are you talking about?



    RealName

    It Would be very helpfully to All, if you tell everyone where you travelled

    From - To

    Via

    What time did you travel

    What type of ticket did you purchase ?




    Just say No to 0870 and 0845 Numbers,Use

    http://www.saynoto0870.com/search.php
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0

  15. #15
    Basic Account Holder RealName Novitiate

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    75

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    As The Urbanite stated, I was questioning the principle, so the route I took on this particular day is irrelevant. I can confirm that both routes are valid as both National Rail and the guard on board the train that day verified this. I regularly travel different ways there and back when I'm travelling to and from multiple different locations. After hearing this from this particular guard I was worried that one day I might have a run in with a jobsworth RPO who would be able to justify issuing me with a penalty fare.

    Old-CodJA has confirmed my suspicions that this particular guard was wrong and that you are allowed to travel back via a different route providing both routes are permitted. So thank you.


  16. #16
    Classic Account Holder
    Help the CAG!!
    Make a contribution
    45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002 Highly informative 45002's Avatar

    Follow Real_CAG on Twitter

    Cagger since
    Dec 2007
    I am in
    Hyperspace
    Posts
    1,728

    Default Re: Any Permitted Route - National Rail

    Quote Originally Posted by RealName View Post
    As The Urbanite stated, I was questioning the principle, so the route I took on this particular day is irrelevant. I can confirm that both routes are valid as both National Rail and the guard on board the train that day verified this. I regularly travel different ways there and back when I'm travelling to and from multiple different locations. After hearing this from this particular guard I was worried that one day I might have a run in with a jobsworth RPO who would be able to justify issuing me with a penalty fare.

    Old-CodJA has confirmed my suspicions that this particular guard was wrong and that you are allowed to travel back via a different route providing both routes are permitted. So thank you.
    So what have you got to hide !

    You ask for help but won't answer the question as asked to here http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...=1#post4220420

    How odd ....

    Just say No to 0870 and 0845 Numbers,Use

    http://www.saynoto0870.com/search.php
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0


Viewing CAG on a small screen? Switch to the mobile version of the site

Reclaim the Right Ltd. - reg.05783665 in the UK reg. office:- 923 Finchley Road London NW11 7PE