Lucid vs Smile ***WON AFTER 6 DAYS***

**lucid** · 8th October 2006 15:49

Hi everyone,

Well I'm pretty confident that this is going to be nothing in relation to the battle me and Mindzai are currently having with Lloyds icon

, but unfortunately I've had to begin this whole process with Smile and Cahoot.:o I was so confident that I was managing my money well but one small mistake with my money for each account has left me with new charges.

I went £1.77 overdrawn with my Smile account and was stupidly under the impression that, like with my Lloyds account, I had a £10 overdraft icon

buffer meaning I wouldn't get charged. It was £1.77 overdrawn for 10 days until some money was paid in. Anyway I logged into my account shortly after 21st September and found that my account was £65 overdrawn because they'd taken a £50 Daily Charge and a £15 Service Charge out on 21st September. As far as I was concerned I hadn't had any information through to say that I was going to be charged and I was very confused as to why I had been charged. I swiftly contacted them by secure message to ask what was going on and to ask if they could refund these charges immediately. This was the reply I got:

Hello Miss Lucid

The charge of £65.00 is for going over your agreed overdraft limit. The charges for going over your overdraft limit are:

- £15.00 service charge (this is for going over the agreed overdraft limit)

- £5.00 daily charge (for every day you're over your overdraft limit).

Our charging period runs from the 5th of one month to the 4th of the next month, with the charges applied on or as near to the 21st of the month as possible.

You were over your overdraft limit from 21st August to the 31st of August (total of 10 days at £5.00 per day, equals £50.00).

I can see that you did log into your account in this time and as soon as you noticed your account was over it's limit you either needed to transfer funds in or get in touch with us. You will have been notified of any charges which were due to be applied in your statement on 5th September.

Unfortunately I cannot refund any of the charges as no bank error has occured. You also need to make sure you are running the account within the terms and conditions icon

by not exceeding the agreed overdraft limit and making regular payments to the account.

I still didn't agree that I had received a statement that notified me of the charges so I quickly found the statement they referred to. Unfortunately I saw that I had been notified but I hadn't checked this particular statement so didn't realise. So I made arrangements as quickly as possible to get money in to cover these charges but the account was left overdrawn by £65 for 12 days. So on my latest statement I've been informed that on 23rd October they are going to take a £60 Daily Charge and a £15 Service Charge and at the moment I'm not going to be able to get any money in to cover these charges and so could receive even more charges.:o

So being very concerned that this is going to lead to stupid amounts of charges I quickly adapted a preliminary letter to send them via secure message yesterday (7th October):

I am asking you to refund the charges you have levied from my account. I understand that the regime of fees that you have applied to my account in relation to exceeding the overdraft limit is unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent consumer regulations.

I calculate that you have taken a total of £65 in charges on 21st September 2006, and that you intend to take a further £75 on 23rd October 2006. I require the charges already debited to be refunded, and the charges yet to be levied to be cancelled. Should the charges yet to be levied not be cancelled, I also require repayment of that sum.

I request that you respond to this secure message as soon as possible to confirm that you have received it. I will give you 14 days to reply to me accepting my request in principle. If you do not respond positively I shall send you a letter before action icon

giving you a further 14 days in which to act. After that I shall issue a claim at the expiry of the second deadline.

Miss Lucid

Because you can only send a maximum of 1000 characters through secure message I've had to cut out a lot of the template letter, but I'm hoping that this won't be a problem. I'm hoping that they will refund and cancel these charges - from what I've read other people have had the small charges refunded without too much hassle. But I'm not going to assume anything so am going to have to try and find a way of getting some money to cover these charges in case they do go ahead.

I have to say that I'm really shocked at Smile's charges system. I think in comparison to the other banks I've dealt with it's extremely excessive. A £5 daily charge until your account is no longer overdrawn is absolutely ridiculous, and as far as I can tell there's no maximum amount they can charge you.

I can really see how people can run into a lot of trouble with these types of charges. I think that I'll be swiftly closing my Smile account once I get these charges back as I don't want to accidentally run into any problems with them again.

So to clarify I've asked them to refund the £65 charges they have already taken and to cancel the charges of £75 they are planning to take in a couple of weeks. I'll update when I hear something back.

Lucid

Similar Threads:

ian cognito · 8th October 2006 15:54

Good luck Lucid, throught the same problem my account is £1650 overdrawn, and the amount of charges I'm claiming back? yes you've guessed it £1650! At one time I tried to keep up with them but in the end I just gave up!, those figures are to the beginning of this year, when my statements arrive, I'll see how much they've had prior to this

**lucid** · 8th October 2006 16:17

Thanks janquinny,

I wish you the best of luck with your claim. It's horrible what these charges can amount to, but keep at it and you will get them back.

Lucid

**andyhargreaves** · 9th October 2006 07:14

Originally Posted by lucid

I have to say that I'm really shocked at Smile's charges system. I think in comparison to the other banks I've dealt with it's extremely excessive. A £5 daily charge until your account is no longer overdrawn is absolutely ridiculous, and as far as I can tell there's no maximum amount they can charge you.

I can really see how people can run into a lot of trouble with these types of charges. I think that I'll be swiftly closing my Smile account once I get these charges back as I don't want to accidentally run into any problems with them again.

It is unbelievable. I guess the maximum amount they can charge you in a month is £155 (31 x £5). Plus the £15, of course.

Maybe they absurdity of their charges is the reason they are so fast at paying up when challenged. Think how much they would stand to lose if a case went to court, made loads of publicity, and all of their customers started similar claims...

Hopefully we'll be smiling soon!!

Andy

**lucid** · 9th October 2006 09:58

Originally Posted by andyhargreaves

It is unbelievable. I guess the maximum amount they can charge you in a month is £155 (31 x £5). Plus the £15, of course.

Yes you're right there is a maximum they can charge you in a month. But when compared to Lloyds icon

who charge you a maximum of 3 overdraft icon

excess fees a month (£90) then it's a lot more. Plus Lloyds only add a further charge if the overdraft increases where as Smile charge you no matter what. It's very worrying. But from what I've read they pay up much more quickly than Lloyds do and don't appear to be such bullies.

Good luck with your claim Andy.

Lucid

**tim2718281** · 9th October 2006 12:18

Perhaps we should start a thread to see which bank has the most ludicrous charges.

Smile's £65 for being £1.77 overdrawn for ten days has to be a contender!

Tim

**Jase1982** · 9th October 2006 13:43

I agree.

I went 62p over my agreed overdraft icon

and they charged me £145. That was for a few payments they 'had' to make. It always makes me laugh when they send you one of those stupid E-mails, "Dear Mr Rowe, although there was not enough funds in your account, we have 'had' to pay them"

yeah, cheers for that, here's a bucket load of cash!

They also raised my overdraft limit for me, then lowered it without informing me and charged me an overlimit fee for the privelage. When I challenged it, they said they had informed me about 2 months ago. They never actually specified a date!

**techtalkonline** · 9th October 2006 22:35

It is also worth keeping an eye on any D/D or cheques etc during any period you are O/D. If it happens that one of these gets unpaid due to the account being overdrawn, then not only will you receive the charges as stated above, but also an additional "Commission" charge of £25 for every DD/Standing order or Cheque not paid. This really bumps up the charges. That £65 in 10 days can suddenly become £100's quite easily!

Regards,
Colin.

**lucid** · 10th October 2006 07:45

Thanks Colin.

Fortunately I have no Direct Debits set up for my accounts - that's left with Mindzai's account.

But thanks for the advice anyway. I can really see how these carges spiral out of control - especially with Smile's systems.:o

Lucid

**lucid** · 13th October 2006 14:26

6 days of waiting after sending the prelim and I've won!

I thought I'd check my account this afternoon to see if I'd received a secure message and I actually had:o - from the Manager.

Hello Miss Lucid

I'm sorry you're not happy with us at the moment. As a gesture of goodwill icon

I've refunded the £65 back to your account and cleared the charges that were due to debit in October.

As per the terms and conditions icon

of the account which you agreed to when you applied, please make sure you either pay in your salary/pension or a regular amount of £1000. You also need to monitor your account carefully to make sure you don't exceed the limit and therefore, avoid further charges.

At this stage we are required to let you know that smile will regard your complaint as closed if we do not receive a reply within 8 weeks of this response.

If you remain unhappy you may ask for your complaint to be referred to the Financial Ombudsman icon

Service. Full details are on our website, Redirecting to Smile Production Site / talk to us / complaints.

Regards

Jayne Jones
smile Complaints Team

So I've had my charges refunded and they're not going to take the further charges. I'm so relieved it was dealt with that quickly. Fortunately I did get lent some money by my generous dad to safeguard me against getting any further charges, but luckily I don't need to use it.

I guess it was so quick because it was a very small amount but still I'm very happy with the way they dealt with this in comparison to Lloyds icon

.

Still, I think i will close this account very soon to avoid getting into anymore trouble again. One comment that slightly confuses me is "As per the terms and conditions of the account which you agreed to when you applied, please make sure you either pay in your salary/pension or a regular amount of £1000." I don't remember seeing anything when I opened the account to say that you had to pay in £1000 - I'm assuming they mean per month. The reason i opened this account was because I had a very low income and Martin Lewis (MoneySavingExpert.com ad-free, free to use, Consumer Revenge!) had recommended it for people with incomes under £6500 per year. But still I won't worry too much about it.

Good luck to the rest of you. Lucid

ian cognito · 13th October 2006 15:42

Wonderful news and thanks for the good luck message, Just received my statements from Smile so I will be going through them this evening, estimated about £2k, thats see if they pay that out as quickly!

**midge61** · 13th October 2006 15:57

Congratulations that was quick. I've just sent my lba icon

so it would be nice if that was settled without court. Well done once again.

**techtalkonline** · 13th October 2006 21:39

Superb news! Congratulations!!!

I have still to get any response to my own claim of £1,227 8 days after filing my claim with the county court icon

. So i guess you are correct in that yours was quick due to the small amount.

Well done lucid.

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