Morgan Stanley defaulted on CCA request. Help Please.

**blackrain** · 13th September 2006 09:50

I posted (by recoorded delivery) a request for a true signed copy of the CCA for my credit card on the 25th July. 12 days passed with no response and now more thean a month has passed on top of that.

What do I do next? Do I right again pointing out that they have committed an offence? Who should I complain to and and should I stop paying instalments until they supply the document?

I'm in a parculiar situation because this account was closed and they reopened it over the phone one year later when I enquired about getting a new account. Thus there will be no new signed agreement because it never existed.

Advice please I don't know what I should be doing now....

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**blackrain** · 13th September 2006 21:15

bump. anyone?

**nathal** · 13th September 2006 22:58

there are template letters to send

**BankFodder** · 14th September 2006 09:52

I'm afraid that we are rather light on CCA stuff at the moment. We really need to remedy this.

I owuld have thought that you should adopt a course of beviour which is demonstrably squeaky clean.
This mean that I think that depite their failure to respond with the agreement within the time period, I would write to them again and point out thatthey have not complied but this time give them 7 days.

I'm interest icon

in the way the new account was opened.
Do you have any evidence of the closure of the original account?
You say that it has been re-opened. Does this mean that it has the same account number?

Are they likley to say that the account was never actually closed - that it was just not used?
If the account was really closed then your "re-opening" is in fact a new opening and a fresh contract and they would have to comply with all of the requirements for a new contract.

**Karnevil** · 14th September 2006 10:00

I am in the same position as you at the moment. The actual time lines applicable to the CCA request is 12 working days from receipt, when you can put the debt on hold and discontinue payments. After a further 30 working days they have committed an offence and the debt becomes uneforceable.

I believe the procedure is to write to them giving them an outline of your position, ie. you believe the debt to be unenforceable and intend to stop making payments, and offer a further 7 days for them to produce the documents, before you report the matter to trading standards.

Is their an outstanding balance on the card ?
Have you made payments off of this balance ?

**angry cat** · 14th September 2006 10:02

Blackrain- You must obtain the correct advise on how you can deal with the matter!!! As you are aware, I am in a similar position to you with MS. Take a look at the last page of my Angry Cat V Morgan Stanley thread, which is listed under General. You will see from my last post that I have made a COMPLAINT to Trading Standards and am now waiting for their imminent correct advise. Blackrain, I suggest that you pick up the phone and dial 08454 040506 - this is Consumer Direct the cunsumer arm or the OFT and once they accept your complaint, they will then pass the matter to your local TS. Please keep us all posted.........and GUYS, please remember that this area of official Gov. Regulations is extremely complicated.....Please do NOT post any comments regarding CCA unless you are absolutely 100% Sure of your Facts. Because a member could misconstrue a 'well intentioned view' JMHO Love AC

**Karnevil** · 14th September 2006 10:15

http://www.oft.gov.uk/NR/rdonlyres/7...king%20days%22

relevant legislation - page 26 is the 12 working days and £1 fee statement

also look at the Consumer Credit Act, sections 77 and 78

and read this thread - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...upply+original

**blackrain** · 14th September 2006 11:06

Thanks all. Bankfodder, I paid off the required amount to clear card and was confirmed that card account was closed. I received a statement about 6 months later with a charge on it for Card Protection so I rang up and was told that it shouldn't have happened as the card was indeed closed. They removed the amount and sent me a revised statement.

When I requested my six years statements recently I noticed they had left 18p interest icon

on from that charge all the way through until I reopened the account whereupon it was promptly removed. I never received any statements with this 18p on it nor was I ever asked to pay it.

When I phoned about a new account it was again confirmed on the phone to me that my account was closed. They then said they could reopen it. The accouont has the same number. I do have a balance and I have been making payments.

**MARTIN3030** · 14th September 2006 12:33

This now becomes a trading standards issue.
Consumer direct are likely to direct you to your local trading standards.
Your local trading standards will liase with the area TS of the DCA icon

This is as long as there is a "home relationship "
A home relationship gives TS in the other area powers to intervene,if there is non set up then your local office will act directly with the DCA.
Contact your local TS and have all the info at hand....dates etc.

The debt is clearly now unenforceable,and there are a couple of options open to you.

**angry cat** · 14th September 2006 13:36

Hi MARTIN 3030 I was simply trying to assist Blackrain through my own experience, because I am in a very similar situation to him. Now I obtained the phone number for my local Ashford Kent TS; phoned them and my call was somehow relayed through to Consumer Direct. I explained that I had rung TS to register a complaint, to which they replied we are the consumer complaint handling service for the OFT. I was then asked what is your complaint about, I related my concerns including the CCA non compliance by MS. They did take my complaint seriously and I was advised that they were now passing my complain over to TS to investigate and that TS will be contacting me within the next 5 days. Therefore, I await the Ashford Kent Trading Standards call. Please note that I am in the same predicament as Blackrain; meaning I have requested a signed copy of my original Agreement under the CCA 1974, request received 4 July 2006 but to date I am have not been supplied with the Doc. I also did not know what my next step should be, therefore I telephoned TS to register my complaint and obtain the correct advice regarding the CCA legislation and how one handles the issue. Love AC

**MARTIN3030** · 14th September 2006 13:50

AC you have done the right thing.
I am fortunate in that our TS have local numbers and a big office in our town hall.

Initially I contacted TS who referred me to consumer direct.
Consumer direct then referred me back to TS.
I am in contact with 2 people from my TS and have their e mails and direct dial tel Nos.

Keep at it.

**angry cat** · 14th September 2006 15:02

Okay and Yes Martin, I am desperately trying to deal with the CCA non compliance issue correctly and I will of course, post the TS result/findings for other members information. An emphasis must be placed upon the fact that there is little information regarding this legislation on the CAG icon

forum and I think that it is important that by obtaining the clear facts regarding this matter, will greatly benefit us all. I have myself attempted to get some clear advice regarding this CCA issue by posting questions, just as Blackrain is doing but the advice that comes back is contradictory. Obviously it is wondeful when members offer their views. However, in this instance the advise must be 'Rock Solid' & 'Crystal Clear' JMHO and love from AC

**angry cat** · 14th September 2006 21:42

My apologies to you Blackrain about the chat with MARTIN3030! However, the subject was also relevant to you.... Anyhow, very swift action from Consumer Direct and they kept to their word by passing my Complaint to my local Trading Standards, who emailed and phoned me today and...TS really did take my Complaint on board. Blackrain, do the same, just pick up your phone tomorrow and dial #08454 040506 register your Complaint, get advice and start off the whole process. Love AC

**Aphex Twin** · 14th September 2006 23:01

just out of curiosity AC did you write the 7 day compliance letter suggested at the top of this thread or not?

The deadline for CCA compliance on 4 of my debts ran out today so I’m unsure if I should send a further letter or contact TS tomorrow as you have done.

**MARTIN3030** · 14th September 2006 23:08

You dont have to give further time.
The only exeption to the additional 30 days is if it falls on a weekend say Sat or Sun whereby you would have to give them till the Monday.

Contact TS and dont give them more time !

**blackrain** · 19th October 2006 15:16

Well, they finally sent me the CCA.....or no they didnt. They forgot to put it in the envelope. Genius. Also. My account that was closed in 2002 was reopened in 2003 after I phoned because they were able to take a 'Closure Block' off the account....WTF....Surely if an account is closed it's closed. You can't reopen it without a new Credit Check and CCA surely?

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