Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

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  1. #1
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Hi, can any one help?
    Whilst out for a walk last weekend the car that we had parked next to set on fire (arson suspected)
    Our car was badly damage and may be written off.

    We only got back to it as the fire crew was leaving.

    The owner of the burnt out car refused to give her details for us to claim against.

    Can we force her and claim off her insurance or do we have to claim off our insurance?

    Thanks.


  2. #2
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Hi Zeff

    Welcome to CAGicon
    The guys will advise as soon as they are available. Thread moved.

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  3. #3
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    You have to claim off your own Insurance. You can't prove them liable for their car catching fire and therefore damaging your car.


  4. #4
    Basic Account Holder Mallrat83 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Unfortunately as its already been confirmed, you will have to claim from your own insurance company.


  5. #5
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Thats very unfair.
    i was parked two spaces away (the space between us was empty) her car was gutted, the one parked next to it on the other side was very badly damaged as was mine.
    There were witnesses to which car was the cause of the fire.

    If i was parked outside a house i would be anle to claim off them, afterall this was not my fault why should i loose my NCB?


  6. #6
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Thats very unfair.

    I was parked two speces away with an empty space between us, the car that was parked next to her on the other side was very bady damaged as was mine.

    There were witnesses as to which car started the fire.

    If i were parked next to a house that caught fire i would be able to claim from their insurance.

    Why should i loose 12 year NCB over something that was nothing to do with me?


  7. #7
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Thats very unfair.

    My car was parked 2 spaces away with an empty space between us. The car that was parked on the other side of hers was also toast.

    There were witnesses as to which car was ablaze and as such caused mine to be damaged.

    If i were parked next to a house that set on fire im sure i would be able to claim from their cover.
    Why should i loose 12 years NCB over something that was not my fault?


  8. #8
    Basic Account Holder Mwynci Informative Mwynci Informative Mwynci Informative

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    I sympathise with you,

    That's the law I'm afraid, it may seem unfair, it’s also unfair to the person whose car was set fire to (assuming they are innocent), why should they also pay out for your car?

    Regarding the house, only if the owner deliberately set fire to it (providing they were not a nut job with diminished responsibility) could you have any chance. If it were an accident (chip pan, bonfire gone wrong, electrical etc) then again they are not negligent.

    If it's proven the owner of the car was complicit in the arson, then you may have a different case.

    You won't lose all your ncb, 2 years from your max ncb (which usually is only allowed up to 4,5,or 6 yearsicon, there are others on the board who will have a better understanding of this than me).


  9. #9
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Nothing to add to Mwynci. It is all about legal liability, not moral responsibility or consequential cover from the first loss event.

    If you park next to anything that catches fire, you are just plain unlucky. You would have to prove that the owner of the car that caught fire was legally liable which would be difficult, to be able to claim from them.

    If you have a no claims discount you will lose 2 years worth or if you only have 1 year it will reduced to 0 or if you have protected no claims it won't reduce (unless you have had another claim) but your premium from renewal will be loaded.


  10. #10
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    so i have to claim and pay for it on my next insurance, something seams very unfair about this, if i had hit the car and it was my fault then fair enough, you would asume the 'fire' part of a policy would cover other poor sods that get caught up in it, after all, 'third parties are covered on a TPFT policy........so what am i if not a third party?


  11. #11
    Basic Account Holder pigboy306 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    MY Renault Megane decided to set itself on fire, no fault of mine. I had it for 5 months before it decided to do this, I had 10 years NCB which wasn't protected.
    The car is a write off, how much NCB will i lose


  12. #12
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Quote Originally Posted by pigboy306 View Post
    MY Renault Megane decided to set itself on fire, no fault of mine. I had it for 5 months before it decided to do this, I had 10 years NCB which wasn't protected.
    The car is a write off, how much NCB will i lose
    The reduced NCD will be based on the usual maximum NCB they allow for the discount. So if this is normally 5 years, then at the renewal you will have 3 years NCB, having lost 2 years NCB for the claim.


  13. #13
    Basic Account Holder pigboy306 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    well i did have 9Years NCB so you reckon i should have 7 after the claim?


  14. #14
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Quote Originally Posted by pigboy306 View Post
    well i did have 9Years NCB so you reckon i should have 7 after the claim?
    Ask your Insurers. They may only allow you 3 years NCB from renewal.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Quote Originally Posted by zeff737 View Post
    so i have to claim and pay for it on my next insurance, something seams very unfair about this, if i had hit the car and it was my fault then fair enough, you would asume the 'fire' part of a policy would cover other poor sods that get caught up in it, after all, 'third parties are covered on a TPFT policy........so what am i if not a third party?
    Is your NCB protected?


  16. #16
    Basic Account Holder wonky100 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    I think I'm going to upset everyone here except zeff737!

    Car A is the car that was set on fire and car B is zeff737's car. Car A is insured and this insurance includes third party liabilities. As a result of car A being set on fire or it just happening, as can happen, car B suffers damage. The proximate cause of the damage to car B is the fire at car A. Who's to say that this wasn't by someone with a grudge against car A? Will never be able to prove this.

    In the first instance, I'd obviously be telling my own insurers but surely they'll want to make as much a recovery as possible against car A's insurance? Times are hard!

    Zeff737, have you spoken with your own insurers about this? What do they say?

    Would love to hear how you get on. Both hubby and I are insurance geeks!


  17. #17
    Basic Account Holder Mwynci Informative Mwynci Informative Mwynci Informative

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Wonky I think your missing the point over third party liabilties, proximate cause was the arson attack to the car, therefore the real third party (or the at fault third party)was the arsonist who holds the negligence, not the owner of the vehicle that was set fire to who (unless proven there is a connection). The fact about a grudge makes no difference unless car a was somehow involved in the act of setting fire, if someone had a grudge against me, punched me and my blood went on your shirt, would I be liable for the cleaning bill? (let's not discover that one!)
    This does of course differ from the likes of RTA liability for thefts where the driver is named.
    You never know though the insurer's could have made a recovery (it can happen if the third party's insurers are not that good), flogging a dead horse however can sometimes be as costly as the recovery you are seeking when you take into consideration staff costs, time to keep the file open etc.
    Good though, I like to hear a follow up to the claim liability cases and hear other opinions.


  18. #18
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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mwynci View Post
    Wonky I think your missing the point over third party liabilties, proximate cause was the arson attack to the car, therefore the real third party (or the at fault third party)was the arsonist who holds the negligence, not the owner of the vehicle that was set fire to who (unless proven there is a connection). The fact about a grudge makes no difference unless car a was somehow involved in the act of setting fire, if someone had a grudge against me, punched me and my blood went on your shirt, would I be liable for the cleaning bill? (let's not discover that one!)
    Point well made.

    It would be a bit like a robbery taking place, with a room full of people. Wonky is the first person to have his wallet taken, so everyone else in the room holds him responsible when their wallets/purses get taken.


  19. #19
    Basic Account Holder pigboy306 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Quote Originally Posted by unclebulgaria67 View Post
    Ask your Insurers. They may only allow you 3 years NCB from renewal.
    I asked my insurers, and they said as i hadnt protected i lose all the NCB. Insurers are Premier through INSURE. So avoid and protect the NCB!


  20. #20
    Basic Account Holder zeff737 Novitiate

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    Default Re: car damaged by fire, who pays?

    Well all, im delighted to say that my car was insured as a classic car, which you dont build no claims discount from but you do tend to get considered better in claims like this.

    Our insurance company have claimed all costs from the other (cows) insurance and it could not be construde to be in any way our fault........

    Which is just and fair as far as we can see. why the hell should i loose out for someone elses misfortune! .......it turns out the car was torched by someone she ripped off...........over a drug deal!!!



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