Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.
The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights
a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.
I currently have a Barclaycard (which I did take out) which I am in dispute with and was passed to Mercers, I sent them a letter in june 09 basically telling them that as a third party intervener that they have no right to interfere in my affairs and asked them for there contract. 'NO RESPONCE'.
Then in july I sent Mercers an account in dispute Notice of conditional agreement and request for clarification. 'NO RESPONCE'.
so this account is in seriously in despite.
I also had a Morgan stanley card which I was paying off at £5 a month, this then went to Goldfish (with not notification of assigment by recorded or other post).. I then started to pay GF the £5 a month, in june my friend sent GF a letter in June 09 'Notice of request to cease harassment' as he believed the debt was unenforceable, In this letter he asked for 5 proofs of claim of contracts etc, data protection act, telography act 1949 etc.
I then received a letter from Barclaycard re the morgan stanley/GF account/ but no account or ref numbers :? regarding my notice I sent to GF.
In this letter Miss Shaw customer relations manager telling me Mercers will continue to telephone me, when infact they havent even sent me a letter or called me yet regarding the GF account! (but have on the other one)..... but in this letter she talks/responds of/to both accounts i have sent letters to is she allowed to join these two totally separate accounts as she is responding to a 'notice' sent to GF regarding only one account???? i thought they must be responded to individually????
shortly after I received a credit card statement from Barclaycard (Platinum account) with the same account number as the previous Morgan stanley/ Goldish card.
It appears that this is now a barclaycard account and thay have set me up with a Platinum account to run it from.
On January 6th 2010 i checked my on line banking for my Barclays account and a payment had been made to Barclaycard for this account.
I rang them to find out what this was for and they said it was a 'set off' as i have a barclays bank account.
my friend has just reported it to the police as a theft and fraud, they are calling us back to make and appointment to go into the police station to further investigate it for us and give us a crime number, we hope!
Does anybody have any thoughts on this?
I thought they couldnt respond to independant correspondance, ie one letter dealing with one account and another dealing with the other account in there same letter, am i right?
they have also disregarded my request in writting to not telephone me, and told me that they WILL continue, surely that is not on?
now my main question is.... Can they use this 'set off' if i have sent the previous holder (GF) a letter asking for validity/ proof of contracts, surely the account is in the beginings of being in dispute, and shouldnt have been sent to barclaycard anyway let alone help themselves to my money.
we went to see the bank manager the same day i found out about the removal of my money (£26.70) and showed her my notices etc to both accounts etc, my friend told her she is breaking the Banking Code if she doesnt help put the money back as it is preventing me from paying my priority bills, barclaycard said earlier in the day to me, on recorded telephone calls twice that they have looked at my bank accounts and worked out what money i need to live on and taken the rest!!!???? little do they know i had written a cheque against that account which will now be returned and I will encounter bank charges, but she has agreed not to charge me for this, her advice was to empty the account, which I immediately did and i have both electric and gas on key meters so they are leaving me without means to pay the cheque etc......... barclay card told her NO we arent refunding the money....... so hence the police.
Very similar thing has happend to me last week, i am writing an official letter of complaint to barclycard as they have left me without money to pay for my day to day living and electricity, food ect.
I have made this an official complaint to barclycard and i am giving them 7 days to refund me my money then i am going to complain to fos.
I have now closed my Barclays account and have requested my wages to be paid into my Nat West account.
I think it might help if you could do the same (close account and get another current account from someone else)
Good luck in your fight against Barclycard.
Oh , by the way , they are aloud to take money from your barclays account to pay your barclycard bill , but they should not leave you with no money to live on.(that is why i have now closed my barclays account.)
However as both my and your barclycard accounts are in dispute i am hoping this will help us get our money back.
Well my friend has been on the phone again this morning! And they have just refunded my money they took!
he's still on the phone now, will get him to update this later
today we got a joke of a CCA from Barclays after they recieved my notices.
right on the first one the XXX is where there was a card number but ive not seen it before, its not my morgan stanley acc number, or the new barclay card or goldfish acc no's..... any ideas?
up the left hand colum where ive put ACC NUMBER, is where someone hand wrote the morgan stanley acc no.
also there is no sig in the additional card holder section cause i didnt sign it...... A while after i signed this (6months plus) i got my ex partner on as an additional card holder, he signed nothing and neither did I, for him.
am i bound for his spending on this agreement.
im thinking it doesnt have the prescribed terms, ????
no letters/notices of "notification of assignment" which must be sent recorded delivery..... no nothing..... we requested contracts from goldsfish 6 months ago! and now even the original CCA looks a bit iffy.
so there attempt at a CCA today, it crossed me in the road returning from posting a notice to request information, fairly ironic as i have made no mention regarding CPR as yet,( i have in the letter posted today) but they have in there letter with the attempted CCA, the letter with it goes .......in line with CPR we have provided you with sufficient info to allow me to understand there position.......... (I tell you what understand this .... your a smiley eel lol)
it goes on...., while there is no formal obligation for us to show you jack **** in regard to answer/prove the validation to the debt correspondence........... . so i get it i bend over, they dont even lube me up and WAYHEYthe slipped me one..... a dodgy CCA I mean
lets see what we get back from barclaycard this week in return to my notices etc.
I have merged your 2 threads so you now have this one, here in the BC forum.
This should be used for one account only. I note you mention there are 2 a/c's so, if you want to discuss the other, start another thread for it in this forum.
Any help and advice is offered in good faith, based solely on my own knowledge and on experience gathered from this site. I am not qualified to offer legal or financial advice, which you should seek from an expert before making any important decisions. My opinions are therefore offered without liability.
Any help and advice is offered in good faith, based solely on my own knowledge and on experience gathered from this site. I am not qualified to offer legal or financial advice, which you should seek from an expert before making any important decisions. My opinions are therefore offered without liability.
hi slick132,
yes i thought the CCA did have some of the terms, but is 'some' enough, we sent a CPR31.16 off to them, i was posting it as that cca turned up in the post.
on the piece of paper with my sig, it doesnt have any terms just stuff about personal data, no amounts, credit limits etc.......... does it not ALL have to be on the same piece of paper and my sig below it?
I did read that thread, off for another go now but it was a little over my head
if i have to write another notice to them, i will be qouting the man that designed the CCA and his statement about it, basically he says it is up to the lender to get it laid out right, if not then the lender deserves to loose out, so i cannot see how a judge etc can start over ruling them, ie some cases where the judge said we dont even need the CCA, if the lender can show payments from the borrower!!! WTF is that about, make it up as you go along GRRRR. in my mind thats fraud, we havent got a contract but you will still pay me!
yes my friend spoke to them on the phone, he had to scream blue murder at them before they said they would refund it............ i think when he said i have reported this to the police as fraud, forgery of a legal/financial instrument and theft, there ears pricked up and agreed to pay the money back. the money appeared back in the account 3 days later.
on that note i am on benifits etc and we have spoken to them asking when they would send a letter asking for my financial situation and informing that they intend to use the 'set off', they said we saend the letter the day we take the money....... sure enogh a letter came 'teling' me they are taking the money, letter dated the day the took my money.
i also added my ex partner as a second card holder after more than six months of me signing orginaly....... we have different surnames and he or i never signed anything for him..... they say he comes under my agreement, but i never signed for him to be added......... any thoughts please?
Any help and advice is offered in good faith, based solely on my own knowledge and on experience gathered from this site. I am not qualified to offer legal or financial advice, which you should seek from an expert before making any important decisions. My opinions are therefore offered without liability.
Actually Sarnie2109 this seems to be a tactic they are now using. I am sure you are aware that Calders are in fact a part of Mercers which in itself is part of Barclaycard and further is a dormant company.
We have a number of accounts in dispute with BC via our solicitors and we are now phoned by Calders/ Mercers in a varying combinations. I am sure it is done in an attempt to confuse you and to get you to make a mistake. Just don't discuss anything with them, be rude, read the riot act, do not give them chance to speak and put the phone down. They have no standing at all in law. Make them write to you and they will shoot themselves in the foot in the end. Mercers will probably send a defective default notice followed by a Calders demand for arrears hot foot on the heels of which will be a Calders demand for the full amount they say is outstanding. all of which IMVHO adds up to unlawful recission of the account. They can only then sue for any arrears outstanding NOT the full amount (which in honesty they would find hard to win). Plus we are told any charges they have tried to add from the Account in Dispute date will be recoverable. Hence the arrears can only be calculable at the date of AID from you. Hell of loss to them for not doing their jobs properly.
Thanks oilyrag, what gets me is this is account that was Morgan stanley then goldfish, then the first i know is it is now a platinum barclaycard with a totally different account number, and the same one that took money from my barclay bank account and then they reunded it!!
I am coming to the conclusion that it should become part of the standard advice from and to all all caggers that they should open another account with another bank/building society/post office whatever to ensure that they do NOT have credit cards with the same bank with whom you conduct your day to day business. We did have one account stripped by our friends Barclaycard, but a lot of very public screaming and shouting in the local branch on a Saturday morning got the money returned toute suite, plus the idiots issued all of the statements now proving beyond any reasonable doubt that they had acted unlawfully and possibly criminally on that occasion.
We opened up elsewhere and can now live in some peace of mind because we know that they are so unscrupulous that they would have tried again.
Of course they are now the subject of a criminal investigation plus our sols are waiting to ambush them where it really matters, i.e. in front of a judge in a court of law if they ever dare take us for the other accounts.
Hence always make the effort to get another account away from where the dispute is.
I couldn't agree more Oilyrag about changing banks, although what annoyed me was this was a Morgan Stanley account, so what gave Barclays the right to "offset"!!!
Well done for managing to get a criminal investigation under way, our local police are still insisting it's NOT criminal.
Wonder what would happen if it happened to PC Plod!
Hi oilyrag,
im a friend of sarnie2109's .... i rang barclay card the next day and kicked off after we had been to the bank, and they refunded it.
i now have 4 police offers including the chief inspector on charges of neglect/ dereliction of duty, as they have all refused to investigate it as a crime!!!
i rang first and got a Sargent, he said over the phone, no we wont look at it, it a civil matter. i told him right there and then that it IS a CRIME and i will be in at the station later and i will expect to see an officer.
It is every police officers duty as in their oath that; they must report ANT allegations of any REASONABLE crime.
well i think WE all know that its a crime!
So off i go to the police station, and i get a DC who says hello and opens up an interview room, before she had sat down she said were not interested in this its civil.
oh dear oh dear!
So i ask her how can she make that judgement when i she hasnt even seen the evidence, no answer. so i then ask her if she can remind me of her oath, she said i cant remember it so i reminded her of it. and said so i have reasonable cause and evidence so i want you to report it.
she then tried to explain how these big banks buy other companies everyday and buy the debts and CAN do this, so go and see a solicitor! by now i am absolutly bloody fuming internaly, but being polite still.... I asked her if she is trained in banking etc, she said no, so i said in that case you are not intitled to that opinion as an officer under oath, you may only base you opinions of the FACTS as an officer, she is sqirming now, and so she should i actually right at this time felt sick with their attitude.
Anyway she said look ill ask my sargant. she was back in under a minute, NO we are not looking at this. so i told her that i want her collar number and that i will report her for dereliction of duty and including the Sargent.
i left amazed that the police see these big banks as a law unto themselves and because they buy these debts its all ok, i explained i understood where they were coming from and explained, the CCA etc to them and where the crimes lay... i have spoken to £ serving (real) police officers and a magistrate who lives near us and they all said ITS A CRIME AND IT NEEDS REPORTING.
it is forgery of a legal instrument, ie; the BC platinum account to place the 'debt' into, way i see it is, if they just put the 'debt' into a normal acc and sent you a statement that is not a 'credit card' account run under a CCA that would be ok, but they havent! so were is the CCA for this new credit card account ????? so its a forgery!
Fraud, because of the above and fraudulently deceiving barclay's BANK into allowing them to remove the funds.
..........and plain old theft! for taking the money.
so
I call the police station the next day and say i want to report the DC and sarg, and i want a more senior officer, so i get a call the next day from the inspector.
He says we wont look at it its civil, thier like a bloody stuck record. so i say why explain your reasons. he says they are huge comanpies and they buy other companies and in your case goldfish and they are regulated by the fos!!! so i said right, he went on, and so you see they can do this
So i say ok so what about theft of the money, he said you told me they returned it, i said yes! well he says they havent stolen it then have they, i just had to say sorry im afraid your loosing me hear, so because they have put the money back there is and was never a crime, yep he said! because unless they intend to permanently deprive of those funds, there is no crime...... i was beging to think this call was a wind up, so i said right i walk into your unlocked house and take all your wifes jewellery, as im leaving out of your back door, i see you arrive home from work and bottle it, so i chuck the jewellery back in your house....... you'd let me off with that would you???!!!... erm NO of course i wouldnt, so then why not the banks then inspector??!! he changed the subject again, so i told him i WILL place him on a charge with his other officers if next time i arrive at the station its not recorded. we carried on on the hone with me explaining this all to him like he was a child, it all went over his head.
so next day in i go again to the station, this time armed with the duff CCA shown above, and said right now officers, heres what they claim entitles them to do this, and what you as the police need to show you its a CRIME, the CCA is duff so basicly officer no contract no right to touch sarnie2109's bank or money, it would be like you doing it officer..... anyway he took photo copies of everything and i left, waiting for a call from the inspector once he'd looked at it.
he calls next day and says look ive looked at this and were not investigating it as its a civil matter, so i tell him that somewhere in his office he will have a book called, butterworth police law, he was like how do you know about that? i said because i know lots of things and which is why i am being so determind you look at this CRIME. so i gave him certain bits of his book to look at and told him in the copies his officer made, he will find two very important pages, the bill of rights and the maga carta, where it says ..... no one can be forfeited money for anything unless its been before a judge, ever. and that the bill of rights says the LAW shall NEVER be kept from us or delayed etc....... he was pretty impressed that i knew so much but said he wont look at it, so i told him i was sorry but i am now going to report him and i want the chief inspector on the phone within 24 hours.
chief inspector calls and says he will get his fraud squad to look at it, i thanked him but told him i have been let down by his officers and why etc.
several days later a DC from banking fraud dept or something like it rang me, ello were not looking at this its not a crime, i asked have you looked at the peprwork, sort of, i said well i suggest you do and explained why, CCA etc. he said look barclay card bought goldfish for X amount of billions and BC are worth billions they do this all the time you need a solicitor... so i told him he will be on a charge as this is just plain moronic now.
this is a crime officer and NOBODY is above the law.
ive had nothing since, i rang the station the otherday to see whats happeing about my complaints against this lot, they told me they havent made a complaint!!!!!!!!!!!!! i went mad!
right sorry for the huge read, BUT like you oilyrag i think if you can get somewhere with this, and if i can get this investigated it will open the flood gates for people like us to get justice against these criminals, because lets face it that exactly what they are acting like this.
Trouble is the attitude of the police helps substantiate the banks 'story/view' on this that they can do what they like.
one officer said if they do this they will have to investigate every bank, hinting that it would be too much work.
and at the end of day they police wont earn a penny from this, unlike speeding tickets etc.
please dont get me wrong im not condoning people 'avin a go at the police, i was polite and told every officer that i dont want to report them but i see this as a crime, they were all pretty good about it and said it is my right to do so.
this is about, like i say, if i get this looked at it will show that they are breaking the law and hopefully stop it, and make them think twice about doing things like this again in the future.
Probably a very long shot, but if you dont help yourself not one else will i think they saying goes and i feel pretty strongly about this.
i hope i havent come across they wrong way, as after 3 policemen and a magistrate tell you its a crime and from what this site shows me, no CCA no right to the money let alone from peoples private bank accounts.
just i thought i t might give you something to speak to your solicitor about oilyrag, if he can give you more specific points to challenge the police with i think you would have better luck than me.
anyway best of luck
troubleman
P.S dont want this to disrupt sarnie2109's thread please
I was just trying to help Sarnie, but in our case we have almost a full admission from BC. On the one account that mattered, BC refused to fulfill a proper SAR from ourselves and subsequently the sols. The grounds for refusal being that they do not have to provide this information. Reason:- Under the criminal law they do not have to voluntarily provide information or evidence which incriminates them in unlawful or criminal activity. It is up to us to prove such. Well we already had enough in the atements they had provided in the normal course of events plus proof of the lies because of contradictory correspondence signed by them. It would have been nice to have it all though.
I do not hold out any hope of it coming to court in the criminal sense knowing our plod but I think a very nasty can of worms will be opened if they try to take us in their arrogance and stupidity which they do have in abundance by the way. Our sols are just waiting the chance.
best of luck to you both and keep up the good fight
any developments or further communications from Barc/Mercers/Caulders/ etc. ?
my latest is from "resovecall" in Glasgow..a new one on me...acting on behalf of Mercers. I have blanked them so far.
Still haven't solved the mystery of the curious "cca" we both received for our 2004 Morgan Stanley accounts.
My account no. also completely changed when it transferred from Goldfish to B/card even though Goldfish kept my original Morgan Stanley account no.
Barclays/ Barclaycard Help Please.. now a CCA ??
is she allowed to join these two totally separate accounts as she is responding to a 'notice' sent to GF regarding only one account???? i thought they must be responded to individually????
account and a payment had been made to Barclaycard for this account.
little do they know i had written a cheque against that account which will now be returned and I will encounter bank charges, but she has agreed not to charge me for this, her advice was to empty the account, which I immediately did and i have both electric and gas on key meters so they are leaving me without means to pay the cheque etc......... barclay card told her NO we arent refunding the money....... so hence the police.
Reply With Quote
