Thread: Cca Request - ***Charges refunded with CI !!***

Hi Livis,

You are not alone !! BC are saying this fulfils their obligations imposed by CCA1974 to all customers who seek their original credit agreement.

I hope you read other threads here to see how many others are upo against the same thing.

Send this in reply, suitably adapted for your own case:-

Dear sir or madam,

Account Number: XXX

Re; your recent reply to my request under section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

I note that you have replied to the above by sending a copy of your companies current terms and conditions I must inform you that this is not sufficient to comply with the request and that your company is still in default under the act.

To clarify, just sending the terms and conditions is a breach of the Act and Regulations as, apart from the information that the Regulations provide that you may exclude, the copy must be a "true copy" of the agreement.

This breach of the agreement can be demonstrated as follows;

As you will know section 180(1) (b) authorises, "the omission from a copy of certain material from the original, or the inclusion of certain material in condensed form." This refers to statutory instruments made under the heading Copies of document regulations and in this care in particular to SI 1983/1557.

Before leaving section 180 there are two other sections that should be remembered these are:

Section 2(2) (a) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not satisfied unless the copy supplied is in the prescribed form and conforms to the prescribed requirements;

And more importantly

Section 2(b) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not infringed by the omission of any material, or its inclusion in condensed form, if that is authorised by regulations.

You will see that this quite clearly states that whilst certain items may be left out of the copy document the rest of the document must be in the form and contain all items as prescribed by the regulations.

Turning to the regulations regarding what may be omitted from these copies these are contained with SI 1983/1557.

The regulations state:
(2) There may be omitted from any such copy-
(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;
(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancellable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

It is quite clear what can be omitted from the copy document, this again asserts that all other details of the agreement should presented in form and content as required by the regulations.

The requirements of the Agreement regulations 1983/1553 are very explicit in describing the form and content of an agreement and this as I have demonstrated also applies to the copy of any such agreement with the above mentioned proviso.

Nowhere within these regulations does it state that part of the agreement can be presented on a separate document headed terms and conditions.
It does state that all terms and conditions should be within the agreement document and is explicit of the form in which it is presented.

I hope this explains why your reply was unacceptable. I await a True copy of my agreement and would remind you again that, whilst the request has not been complied with, the default continues.

Yours faithfully

Hi Livis,

You should have gathered from other threads that, once you stop paying them, they'll be all over you like a rash, calling right through the day, letters threatening visits, etc.

So before you decide how to proceed, you should consider what you want to achieve here. If you're looking to get the debt written off, be warned it is a very lengthy process and they'll put a Default on your credit rating, even though we think they shouldn't.

Will the refund of penalty charges make any sort of dent in the a/c balance.

Consider reclaiming Restitutional interest on the penalties, which is harder work but the reward, financially, can be significant.

Hi Livis,

I wonder if they would stop adding interest again if you approached them through a third party such as CAB or CCCS. They tend to listen better when approached this way. See here for contacts - Debt: Where to Get Help - Consumer Wiki

If that works, fine and keep on paying just now.

If it doesn't, and they insist on adding interest again, stop paying and let them whistle for it.

See what penalties are on the a/c ready to be reclaimed and let us know if this will reduce the debt significantly.

Livis

Dont assume that the charges wont make a significant dent in your balance. Im only just embarking on a charges reclaim (with the kind help of people here) and my jaw dropped when I saw the numbers with compound interest added.

If any of the charges go back 3 or 4 years, you simply MUST take the time to do the math

Ive used this sheet to help me so far :

http://www.shweb.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/interestcalcs.xls

Im a newbie when it come to these claims, but my eyes have been opened by knowledgeable people as to what I am rightfully allowed to claim for.

Hi Livis,

No surprises with them not sending your agreement, etc.

We have seen a couple of successes recently where a complaint to the fos has resulted in the Creditor sending out the agreement, after they failed to produce it in response to a CCA request.

Before you raise a formal complaint with the FOS, wait for BC to reply to the letter in post #2 above.

Send BC a letter saying they have not replied to your letter of xxdate and enclose a copy of it. Say you require their reply within 14 days or you'll contact the FOS.

You should look at the effect of claiming interest in restitution oa BC's contractual rate as SS says above.

Use this Compound interest calculator and enter the details of one of your oldest charges.

There's more work involved as you would have to take BC to court but they will back down at the last minute and the financial rewards can be very significant.