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After receiving an invoice from Civil Enforcement Ltd, I responded with the suggested letter (many thanks) directing them to the driver and denying responsibility as the registered keeper. They have replied to this with the following:
“As the registered keeper we continue to hold you responsible for payment of the parking charge.
This follows the ruling in Combined Parking Solutions v Stephen James Thomas (2008). The Judge in this case held that on the balance of probabilities, the registered keeper was the driver and even if this was not the case he took a dim view of the registered keepers attitude for not providing the drivers details to enable the matter to be resolved at the earliest opportunity. The registered keeper was ordered to pay the outstanding parking charges and legal costs.”
Ignore them.A recent court case involving Excell, and which Perky, CPS and CEL will not mention, gives a better indication of how unenforceable these charges are.
Hi,
I totally agree with the advice already given to totally 'ignore' - however as you initially responded to the [problem] invoice, CEL will go all out to treat you as a potentially hooked fish so do be prepared for a barrage of harassment & increasingly intimidating demands from them & their partners in grime newlyn plc (a DCA) before they finally give up.
This may take some time - I also responded & subsequently received 18 pieces of toilet paper from them both over a 16 month period but have heard nothing further now for several months.
Ignore everything, don't weaken & don't pay them. They do & will go away eventually. They're just cowardly bullies who hide behind PO Box Numbers & haven't the stomach to carry out their own empty threats even when challenged.
I just feel sorry for the vulnerable & uninformed who are intimidated by their their cr*p & pay-up thus keeping them in business. I also feel the deepest contempt, anger & frustration towards the DVLA, police & other agencies who all but ignore the unlawful methods employed by these scum & their ilk thus allowing them to carry on with impunity.
Hi,
I totally agree with the advice already given to totally 'ignore' - however as you initially responded to the [problem] invoice, CEL will go all out to treat you as a potentially hooked fish so do be prepared for a barrage of harassment & increasingly intimidating demands from them & their partners in grime newlyn plc (a DCA) before they finally give up.
This may take some time - I also responded & subsequently received 18 pieces of toilet paper from them both over a 16 month period but have heard nothing further now for several months.
Ignore everything, don't weaken & don't pay them. They do & will go away eventually. They're just cowardly bullies who hide behind PO Box Numbers & haven't the stomach to carry out their own empty threats even when challenged.
I just feel sorry for the vulnerable & uninformed who are intimidated by their their cr*p & pay-up thus keeping them in business. I also feel the deepest contempt, anger & frustration towards the DVLA, police & other agencies who all but ignore the unlawful methods employed by these scum & their ilk thus allowing them to carry on with impunity.
Agreed. I must also note that the 'Combined Parking Solutions v Stephen James Thomas' bit is used frquently by PPCs and DCAs in thier letters as part of thier 'proof' that they are right and we are wrong. Lucky we know otherwise
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I have had a letter from CEL this month with the same CPS v S J Thomas qoute on it so ignored it as per the forums advice. I have now received a 'FINAL REMINDER BEFORE LEGAL ACTION' letter stating 'Failure to pay thefull amount within seven days of the notice will result in us issuing an immediate county court summons against you. A warrant may then be issed to bailiffs to recover the amounts due, plus court fees , bailiff costs and interest'
YOUR ABILITY TO OBTAIN CREDIT IN THE FUTURE COULD BE AFFECTED
What is your advice and upon what basis please ???
I have had a letter from CEL this month with the same CPS v S J Thomas qoute on it so ignored it as per the forums advice. I have now received a 'FINAL REMINDER BEFORE LEGAL ACTION' letter stating 'Failure to pay thefull amount within seven days of the notice will result in us issuing an immediate county court summons against you. A warrant may then be issed to bailiffs to recover the amounts due, plus court fees , bailiff costs and interest'
YOUR ABILITY TO OBTAIN CREDIT IN THE FUTURE COULD BE AFFECTED
What is your advice and upon what basis please ???
More bluster and bluff designed to worry you, do not crack, see all the other threads about PPCs and you will realise this type of empty threat is par for the course and not to be taken seriously.
Continue to ignore the idiots and they will eventually go away and try and [problem] a less informed victim.
Standard PPC text designed to scare people into paying. Does it say "will result" or "may result". I would love to get one of these that said " will result"
In reality, probably not, because they know that if they go to court, the chances are that they will lose.
As Lamma said, there are some on this board who pray for a letter like yours to arrive, especially if they actually follow up on the threat. The prospect of another ass kicking for PPC like CEL is to good an opportunity to miss.
Let us know if you do receive court papers. I can guarantee you plenty of help and support in compiling a defence.
Incidently, as far as you previous post.
'Failure to pay thefull amount within seven days of the notice will result in us issuing an immediate county court summons against you. A warrant may then be issed to bailiffs to recover the amounts due, plus court fees , bailiff costs and interest'
YOUR ABILITY TO OBTAIN CREDIT IN THE FUTURE COULD BE AFFECTED
This should read,
Failure to pay thefull amount within seven days of the notice will result in us issuing an immediate county court summons against you. Should you choose to defend your non payment stance, you will have an opportunity to submit a defence to our accusations. Mediation may then be found to be appropropriate as an alternative to a court hearing and at any time it may be found that you have no case to answer. Should it be felt that a court hearing be necessary, it will be heard in the informal surroundings of the county court, where you will be given every opportunity to put your arguments to the judge who will decide on the outcome based on the evidence presented. In the unlikely event that we win, you can appeal or you will be given 21 days to pay the amount that the judge decides (not necessarily what we claimed). Should you not pay up, then we will go back to court and ask for a warrant of execution, at which point you will still have an opportunity to be heard. Only if you still fail to pay up after all this time, will we be able to call in the bailiffs, but only if we are still in business and not in prison for extortion and fraud since this will probably take at least twelve months.
PS. It is unlikely that we will turn up in court in the first place seeing that you will probably have a water-tight defence and we don't have the right to take you to court as it's not our land anyway.
Have a nice day.
MBNA - Agreed to refund £970 in full without conditions. Cheque received Sat 5th Aug.
Lloyds - Settled for an undisclosed sum.
Hi Rooney,
Ask yourself this question - why should CEL single you out & commence court proceedings against you when I (and numerous others) are ahead of you in the queue?
If they do, you will be the first, so relax it ain't gonna happen.
In my case, I've been waiting nearly two years-I want them to take me to court, I've challenged them to take me to court but they just don't want to play ball-doesn't that tell you something?
Also ask yourself-what self-respecting company sends out 18 threats to pay-up or else & then does nothing further to carry them out. Any legitimate claim would result in no more than 2/3 reminders before actual commencement of proceedings.
CEL is a one man band operated by a Gary Wayne from a shed in Mill Hill NW9. Yes, the company address is currently in Liverpool but this is just a mail-drop. Previously he used a mail-drop address in Nottingham but the company he used there received too many complaints & terminated the arrangement. Curiously he still retains the Nottingham area code (0115) phone number.
I am aware of the address to which his mail is forwarded & will reveal this in due course.
As you've probably gathered, this guy has really p*ss*d me off & I'm on his case.
Civil Enforcement Ltd
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Originally Posted by thedook
