PCN issued - with wrong offence code. How do i handle it?

**Big_Tony** · 10th February 2009 14:48

I've just recieved a pcn icon

in Islington for 32JP "failing to drive in the direction shown by an arrow on a blue sign."

However, looking at the two photos supplied it's clear that the actual offense I appear to have committed was stopping inside a yellow box at a junction. (there were no blue arrows shown, but there were two timed pics of me stopped in a yellow box).

I'm guessing the wrong code was assigned to the offence by accident and that the Yellow box related offense has a different code?

...
I started to write a letter, saying that the photographic evidence supplied did not appear to show me committing the quoted offense and that there were no blue signs with arrows in the location...

...then it occurred to me that if I act too quickly the council can simply cancel that PCN and re-issue me with a new one, with the correct offense listed.

So, how should I proceed?

Are they allowed to simply re-issue a new ticket (they have the photo evidence) or should I hold back until the last minute to respond, so that any time limit they may have to issue a new ticket has expired (assuming such limits exist)...

...or am I being to clever and should simply send a letter saying I didn't commit the offense, or just ignore it till I get the next nasty letter.

Any sensible and truly informed advice would be gratefully appreciated.

**pin1onu** · 10th February 2009 18:20

They are knackered. On the ticket are some boxes. You can simply tick the box that the contravention didn't occur.

By law they are not allowed to re-issue a ticket or alter it once it is issued.

You might want to look at the footage they have of you. A photo might not reveal the whole picture. They may have clear footage of you driving against the arrow.

**Big_Tony** · 10th February 2009 22:18

Thanks for that. As far as I can recall there is no arrow on a blue sign in the vicinity, and I have no recollection of passing any islands on the wrong side or doing anything odd... Mind you I didn't notice the box junction either. LOL

**crem** · 10th February 2009 22:36

Originally Posted by Big_Tony

However, looking at the two photos supplied it's clear that the actual offense I appear to have committed was stopping inside a yellow box at a junction. (there were no blue arrows shown, but there were two timed pics of me stopped in a yellow box).

As a side note, there is no such offence of "stopping in a yellow box". The offence is "do not enter a box junction unless you can see your exit to be clear and the only thing preventing you from leaving is oncoming traffic". i.e. the offence actually occurs as soon as you enter the box if the exit you have selected is currently obstructed.

**green_and_mean** · 11th February 2009 00:53

Originally Posted by crem

As a side note, there is no such offence of "stopping in a yellow box". The offence is "do not enter a box junction unless you can see your exit to be clear and the only thing preventing you from leaving is oncoming traffic". i.e. the offence actually occurs as soon as you enter the box if the exit you have selected is currently obstructed.

The actual contravention is 'entering a box junction so that the vehicle has to stop due to the presence of stationary traffic' with an exemption for stopping to turn right if there is oncoming traffic.

**lamma** · 11th February 2009 00:59

Statutory Instrument 2002 No. 3113 The Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions 2002 Regulation 29 BUS STOP AND BUS STAND CLEARWAYS AND BOX JUNCTIONS PART II SIGNIFICANCE OF BOX JUNCTION MARKINGS Interpretation of Part II of Schedule 6. In this Part of this Schedule - (a) “box junction” means the area of carriageway marked with yellow cross-hatching at a junction between two or more roads on which there has been placed the road marking shown in diagram 1043 or 1044; and (b) a reference (however expressed) to a vehicle which is stationary or stops within a box junction includes a vehicle which is stationary whilst part of it is within the box junction. Prohibition conveyed by markings in diagram 1043 or 1044 7. - (1) Except when placed in the circumstances described in paragraph 8, the road markings shown in diagrams 1043 and 1044 shall each convey the prohibition that no person shall cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of stationary vehicles. (2) The prohibition in sub-paragraph (1) does not apply to any person - (a) who causes a vehicle to enter the box junction (other than a box junction at a roundabout) for the purpose of turning right; and (b) stops it within the box junction for so long as it is prevented from completing the right turn by oncoming vehicles or other vehicles which are stationary whilst waiting to complete a right turn. Prohibition conveyed when markings are placed in conjunction with signs in diagrams 615 and 811 8. When the road marking shown in diagram 1043 or 1044 is placed in conjunction with the signs shown in diagrams 615 and 811 on an area of carriageway which is less than 4.5 metres wide at its narrowest point, the road marking shall convey the prohibition that no person shall cause a vehicle to enter the box junction so that the vehicle has to stop within the box junction due to the presence of oncoming vehicles or other stationary vehicles beyond the box junction. © Crown Copyright 2002

**crem** · 11th February 2009 01:51

Originally Posted by green_and_mean

The actual contravention is 'entering a box junction so that the vehicle has to stop due to the presence of stationary traffic' with an exemption for stopping to turn right if there is oncoming traffic.

Ermm, that says just the same thing with different words G&M.

From a teaching point of view, keeping the terminology straightforward plus being able to indicate where/why a pupil is looking at the exit road to decide whether it is safe/legal to enter the junction before they do so is much more effective.

I think any attempt to use Lamma's version as a teaching aid wouldn't go down very well either.

**lamma** · 11th February 2009 02:01

wasn't meant as a teaching aid. Sorry about the formatting, it always come out rubbish for me.

dvdriley · 11th February 2009 09:38

appeal it with the information you have been given

**crem** · 11th February 2009 10:45

Originally Posted by lamma

wasn't meant as a teaching aid.

I knew that really Lamma

Thread: PCN issued - with wrong offence code. How do i handle it?

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PCN issued - with wrong offence code. How do i handle it?

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Re: PCN issued - with wrong offence code. How do i handle it?

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Re: PCN issued - with wrong offence code. How do i handle it?