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I pay for my weekly car parking ticket by debit card via the machine in the train station car park.
I paid for it and it gave me my parking ticket and my debit card receipt (prinited on a parking ticket)
Anyway, I was tired and stuck the receipt in my windscreen window and through away the action parking ticket...
You can get what happens next, I get back after work and there is a pcn on my window for not displaying a valid ticket. I have tried to appeal and I have emailed them a copy of my receipt, even offered to send a copy of my bank statement, debit card and bank statement to show that I did pay for it.
My appeal has been rejected.
Does anyone have any experience of dealing with these guys ?
I was thinking of using the UTCCR 1999 as a possible defence as the terms and conditions do not specify exactly what is a valid ticket. My receipt was printed on the same sticker as a parking ticket and says to stick it in the window..
What do people think ? Should I just give in and pay it ?
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Thank you for your recent correspondence regarding xxxx.
As per our previous email on 27th January 2009, Please forward a copy of your valid ticket for parking and not a receipt to us within 7 days to avoid any further charges.
Without the copy of your valid ticket for parking, you appeal will not be accepted
Regards,
Ahmed Elgamal
Meteor pcn Appeals Department
Maybrook House
97 Godstone Road
Caterham, Surrey
CR3 6RE
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Mr Ahmed Elgamal
Meteor pcn Appeals Department
Maybrook House
97 Godstone Road
Caterham
Surrey
CR3 6RE
Your Ref: xxxx
Dear Mr Elgamal
Thank you for your email of 6 February 2009, sent in response to appeal in relation to a penalty charge notice (PCN). I would like to take this opportunity to detail the reasons that I would like to appeal against this PCN.
Circumstances
On 20 January 2009, I was issued with a PCN, whilst my car was parked in the xxx train station car park. As I understand it this PCN was issued for the following reason:
On 19 January 2009, I purchased a weekly parking ticket. By mistake I displayed my debit card receipt. However, I do not consider the display of card receipt was a breach of your terms and conditions. I say this because:
· The receipt is clearly states PAY AND DISPLAY.
· You do not dispute that I paid to park my vehicle (receipt previously supplied)
· The receipt states use sticker on back to fix to windscreen.
· The receipt confirms payment of £23.00 on 19 January 2009.
· The terms and conditions are in breach of the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contract Regulations 1999
· Your email response to my appeal is in breach of the British Parking Code of Practice.
Contractual terms and conditions
Your terms and conditions state:
"8. TICKETS
Please ensure your ticket is displayed in a prominent position in your vehicle whilst parked. If you fail to do so the company and/or its agents will rely on their rights contained in condition 14.”
· The receipt is a ticket printed by the ticket machine in the car park
· As instructed it was fixed to the windscreen, thus in a prominent position.
Your terms and conditions also state:
"14. PENALTIES AND ENFORCEMENT
Where you park your vehicle in breach of these terms and conditions the company or its agents may (in its/their absolute discretion) either: -
14.4 All or any of the above enforcement actions may be applied in relation to any of the following: - - Parking on a double yellow line - Parking other then in a designated parking bay - Parking in a time restricted waiting area and being excess of the allowed time - Parking in a disabled bay without displaying the required ticket - Being parked other than in a disabled bay without displaying the required ticket. - Being parked other than in a single designated bay - Parking in any area restricted for use by season ticket - Failing to display a valid ticket voucher or permit. - Failing to observe any vehicle size restrictions displayed at the car park - Being otherwise in breach of those terms and conditions of parking”
As I understand it, you consider that I am in breach of 14.4 of your terms and conditions as I displayed a receipt (printed on a ticket) and not a parking ticket.
The terms and conditions, constitute a contract between me and Meteor and as such is subject to the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (UTCCR 1999). I consider the above condition to be unfair as it does not specify what does and doesn’t constitute a valid voucher or permit. Furthermore, section 18 (definitions) of the terms and conditions to not define what constitutes what is a valid ticket. Therefore, I do not consider that this term is written in plain, intelligible language.
I would like to take this opportunity to refer you to the UTCCR 1999, which states:
“Written contracts
(1) A seller or supplier shall ensure that any written term of a contract is expressed in plain, intelligible language.
(2) If there is doubt about the meaning of a written term, the interpretation which is most favourable to the consumer shall prevail but this rule shall not apply in proceedings brought under regulation 12.”
Therefore, under section 7(2) of the UTCCR 1999, I consider that the receipt displayed on my windscreen can be interpreted to be a valid ticket voucher or permit. If you disagree with my interpretation, I would like to refer you to:
“Effect of unfair term
8. - (1) An unfair term in a contract concluded with a consumer by a seller or supplier shall not be binding on the consumer.”
As the term 14.4 is not written in plan intelligible language and is unfair, it is not legally binding upon me as the consumer.
British Parking Code of Practice
Further to your email of 6 February 2009, I have noted and carefully considered your comments. You state:
“Please forward a copy of your valid ticket for parking and not a receipt to us within 7 days to avoid any further charges. Without the copy of your valid ticket for parking, you appeal will not be accepted.”
However, this would appear to be in breach of the British Parking Code of Practice (part 2) which states:
"Irrespective of the detailed requirements in this Code, the underlying philosophy is that the Operator should act “reasonably” when dealing with Members of the public who have contravened local land / or car park regulations”
Contrary to your email, you are obligated to accept my appeal. It is then for you to decide to either uphold or not uphold my appeal. It is evident from your response that your decision has already been made, which would not appear to show that you are acting reasonably.
I look forward to your quick response to my appeal.
Kind Regards
tbern123
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Nice letter, but you're under the impression that there is an appeals process.
This is a private company who have just given you an invoice. They won't cancel the invoice and do themselves out of profit. Hence your 'appeal rejected' letter. Everybody gets an appealed rejected letter.
Now sit back and wait for either no response to your letter or another 'appeal rejected' letter. Either way, you'll be receiving pay up or else threatening letters soon enough.
Then, do as follows:
• do not pay
• do not contact them again
• ignore any letters they send, no matter how threatening
• they will give up and go away eventually (although they may pester you for a bit longer because you contacted them and are a 'hooked fish')
Thanks Al27, but as you will see from my other threads (cabot), I am not the type of person that just sits back. I like to take the fight to them.
Anyway, I have today received this response
Dear Mr tbern123
Thank you for your correspondence.
To answer a few of your points; the reason that the receipt states "pay and display" and has a sticky back is because the receipt is printed off from the same reel of tickets as a valid ticket for parking would be. Although the ticket confirms the payment, it does not show the state time or expiry time of the ticket, which is why we request a copy of the valid ticket. Please note the receipt clearly states "sales receipt"
Please note that no decision has been made yet as this is still in the appeal process and your appeal has been put on hold while we investigate this and request further information. Please forward a copy of your bank statement showing the charge, you can of course blank out any personal details, and we will be able to investigate this further.
Yours sincerely
Hannah Downing.
Meteor pcn Appeals Department
Maybrook House
97 Godstone Road
Caterham, Surrey
CR3 6RE
Fax: 01883 342 202
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Thank you for your email of 7 February 2009. As requested please find attached a copy of my bank statements. The purchase is shown as debiting my account on 20 January 2009 (please see statement page two). If required, I can also provide a copy of my debit card for this account to show that it was used to purchase a parking ticket (please note the sales receipt contains details of the card used). If deemed required, I can also obtain confirmation from my Building Society of this transaction. However, I will hold Meteor liable for any and all further costs incurred.
In response to your comments in relation to a valid ticket stating a time or a expiry time, this distinction is not defined within the terms and conditions as displayed in the car park or on the South Eastern car parking website. Therefore, does not form part of the contractual agreement I entered into when I parked my car in the Dartford train car park. I would strongly urge that you refer this matter to your legal department for further clarification
However, I would like to thank you for your confirmation that the receipt is in fact printed onto a ticket. I have forwarded this response and will forward any subsequent response you provide onto Dr Howard Stoate – Member of Parliament for Dartford, Mr Tony Hetherington: Readers Champion – Mail on Sunday and His Rt Hon Mr Gordon Brown – Prime Minister.
For the avoidance of doubt, I have no intention in paying the pcn. If my appeal is rejected, I respectfully ask you to instigate legal proceedings at your earliest convenience, so that the matters I have previously raised can be addressed in Court.
Kind regards
tbern123
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"please send us a bank statement" - bufoons !! no one in their right mind would do that.
Lol
I did, I just emailed them a copy with just the transaction showing, all account details blacked out..
It did the trick, I just received an instant response....
Dear Mr tbern123
Thank you for your correspondence and for forwarding the requested information.
I am pleased to inform you that I have rescinded this notice for you as you have supplied us with evidence that you had paid for parking on the 20th of January.
Please note that we simply needed further clarification of the date of the purchase and that it was your transaction. At no point would we make a decision until we had received further information from yourself.
I appreciate that there may not be clear information regarding the distinction of the receipt from the valid ticket however the customer can see that the receipt printed clearly states "sales receipt". The signage by the machines within the car park provides a telephone number for customers to call, should they have any problems or enquires and it is the customers responsibility to ensure that they park in accordance with the terms and conditions of the car park.
Please ensure for future reference to check the ticket printed and to clearly display a valid ticket for parking as any further notices issued may be upheld.
Yours sincerely
Hannah Downing
Meteor pcn Appeals Department
Maybrook House
97 Godstone Road
Caterham, Surrey
CR3 6RE
Fax: 01883 342 202
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There are lot of companies trading from that little building that shows up on the satellite map. Hope they get an extension built with all the money they are [problem]ming from people.
Also note, nobody in their huge car park. Even their own staff must be wary of parking there Except that one car, but they have probably been clamped.
Meteor Parking - Train Station PCN
on my window for not displaying a valid ticket. I have tried to appeal and I have emailed them a copy of my receipt, even offered to send a copy of my bank statement, debit card and bank statement to show that I did pay for it.
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Originally Posted by lamma
Except that one car, but they have probably been clamped.