Very Interesting to get the opinion of someone who used to be a Police Officer - interesting point about the Fraud Act - I guess it is a question of what can be done with the resources available.

TFT

Good morning

Thanks for that.....but what is worrying is that the Police will not act if the amount of the Fraud is below a particular level (depending on Force area), and that fact is what these clowns rely on when issuing their tickets!!!

Best wishes to all

Dougal

All good stuff though for the handful of small claims cases a year. And one for Perky to mull over.

 

It is possible that this may be an agreement between Morrisons and these clowns to the effect that the 'attendant' will keep the car park flowing........

If Morrisons own or rent the land, they almost certainly have had an imput into who and how parking is enforced; otherwise what is to stop me patrolling their car park invoicing people who stay longer than ten minutes.

The situation is less clear if it is on a retail park with other shops, but I would expect that Morrisons would again have some input into parking enforcement.

What this means is that Morrisons cannot wash their hands of the activities of these PPC's.

Whatever you do or don't do when getting a ticket you should always send a letter of complaint to the companies head office copied to the store manager, intimating that you will make sure that you and your friends never shop there again.

Please do write to both head office and the store manager. A few posters have noted that some PPC's have had thier contracts terminated due to high volumes of customer complaints in the past.

Good morning all,

 

Just a quick addition to the above - I work for Morrisons (not as a car park attendant!!)

 

I have watched the 'attendant' employed by these clowns - he makes every effort to avoid being seen......

 

As far as I am aware there is no employment arrangement with Morrisons (i.e. : the 'attendant' is not paid by Morrisons, nor do Morrisons pay the company. I am not aware of any 'sharing' of the proceeds of the 'attendants' work - but I do know he is employed by the clowns who issue the requests for payment.

 

It is possible that this may be an agreement between Morrisons and these clowns to the effect that the 'attendant' will keep the car park flowing (so to speak) and will be paid from the proceeds of his 'work', and in turn Morrisons will have the dubious benefit of good turnover by the frequent movement of vehicles in and out of the car park - the drivers having been misled into thinking they can only stay for a limited amount of time!

 

As an ex-police officer I agree that the issuing of a ticket is an attempt at theft, and if the Fraud Act 2006 is read I believe that the issuing of a ticket in the circumstances described is a complete offence - and should be reported to the police - BUT I do not believe they would take any action because of the relatively small amount (less than £1,000) involved - even though the Act does not place financial limits, I am sure this would be a 'guidelines for prosecution' matter, and would not be proceeded with.

 

The way around this could be to get a good number of people who have all had tickets in the same car park to complain.

 

All the best to everyone,

 

Dougal

Good post. While one ticket doesn't break the £1000 'barrier', how many invoices does this 'attendent' issue in a day / More than a £1000 ? And how many days a week ? Shouldn't be hard to get enough victims together to break the £1000 'barrier'. or to point the police at Companies House were they can see the extent of the revenue of the PPC. Maybe they could even get all POCA on the case.

Good morning all,

I am sorry to be so cynical......(old habits die hard....!), but have you ever tried to get the Police interested in something which they do not consider a prority?

I rest my case......

BUT I do agree that something needs to be done! No, I'll modify that something MUST be done...any suggestions??

Best wishes everyone

Dougal

I took my Morrisons ticket to the local police station - not for the ticket itself, but the Yellow Checkerd bag that suggested tampering with this ticket was an 'offence'.

Oh how they laughed! They agreed it wasn't the removal of the ticket that would be an offence, but the applying of it - as it was really 'littering'. Either way, the only advice was to disregard it and dispose of it properly. They were not prepared to take the matter further.

I used to get 5 tickets a month at my local Morrisons, as the attendant disliked where I parked my bike. I explained that he was entitled to his opinion but as my bike wasn't on his precious car park, he could whistle.

Not only did I never receive an RK request, but he stopped writing the tickets after the 8th ticket, and we now shout 'hello' if he's there when I arrive.

hi,

i knw this is a very old thread but i'll make things pretty clear.

i work for these so called clowns CP plus, at a morrisons car park.

morrisons DO pay cp plus an annual fee to have the car-park patrolled.

i wear a hi-visable car-park attendant coat so im clearly seen on the car park & patrol the car-park in putting car registration number plates into a hand held computer device.

the device informs me if a car has over stayed by the MAXIMUM 2hours free stay time allocated for the car park, which then u get an extra 15minutes on top of that, so technically you get 2hours 15minutes free parking).

i dont understand how you have recieved a ticket if you was only in the store for 10minutes, it should say on the ticket the time the attendant 1st seen your car and the time the ticket was issued.

my only guess could be that you previously came to the store earlier in the day and returned to the store with-in 3 hours meaning the attendant thinks your viercle has overstayed in the car-park.

The customers that shop in the morrisons where i work are regular and if they do intend to come more than once with-in 3 hours they will inform myself to avoild being issued with a ticket.

my advice is, if you think or know that you have recieved a ticket unfairly then by all means fight it tooth and nail, but i can assure you that many people think CP plus is a small company and dont pursue a £15/£40 fine, but in actual fact they do.

the car park attendant must of been a complete and utter ****hole

i only give tickets out if customers overstay by more than 2/half hours

parked in a resctricted area

causing an obstruction

if customers approach me who ive issued a ticket to i'll explain the situation & why the ticket has been issued, if they have caused an obstruction, parked in a restricted area or parked over 2 pays the fine will stay, if they have overstayed but have come and seen me, 9/10 i will voild the ticket there and then myself.

CP plus car park attendants like myself, dont earn any commision or get any bonuses on the amount of tickets we issue. we are paid £5.80 per hour and thats it.

Since you're going to cut and paste, i might as well do the same...

'Pursue' as in send 5 or 6 bits of junkmail? They do that for every invoice (not a fine).

I'm not being facitious, but do you know the legal ins and outs of your tickets or do you just issue them because it's the job? Do you believe the things CP Plus tell you (do they tell you anything?) or do you accept that they just send out threatening junk to keepers and collect the cheques from the unenlightened?

Good morning,

What a pity Anthony 1984 that you do not realise that by issuing the tickets you yourself are breaking the law.

I recommend a read of Sections 2 and 3 of the Fraud Act 2006 - the ticket has no validity in law and in issuing it you are deceiving drivers to pay a sum of money unlawfully.

There are no regulations governing parking enforcement on private land, BUT there are regulations governing the issuing of tickets I also recommend a read of Sections 3, 6 8, 9, and10 of the Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981.

I draw your attention to the penalties for persons involved, and strongly recommend consulting a Solicitor, specialising in Criminal Law, who will be able to advise you on your own precarious position.

By the way: According to the Bill of Rights 1689, British citizens cannot be fined if they have not been convicted in a court of law. Parking fines do not usually include an option to go to court, so if the legislation of 1689 has not been specifically repealed this also makes the parking fines illegal.

In the meantime, have a nice day!

As always

Dougal

anthony1984 many thanks for your post. I drive aJaguar XJ8 which is just too long to fit into a "standard" parking bay eaven if I park right up to the car in the bay in front and I cannot use a parking bay if there is a car in the bays to either side as I cannot get out of my door!

I usually park a long way away from the store enterance and walk as there is less chance of getting your car side dinked.

He gave me a ticket ( invoice) for using two parking bays. I should have taken a picture with my phone befor a drove away but I was so annoyed that I just left.

Parking in two bays was acctually the front NS of my car was over the dividing line of the bays by about 10 inches. There was a barrier on my side (drivers) the bay in front was empty and the bay to the side was enpty so I couldn't see the problem. I had parked at the very end of a row at the end farthest away from the store.

As of yet I have not received any letters or requests to pay.

Thanks

Richard

For info - can you clarify something?

If you only use the compuer to note the time elapsed, how does it know the start time (unless you go rouind having to input all the VRMs you say as an initial stage to this process?)

hi,

i knw this is a very old thread but i'll make things pretty clear.

 

Should be interesting!!!

i work for these so called clowns CP plus, at a morrisons car park.

morrisons DO pay cp plus an annual fee to have the car-park patrolled.

 

More fool Morrisons.

 

i wear a hi-visable car-park attendant coat so im clearly seen on the car park & patrol the car-park in putting car registration number plates into a hand held computer device.

 

A High Viz jacket, that must make it all legal then, I have obviously missed that very important point.

 

the device informs me if a car has over stayed by the MAXIMUM 2hours free stay time allocated for the car park, which then u get an extra 15minutes on top of that, so technically you get 2hours 15minutes free parking).

 

And..............

 

i dont understand how you have recieved a ticket if you was only in the store for 10minutes, it should say on the ticket the time the attendant 1st seen your car and the time the ticket was issued.

 

Because the clown that issued the ticket does not know what they are doing, it is fairly obvious.

my only guess could be that you previously came to the store earlier in the day and returned to the store with-in 3 hours meaning the attendant thinks your viercle has overstayed in the car-park.

 

So what?

 

The customers that shop in the morrisons where i work are regular and if they do intend to come more than once with-in 3 hours they will inform myself to avoild being issued with a ticket.

 

Why do they feel the need to inform a guy with a 'high viz' jacket of anything, they must really have nothing better to do?

 

my advice is, if you think or know that you have recieved a ticket unfairly then by all means fight it tooth and nail, but i can assure you that many people think CP plus is a small company and dont pursue a £15/£40 fine, but in actual fact they do.

 

Really, can you give us cases that you KNOW about? Not what the company tells you. A person does not have to, 'fight it tooth and nail' just ignore all the rubbish your company sends them.

 

the car park attendant must of been a complete and utter ****hole

 

The temptation to expand on this comment is really overpowering.

 

i only give tickets out if customers overstay by more than 2/half hours

parked in a resctricted area

causing an obstruction

 

Well done you, any legal authority that you know off to back up your issue of tickets?

 

if customers approach me who ive issued a ticket to i'll explain the situation & why the ticket has been issued, if they have caused an obstruction, parked in a restricted area or parked over 2 pays the fine will stay, if they have overstayed but have come and seen me, 9/10 i will voild the ticket there and then myself.

 

Can you explain the legal authority you rely on, as a private company to issue fines to members of the public?

 

CP plus car park attendants like myself, dont earn any commision or get any bonuses on the amount of tickets we issue. we are paid £5.80 per hour and thats it.

 

Just about sums it up really.

 

regards

we are paid £5.80 per hour

Minimum they can get away with so its a case of "pay peanuts get monkeys"

Still whats one more monkey in a troop of monkeys pretending to be a legitimate company who are [causing problems] money out of innocent shoppers

Out of curiosity Anthony1984 do they throw the high Vis Jacket as a bonus or do you have to buy your own

CP plus car park attendants like myself, dont earn any commision or get any bonuses on the amount of tickets we issue. we are paid £5.80 per hour and thats it.

It's a mind numbingly tedious job isn't it?

I'd be down the pub all day instead.

Hello

'we are paid £5.80 per hour and thats it.'

As a matter of interest Morrisons pay their lowest paid workers £6.59 per hour....

Need I say more....

As always

Dougal

I drive aJaguar XJ8 which is just too long to fit into a "standard" parking bay eaven if I park right up to the car in the bay in front and I cannot use a parking bay if there is a car in the bays to either side as I cannot get out of my door!

Drive a people carrier so have a similar problem with spaces plotted out using a Mini as a template - just part of the [problem] to catch as many people as possible and yet another argument to add to the list should a PPC ever dare take it to court

The car park is there for motorists to use and marked out spaces should reflect the size of vehicles in use. Not suggesting every one should be big enough to accomodate a minibus but some intelligence is required by those planning the bays.

Here of course is where we run into a problem in that "is there intelligent life in a PPC" - probably more chance of finding it on Mars or Venus.

And, of course, you could also blame the greedy supermarkets fro trying to cram in an many parking spaces as they can without taking into consideration the size of many of today's cars.

Had a laugh with my motorbike once. Parked on the pavement near bins - in a Morrisons CP so not taking up a car parking space, and I got a ticket. (Duly ignored). Two months later, I parked in a vacant car parking space, and got a ticket (inappropriate vehicle). The following weekend I went in with my RV, and due to size used up 4 spaces. Got another ticket.

Took them all to the store manager, handed them over and said I'd had enough of this harassment, I'm off to ASDA in fitire. Strange thing was, I was never sent a PPC letter.

:mad:Last year I had a bad experience on motorway sevice with the CP bandits.

coming home from France with wife..Me in the van and wife in her car. We stopped and set the alarm for 90 minutes and in slightly less time than that set off again.

3 weeks later we received a demand for £80 EACH:eek: saying that we had been there for 2 hours and 58 minutes.

I tried to contact them without sucess, emailed but no reply. Then a serious demand arrived- money or else!!!! Wife went into a panic and paid them. £160

No problems since until now. I trravel a lot and because of tiredness pulled into Exeter services and paid £8 charge (did'nt want a repeat)

Then I realise as you can only pay by card which I did then I realised they have my card details on file. I intend to contact by solicitor on returning home to take advice and possibly initiate an action against them

Save your money with a solicitor.

What are you actually complaining about? You don't owe them anything - your wife (ill advisedly) paid the original invoices, so that matter is closed. The current one you talk of, you used your card to pay an £8 parking fee. This transaction is now complete.

Knowing what your CC number is is irrelevant - if they take any money from you for other (possible) parking issues, they cannot help themselves - if that is what your worry is. That is fraud, and your bank will reverse the amount if you challenge it. You could also say your card number has been compromised, and they can issue a replacement card with a new number, if you wish.

Nothing to worry about whatsoever.

You have 6 years to make a claim to recoup the money your wife paid.

'Recoup' ? I'm not sure this was a question being asked, but even if it was - what do you base that premise on? 6 years to claim a debt perhaps - but this was a novice sent and the service paid for.

To later try to say actually you didn't agree with the bill, and didn't really mean to pay it and please can you have your money back, isn't going to cut it. Especially after the event.

I also recommend a read of Sections 3, 6 8, 9, and10 of the Forgery and Counterfeiting Act 1981.

Interesting, I haven't seen that before. The advantage over the Fraud Act is that under that act there is no requirement for dishonesty.