Thread: Barclaycard stress help needed!

Hi Roco and welcome to CAG.

You can send them a CCA request now. Use Letter N from here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...templates.html

This should not be seen as the chance to ditch the debt, but to prove it unenforceable at law. If they don't have a valid Credit Agreement, you can stop them adding any further charges or interest to the a/c. Without a CA, they cannot put markers or Defaults on your credit files. Also, any posted in the past should be removed.

You can then repay the debt at a rate which suits you and, without charges and interest, the debt will be reducing and not rising each month.

As soon as you start the CCA process, BC are likely to reduce your limit if it is above your current balance, to stop the possibility of you spending more.

I have not missed a payment yet but that is close now.

If you have any older charges, these can be reclaimed. See the Reclaim Guide in Link No1 in my signature below.

Personally, I'd advise you to keep up the min pay'ts until you find if they have a valid CA for each a/c. It's notoriously difficult to get negative CRA markers removed once they're posted.

Better to give them a chance to provide a CA within the time limits. If they don't provide at all, or the CA is not valid, then you can hit them with a suitable letter and maybe avoid any defaults (it's a good theory anyway!).

Take action on the other card too, but start a new thread for it so we don't confuse the two a/c's.

Use photo bucket and we'll get the CA's checked for you.

Word of warning - If you bank with Barclays and you fail to pay BC, there's a chance they may take from your bank to pay a monthly payment or even pay off a chunk of the CCard.

It's not unusual - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...n-current.html

Send the CCA request by Rec'y Del'y.

To save money, take other letters to the PO and get a free Certificate of Posting as proof of postage.

Hi Roco,

That address should be fine - no point in sending the 2 letters to diff't addresses.

Hi Roco,

Many credit card threads show so called Credit Agreements which we believe are unenforceable. The trouble is convincing Barclaycard or others of this - they continue to pester for payment regardless.

Have a flick through this thread - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...clay-card.html which is a great example of an unenforceable CA which BC and a succession of cronies are still trying to collect.

In some cases, the best thing BC or others can do is take you to court. See here - http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...ml#post1762657

Hi Roco,

See what they come back with.

If you don't make the next due payment, no doubt they'll soon start harassing you, even though the a/c is in dispute.

Hi Roco,

Stop paying them now if you want, but be ready for abuse from Mercers and a string of others.

Have you looked at reducing the debt by reclaiming charges yet.

Adapt and use this letter (courtesy of BurlyBen):-

Dear Sirs,

Account Number: XXX

Re; your recent reply to my request under section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

I note that you have replied to the above by sending a copy of your companies current terms and conditions I must inform you that this is not sufficient to comply with the request and that your company is still in default under the act.

To clarify, just sending the terms and conditions is a breach of the Act and Regulations as, apart from the information that the Regulations provide that you may exclude, the copy must be a "true copy" of the agreement.

This breach of the agreement can be demonstrated as follows;

As you will know section 180(1) (b) authorises, "the omission from a copy of certain material from the original, or the inclusion of certain material in condensed form." This refers to statutory instruments made under the heading Copies of document regulations and in this care in particular to SI 1983/1557.

Before leaving section 180 there are two other sections that should be remembered these are:

Section 2(2) (a) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not satisfied unless the copy supplied is in the prescribed form and conforms to the prescribed requirements;

And more importantly

Section 2(b) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not infringed by the omission of any material, or its inclusion in condensed form, if that is authorised by regulations.

You will see that this quite clearly states that whilst certain items may be left out of the copy document the rest of the document must be in the form and contain all items as prescribed by the regulations.

Turning to the regulations regarding what may be omitted from these copies these are contained with SI 1983/1557.

The regulations state:
(2) There may be omitted from any such copy-
(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;
(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancellable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

It is quite clear what can be omitted from the copy document, this again asserts that all other details of the agreement should presented in form and content as required by the regulations.

The requirements of the Agreement regulations 1983/1553 are very explicit in describing the form and content of an agreement and this as I have demonstrated also applies to the copy of any such agreement with the above mentioned proviso.

Nowhere within these regulations does it state that part of the agreement can be presented on a separate document headed terms and conditions.
It does state that all terms and conditions should be within the agreement document and is explicit of the form in which it is presented.

I hope this explains why your reply was unacceptable. I await a True copy of my agreement and would remind you again that, whilst the request has not been complied with, the default continues.

Yours faithfully

Hi Roco,

You're about to enter the area of dispute where you say one thing and BC say another.

At the moment, it's simple as they've failed to comply so the dispute is clear. It may be less clear when/if they send what they suggest is the Credit Agreement.

You're a long way from getting them to accept there is ANY dispute, so agreeing reduced payments on this basis won't happen yet.

Just another thought - there are other letters in the link I gave in post #2 above. Take a look at Letters A,B & C and consider sending one of those as well to incorporate your suggestion of a reduced payment, or a payment holiday.

If thats all there is, I think we can do without seeing it.

Try sending them this. Adapt it to suit your own case as nec'y:-

Dear Sirs,

Account Number: XXX

Re; your recent reply to my request under section 77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974

I note that you have replied to the above by sending a copy of your companies current terms and conditions I must inform you that this is not sufficient to comply with the request and that your company is still in default under the act.

To clarify, just sending the terms and conditions is a breach of the Act and Regulations as, apart from the information that the Regulations provide that you may exclude, the copy must be a "true copy" of the agreement.

This breach of the agreement can be demonstrated as follows;

As you will know section 180(1) (b) authorises, "the omission from a copy of certain material from the original, or the inclusion of certain material in condensed form." This refers to statutory instruments made under the heading Copies of document regulations and in this care in particular to SI 1983/1557.

Before leaving section 180 there are two other sections that should be remembered these are:

Section 2(2) (a) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not satisfied unless the copy supplied is in the prescribed form and conforms to the prescribed requirements;

And more importantly

Section 2(b) A duty imposed by any provision of this Act (except section 35) to supply a copy of any document is not infringed by the omission of any material, or its inclusion in condensed form, if that is authorised by regulations.

You will see that this quite clearly states that whilst certain items may be left out of the copy document the rest of the document must be in the form and contain all items as prescribed by the regulations.

Turning to the regulations regarding what may be omitted from these copies these are contained with SI 1983/1557.

The regulations state:
(2) There may be omitted from any such copy-
(a) any information included in an executed agreement, security instrument or other document relating to the debtor, hirer or surety or included for the use of the creditor or owner only which is not required to be included therein by the Act or any Regulations thereunder as to the form and content of the document of which it is a copy;
(b) any signature box, signature or date of signature (other than, in the case of a copy of a cancellable executed agreement delivered to the debtor under section 63(1) of the Act, the date of signature by the debtor of an agreement to which section 68(b) of the Act applies);

It is quite clear what can be omitted from the copy document, this again asserts that all other details of the agreement should presented in form and content as required by the regulations.

The requirements of the Agreement regulations 1983/1553 are very explicit in describing the form and content of an agreement and this as I have demonstrated also applies to the copy of any such agreement with the above mentioned proviso.

Nowhere within these regulations does it state that part of the agreement can be presented on a separate document headed terms and conditions.
It does state that all terms and conditions should be within the agreement document and is explicit of the form in which it is presented.

I hope this explains why your reply was unacceptable. I await a True copy of my agreement and would remind you again that, whilst the request has not been complied with, the default continues.

Yours faithfully