Thread: Rossendales...........Ple ase Help.

In answer to Martyn, I have a Breakdown of payments and fees and for every payment I have made, rossendales took £1.20 in standing order fees..........(not bad work if you can get it considering they made me pay £5 a week via standing order) and this was on 2 accounts so they have been clawing £2.40 a week from me.

I am not sure what date the council got the liability orders.

rossendales have also charged me £39.00 and on the list it is described as "Visit Fee 2". I have never seen anybody from them, so I am assuming that this was a visit to my previous address and they are charging me even though at that point I know nothing about this!

According to the paperwork I have received from the council I owed them

£278.72 from 1st April 2003 to 31st March 2004
£959.30 from 1st April 2004 to 31st March 2005
£166.48 from 1st April 2005 to 18th May 2005

I moved out of the property on 22nd May 2004 and the council ammended my bill and scrapped some of the debt (their figures dont add up!)

Client:Sedgefield Borough CouncilDebt:171.78Type:Domestic RatesFees:121.80Ref:20000681274Paid:227.40VRM:Balance:66.18The above balance may not include fees incurred in the last few days



Client:Sedgefield Borough CouncilDebt:433.62Type:Domestic RatesFees:21.60Ref:20000681274Paid:97.80VRM:Balance:357.42






The above balance may not include fees incurred in the last few days

As you can see, both of the accounts have the same ref number but rossendales insist on 2 seperate accounts.........to boost their fees i assume!

The letters I have here now are demanding immediate payments of £357.42 and £66.18

The cost of the van is £110.00

Sorry I put this in 2 posts but after i copied and pasted rossendales accounts it took over the posting page and wouldnt let me type anymore

OK so my plot thickens.

I have just got off the phone from Sedgefield Borough Council because I have realised they have made a boo boo!

As I have said, I left the property on 22/05/2004 but I was being charged council tax until May 2005. I queried this and because I could prove I was living elsewhere (thank god for needing to claim housing benefit!) they revised my bill and knocked £914 of it. Sounds good doesn't it?

Unfortunately when they have revised my bill they have used this years figures. So they have used this years liability which is £1088.29 instead of the tax year 2004/2005 which should have been £921.30 a difference of £166.99

I was told to put my complaint in writing!

I told then that rossendales Monkeys had threatened me with a van and she said she would send them a note saying I was disputing the amount, but wouldn't contact them to put the hold on the account.

I quote "its now in the hands of rossendales, there is nothing I can do"

I didn't argue with her, I wasn't going to give her the satifaction of knowing that I have already ceased dealing with rossendales and have started paying the council direct - all be it un beknown to them!

I will keep you posted.

As I said before, The bailiff is not allowed to charge for cards an I see no justification for charging for a standing order as the cost is generated at your bank and they are just receiving a credit, unlike with cards. In my opinion you can argue that it's equivalent to receiving cash. They are not allowed to charge a processing fee so therefore the charges levied against you are illegal and need to be refunded or credited to your account immediately.

As I said previously you classify as a vunerable couple (benefits & disability) -National Standards for Enforcement Officers.

A point to check with the council would be the numbers of the liability orders. Is it one order covering all the debt or is it 2 orders. At least if it was one it would simplify things as well as reducing bailiff costs (if any).

It would be worth your husband writing to R****** stating that he owns all goods in the house (MIL for the TV) that he is disabled, in receipt of benefits and the stress of the threat of a bailiff action is making him ill. State that he is not liable, jointly or severally for the debt and that he is putting them on notice that a form 4 action will take place if they do not desist. Demand the name of the bailiff instructed and ask for a copy of his certification and court of certification. Under the standards they have to supply this information. Copy the letter to the Head of Collections Sedgefield. Depending on their reaction to this he may need to prepare a letter for the police, stating that a bailiff (if you know his name include it) is attempting to make an illegal levy on his property, threatening to make illegal entry and there may be a breach of the peace initiated by the bailiff. Include a copy of the letter to R******* and hand deliver this to the front desk of your local station addressed to the Senior officer in charge. Ask for a receipt. Prepare a similar letter to the one for R******to hand to the bailiff if he comes to your door. State that you will not let him enter peacably. Do not open door, drop from upstairs window if available. Take photograph of him reading it. Remember bailiffs carry ladders as well so keep your upstairs windows closed.

Has anybody got anything else to add?

Thanks for your advice Heathliver, I am just on my way to the post office with 3 letters, one to rossendales, I ammended the one you sent me to hand the bailiff at the door so that I could post it to the company telling them that the bailiff would not be allowed peaceful entry, and 2 to Sedgefield council, the 1st is the one you sent me to demand my fees back and the 2nd is the letter they have asked for because I think they are over charging me, I have also told them in the letter that we a vunerable family and that they should take the case back and I have asked them to persue my ex for 50% of the bill. I have given them 7 days to respond so time will tell.

I omitted to tell the council that I am no longer paying Rossendales and that I am paying them direct. I have online banking, so I can get a free printout of payments I have made if I need them if I need to prove I have been trying to pay.

Thanks to you all for your help and advice, I actually had a good nights sleep last night, the 1st time for a while. I know the situation cant be resolved overnight, but being able to see that I am not alone and there is light at the end of the tunnel is a great comfort to both me and my husband.

Again, many thanks. xxx

Has anybody heard of a "revision of judgement"?

My hubby was prowling around yahoo answers and spotted the term. If and when I manage to get copies of my liability orders and I prove that the facts that the council presented to the court were incorrect, I intend to challenge the order and would like to know what avenues are open to me.

Is there a way I can find out which court granted the order? Would the council tell me? Do the courts issue copies of the orders?

I don't mind paying what I owe, and I accept that I will probably have to pay the whole bill (as the council seem to have no interest in chasing my ex for his half), but what I don't want to do is over pay them.

Sorry to be a pain, but I used to be a "they must be right so accept what they say" type of person, so all your input is being gratefuly accepted in my one woman campaign.

I have just rang the council re copies of my liability orders, the lady I spoke to said that they don't have copies and that I should contact the court. In the next breath she told me that the correspondance I posted yesterday (see my previous post) was with a manager and I was being sent a "courts complaints pack" -------has anybody ever had one of them?

I asked her what my outstanding balance was and she said it was £461.20, which is more than rossendales say I owe! So it looks like rossendales have not sent them the money I have paid them (no suprise there!)

Anyway, I have just rang the court to be told they don't keep copies of liability orders because the council just hires the court room from then and it is not effectivly a court matter.

I suppose I will just have to sit and wait now, and see what the council send me out in response to my last letter to them. You never know, they might do as I said and scrap the lot as a matter of good will...........did you see that elephant flying passed your window then?

I think at this point the council are playing fast and loose with you! By law they must keep copies of liabilty orders. Otherwise how can they enforce them if there is no copy to take back to court if you do not pay. I think I smell a rat. It sounds as though your name is not on the order and they don't want you to know. Any body else agree or disagree?

I would now be preparing a Subject access request under the Data Protection Act. Then you will know all that they do. If they refuse to give it to you because your name is not coupled to that account, you know that they have been chasing you illegaly.

If the council does not keep copies of liability orders, how can they pass on information contained within them to rossendales.............. ......?

Exactly my point F.P.. I think Martin was right and a SAR needs doing to get to the bottom of it! I think under NS for EO they have to show authority to act and for who for if requested...... If R***** didn't have a copy of the LO how could they provetheir authority to act?

I am waiting to see what words of wisdom they send me through the post.

I am begining to think that the order is made in my ex husbands name but because I was stupid enough to reply to their correspondance I have been lumbered with it.

The orders were made in 2004 and they managed to trace me here in Morecambe in 2006, I left the North East and moved here in 2004 and all correspondance before they traced me was sent to my old address.

I had to prove to them that I had moved, luckily when I left I had to claim housing benefit as I was a single parent living in a place of safety, so there were records of my whereabouts.(because they were trying to bill me for 2005/2006 as well). The council even "told me off" because I hadn't notified them of my change of address! I have lived in many places and have never heard of anyone notifying a previous council of a move. Yes, tell them your new address when you apply for your ct/hb if you need to, and on the forms you have to fill in your previous address anyway!

If my name is NOT on the liability order, will I be able to claim back the money I have already paid to rossendales?

I might end up sending the bailiffs to the bailiffs office

Am I going blind? I thought I had seen a link to a downloadable S.A.R. form on here somewhere and now I can't find it. Anybody know where I should be going?

If the original Council Tax Bill was in both your names then you would be jointly and severally liable. But the interesting point you raised that if they had only applied for a LO in your ex's name then will they be able to collect using the bailiffs. In my opinion no, not until they had been back to court and put your name on the order also. Until they did that then it would be an illegal levy and instruction and the bailiffs would have been operating criminally. FP amd Martin what do you think?

Here One supplied by our good friend WOW for bailiffs, I suppose you can modify it!

Quote:
Name of firm of bailiffs
FAO the Data Controller
Address 1
Address 2
Address 3
Address 4

[DATE]

Dear Sir/Madam

Re: [YOUR NAME + ANY REF]: Data Access Request & opportunity to mitigate incorrect fees

I write pursuant to Section 7 of the Data Protection Act 1998 and enclose payment of £10 the maximum prescribed under the Act and request you send me the following seven points relating to ALL accounts you have for me and anyone at my address.

a) The name and address of the court that certificated the bailiff who acts in this matter

b) The certificate number of the aforementioned bailiff

d) All letters documents emails comments faxes personal opinions memos and other related information which would qualify as information defined under the Act.

c) Written confirmation your bailiffs fees of £[AMOUNT] charged and they truthfully comply with the law.

d) The name and address of the person or body who instructed you and the date of instruction.

e) An itemised Breakdown of all the fees charges orders costs and other monies that make up the total obtained by your bailiff being £[AMOUNT]

f) A detail showing how much and on what dates I paid you and how much you have paid on to the creditor.

I appreciate the Act allows you 40 days to fulfill this request but I look forward to receiving the above at your earliest convenience.

I now give you an opportunity to check whether your bailiff has overcharged me with his fees. If his fees are truthfully compliant with the law, please confirm in writing or refund me within seven days with an explanation why I was overcharged. If I find an irregularity with his fees after seven days I will automatically file an official Form 4 complaint at the bailiff’s certificating court for committing offences under Sections 1 to 5 of the Fraud Act 2006. This may also involve a criminal investigation by police and your firm’s director(s) may be liable for benefiting from a fraudulent money transfer or proceeds of crime.

This document is delivered by Royal Mail and I deem it good service on you by the ordinary course of post under Section 7 of the Interpretation Act 1978. It is now your responsibility and in your own interests this letter is handed to the relevant person within your organisation. I regret I am unable to discuss this matter by telephone or in person.

Yours Sincerely


YOUR NAME

It might be worth £20 to send an SAR to both LA and R*******?