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I have been dealing with the delightful Natwest regarding my PPI charges and they have refused to pay them back. They say they have looked at all their records and do not believe I am entitled to these refunded as sufficient information was given to me at time of purchase.
The thing is the man who sold me this insurance clearly said to me verbally that I would definitely get the loan if I took out the payment protection. I was concerned I would be rejected for the loan as my credit was bad at that point. naively I believed him as I was desperate for the loan to clear off my other debts, so I paid the £5400 PPI!! I have since cancelled the policy but I have calculated that I am due about £2500 plus interest refunded.
They have now stated that if I am not satisfied I am to take it to the Ombudsman.
Does anyone have any advise? This has been going on since May!!
Lloyds TSB (SARS) request sent 9th June 2006
£2191 Moneyclaim Issued 11/08/2006, Acknowleded 17th August Defence 14 Sep, AQ returned 5/10/2006.SETTLED IN FULL £2,670 26/11/2006/ Lloyds Credit Card SETTLED IN FULL £267 MBNA SETTLED IN FULL 15/09/2006 £829 Citicard (SARS) request sent 22nd June 2006 Moneyclaim issued 19th Sep, Defence and AQ received 5/10/2006, AQ returned 5/10/2006, part refund received 10/10/2006
GE MONEY SETTLLED IN FULL £400
Barclaycard Me and Mrs SARS sent 19/10/2006 settled £350
Welcome Finance PPI 2 accounts one settled £1018 waiting on other
GE Money PPI 1 account settled 8/5/2008 £560 2nd account SETTLED IN FULL £3,599.78p 15thAugust 2008
Lloyds TSB PPI CC complaint sent 10/04/2008
Black Horse PPI with FOS 20/05/2008
HFC PPI complaint sent 22/05/2008
i did one of these several months ago with Natwest.
they said they wouldn't refund and gave final response so took it to fos
When FOS informed natwest of registration of complaint they offered full amount plus interest without even going through FOS review of my complaint
i think they don't offer refunds unless you escalate the complaint to court or ombudsmen then they pay out. saves them paying out the people with no balls to take it all the way
thanks for your replies. they havent actually said this is our final response, but it seems a pretty definite answer. So what is fos? What should my next step be then when I go to Ombudsman?
Are there any template letters or advise I should follow when contacting them?
thanks for your replies. they havent actually said this is our final response, but it seems a pretty definite answer. So what is fos? What should my next step be then when I go to Ombudsman?
Are there any template letters or advise I should follow when contacting them?
thanks for your help
Karen
Hello Karen,
What preparation and homework have you done for this claim, Have you sent a SAR or a request to see your original credit agreement.
They are hoping that you will accept what they say and hope that you will go away. But you are not going to are you
Please give us a bit more background information so we can assist you
If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW
I origianlly sent them a letter in May requesting a copy of the policy, they could not provide it, instead I got a statement of account along with the loan information ie, loan amount, interest charges, PPI amount, total etc and int rate.
Then in June, I got a reply in the form of a standard letter asking for more info and i completed a questionnaire stating reasons etc why i believe i was mis-sold the PPI. my reasons being were that I was told verbally by there memeber of staff that if I took out the PPI i would definitly get the loan. because of my desperate situation teamed with naivety, I agreed without hesitation.
So now they are saying that they dont believe I was mis-sold this PPI and I cant get a refund. Now I am certain I was mis-sold this. but how can I prove it if I was told verbally?? I was aware that the PPI would cover me for unemployment through accident and sickness, and that I would certainly be given the loan if I took out this expensive insurance!!
Does it say any of this in the small print? As I am sure I must ahve signed something to say I agree to the PPI charges, though I dont have a copy of this. I dont know what to say to the Ombudsman especially where I am worried this cant be proved..
what do you think my chances are?? Its in the region of £3k i am wanting back.
I origianlly sent them a letter in May requesting a copy of the policy, they could not provide it, instead I got a statement of account along with the loan information ie, loan amount, interest charges, PPI amount, total etc and int rate.
Then in June, I got a reply in the form of a standard letter asking for more info and i completed a questionnaire stating reasons etc why i believe i was mis-sold the PPI. my reasons being were that I was told verbally by there memeber of staff that if I took out the PPI i would definitly get the loan. because of my desperate situation teamed with naivety, I agreed without hesitation.
So now they are saying that they dont believe I was mis-sold this PPI and I cant get a refund. Now I am certain I was mis-sold this. but how can I prove it if I was told verbally?? I was aware that the PPI would cover me for unemployment through accident and sickness, and that I would certainly be given the loan if I took out this expensive insurance!!
Does it say any of this in the small print? As I am sure I must ahve signed something to say I agree to the PPI charges, though I dont have a copy of this. I dont know what to say to the ombudsman especially where I am worried this cant be proved..
what do you think my chances are?? Its in the region of £3k i am wanting back.
Thanks again
x
Hello Karen,
I would estimate your chances at the present moment with their last response to be zilch.
You really need to be doing some detective work and get all information that they hold on this account,
A full S.A.R - (Subject access request), you will find the template letter in the ppi sticky, copy,paste and amend it to your personal details. Send a £10 postal order and send it recorded delivery as soon as. You can track the letter using the royal mail website. They have 40days + 2 days postage under the Data protection Act 1998. They should send you all information, this is including recorded telephone conversations or telephone transcripts.
It is truely amazing that they state that they cannot supply you with the policy details. and I bet you £1 they will not be able to produce your credit agreement either. They have a terrible track record regarding production of such importand documents, they hopefully will be their downfall.
Also send a legal request under the consumer credit act section 77/78 for a copy of your true credit agreement, that is the one you signed to agree to the loan of money (which would include the ppi and the ppi interest).
This will cost you £1, again send a postal order and send recorded delivery. They have 12working days + 2 days postage. If they don't supply it within this time scale, they are in breach of the cca and the account will be in legal dispute. And then after a following 30days they have committed a criminal offence.
Don't be disheartened by their normal standard template response, cause when it comes down to it. Under the Misrepresentation Act, the onus is on them to prove that they did not mis-sell it to you.
I do consider that you are quite a way off from approaching the fos with this complaint, there is a lot more you can do before this.
When was the loan taken out. and can you give us an ideal of the Breakdown of the loan, ppi and interest they charged
If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW
Hi, thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I really do appreciate it.
Ok, I have just looked at the letter again as I am now at home, and it says "The policy was provided on a non advice basis. this means no recommendation was made...." WHAT RUBBISH!!!!!!!!!!
OK, so I need to a SAR then to get ALL information rather than just a random typed up letter stating what is consisted of?
The loan was taken out in May 05, for £23,500 over 6 years. The PPI came to £5400 and the interest approx £6000. I was made fully aware of these costs at sale, I wasnt happy with it, but when I am told by a Nat west advisor that I can only get the loan with the £5400 PPI i didnt even question it. I didnt expect to be conned by a bank i trusted (at that point!!).
18 months after the loan started, I cancelled the PPI. They refunded the unspent PPI back on to the loan no problem, along with interest. This totalled about £2300.
Should I send the legal letter and the SAR one together?
Hi, thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I really do appreciate it.
Ok, I have just looked at the letter again as I am now at home, and it says "The policy was provided on a non advice basis. this means no recommendation was made...." WHAT RUBBISH!!!!!!!!!!
The loan was taken out in May 05, (This was 4 months after the Financial Services Authority ruling on the mis-selling of PPI _ this means you are within the regulations for mis-selling of PPI as ruled by the FSA) for £23,500 over 6 years. The PPI came to £5400 and the interest approx £6000. I was made fully aware of these costs at sale, I wasnt happy with it, but when I am told by a Nat west advisor that I can only get the loan with the £5400 PPI i didnt even question it.(make sure you ask for all the data in your SAR. include all paper, elecronic, CD, Microfisch, film, hard drive, floppy disk etc etc. I didnt expect to be conned by a bank i trusted (at that point!!).
18 months after the loan started, I cancelled the PPI. They refunded the unspent PPI back on to the loan no problem, along with interest. This totalled about £2300.
Should I send the legal letter and the S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) one together? IMHO yes start the claim now we have had enouh fob offs
Hi, thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I really do appreciate it.
Ok, I have just looked at the letter again as I am now at home, and it says "The policy was provided on a non advice basis. this means no recommendation was made...." WHAT RUBBISH!!!!!!!!!!
OK, so I need to a S.A.R - (Subject access request) then to get ALL information rather than just a random typed up letter stating what is consisted of?
The loan was taken out in May 05, for £23,500 over 6 years. The PPI came to £5400 and the interest approx £6000. I was made fully aware of these costs at sale, I wasnt happy with it, but when I am told by a Nat west advisor that I can only get the loan with the £5400 PPI i didnt even question it. I didnt expect to be conned by a bank i trusted (at that point!!).
18 months after the loan started, I cancelled the PPI. They refunded the unspent PPI back on to the loan no problem, along with interest. This totalled about £2300.
It is ok to send them together and do it as soon as you can, to start the clock ticking Remember to send them recorded delivery, keep you receipt and you can track the delivery on the royal mail website for proof of delivery
If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW
thanks again for your help, you are a helpful bunch!
Also, I am epilieptic. Surely this would not have been covered in the policy???
I have written out the SAR letter and the request for credit agreement. I have also writtena cover letter to the evil man who refused this saying the following.
Is this ok or is there anything I should or shouldnt say???
Thank you very much for your letter dated 5 August declining my PPI claims. As you may well imagine this is not a satisfactory answer therefore I have included two letters, one Subject access request and another requesting to see a copy of the credit agreement.
I am outraged to see your letter states that the policy was provided on a “non advice” basis. This is clearly not true. I was desperate and naive when I went to the Hampstead Village Branch of Natwest in May 2005 where a male member of staff clearly took advantage of this fact and was false with his information when describing the policy.
The detail I was given regarding the PPI was that it would cover me in the event of accident and/or sickness and unemployment and that it would also give me a higher chance of being accepted for the loan application. This is clearly a fabrication and the PPI is not a condition of the loan. The cancellation period was also not clearly expressed to me.
I therefore wish for you or the appropriate person to provide me with the information outlined in the letters enclosed so I can resubmit my claim.
thanks again for your help, you are a helpful bunch!
Also, I am epilieptic. Surely this would not have been covered in the policy???
I have written out the S.A.R - (Subject access request) letter and the request for credit agreement. I have also writtena cover letter to the evil man who refused this saying the following.
Is this ok or is there anything I should or shouldnt say???
Thank you very much for your letter dated 5 August declining my PPI claims. As you may well imagine this is not a satisfactory answer therefore I have included two letters, one Subject access request and another requesting to see a copy of the credit agreement.
I am outraged to see your letter states that the policy was provided on a “non advice” basis. This is clearly not true. I was desperate and naive when I went to the Hampstead Village Branch of Natwest in May 2005 where a male member of staff clearly took advantage of this fact and was false with his information when describing the policy.
The detail I was given regarding the PPI was that it would cover me in the event of accident and/or sickness and unemployment and that it would also give me a higher chance of being accepted for the loan application. This is clearly a fabrication and the PPI is not a condition of the loan. The cancellation period was also not clearly expressed to me.
I therefore wish for you or the appropriate person to provide me with the information outlined in the letters enclosed so I can resubmit my claim.
Yours faithfully
Possibly mention the fact of your medical history, that was never discussed, would have made this policy useless
If any of my posts are helpful, please feel free to click my scales. All information is given as my opinion only, based on my own personal experiences. I have no legal training, but have educated myself in aspects of consumer legislation. My motto "NEVER GIVE IN, NEVER SURRENDER", THERE IS A WAR ON YOU KNOW
the fact you had epilepsy does not necessarily make the policy useless. This is a myth that people continue to propagate. The T+C's of most of NW polices cover pre-exsting medical conditions. More importantly, NW did not offer any advice on the policy. It was the customers responsibility to read the cover and decide if they wanted to purchase it.
However, yopu should just go straight to the fos on this one. The argument you will win with there is that 'you were not advised that any refund applied would be disproportionate'. This one never fails as theis little gem of info is hidden in the certificate of insurance which is sent out post sale - FOS do not like this one bit as it is a very salient piece of information and is provided post sale.
I had this issue with Natwest, I had a loan with them in March 05 over 84 months. Found out that the ppi was only over 60 months but they added the ppi to the loan and then added interest onto that combined total. This meant that I was paying 7 years interest on a PPI that would have run out after 5 years.
Got the fos involved and am getting a full refund of all premiums. If you have your loan Breakdown see how much the PPI is p/m and times it by 72, if the total is higher than the quoted insurance figure, try and times it by 60 this will give you a rough estimate whether it covered 5 or 6 years. If it only covered 5 then it was mis sold.
Thanks for the info. I'm sorry, but could you explain a bit more what you mean when you say 'you were not advised that any refund applied would be disproportionate' etc. I am not 100% clear on what you mean.
However, yopu should just go straight to the fos on this one. The argument you will win with there is that 'you were not advised that any refund applied would be disproportionate'. This one never fails as theis little gem of info is hidden in the certificate of insurance which is sent out post sale - FOS do not like this one bit as it is a very salient piece of information and is provided post sale.
as posted by CHF
I believe what is said is you were not advised that the PPI REFUND/REBATE on cancellation would in no way meet the cost incurred in taking it out in the first place. Namely you take out PPI masssssssive cose and if you cancel you get very litttttttle back in rebate or refund.That is the way they financial institutions have been making their money and the other downside is the policy would probable not pay out because of exclusions which will most likely not have been explained to you at the point of sale by an advisor
hope this helps your understanding of the meaning RIP OFF;-)
alanalana is quite correct there. The method of calcualting a refund is what is known as 'Rule of 78' calcualtion. Basically its a way of apportioning the premium you pay over the term of the loan. Its not so much of a rip off once you know the basic premise behind it is that as the risk to the bank/insurer in the earlier years is greater (loan amount is higher and more unexpired time to cover), then the banks can charge more for the earlier years. They can also add in reasonable admin charges. However, the disclosure of this information is contained in the 'Certificate of Insurnace'. For most NW loans done in branch etc. this paperwork is sent out to you after the sale. The fos have not upheld a single complaint in favour of the bank in this respect.
Consider the person who takes several loans and increases/decreses them every couple of years. Each time he cancels the cover and gets the new loan (or voce versa) he has wasted another heap of money. Many many people have this type of loan history and have lost a packet.
PPI rejected Natwest... HELP!!!!
regarding my PPI
Reply With Quote
Re: PPI rejected Natwest... HELP!!!!
Originally Posted by karenc79
and I bet you £1 they will not be able to produce your credit agreement either. They have a terrible track record regarding production of such importand documents, they hopefully will be their downfall.
Remember to send them recorded delivery, keep you receipt and you can track the delivery on the royal mail website for proof of delivery