Thread: Blair Oliver Scott (Bank of Scotland) - dodgy CCA??

Hi all

My OH has just had the 'agreement' back for his old B of S card, now with Blair Oliver and Scott.

I'm pretty sure from the countless hours spent on here that it's not enforceable, but I'd really appreciate someone with proper knowledge having a looksee.

My thoughts on the single sided sheet of paper sent to him are...

1 - it's illegible. Even the headings make you strain to read them (OH says he thinks it looks like it could be from Microfiche). It's copied onto an A4 sheet, but the 'agreement' only takes up about 2/3 of the width, so even without the really really dodgy clarity it would be tricky to see.

2 - I can't see anything about a limit, we will decide a limit or anything resembling this type of statement. That said, I can't see most of the document so it possibly could be there, but none of the headings seem to relate to anything like that either.

3 - This is a biggy I think - No terms apart from whatever is in the signature box on the bottom right.

4 - It was sent with a note saying 'copy application as requested'

5 - It's headed 'Application form' and mentions 'application' within the form (the bits I can read anyway!)

If I'm right, could someone point me in the right direction for how to proceed? Should I just leave them to go past the 30 days (which is the 12th August by my reckoning), or do I write and ask for a legible copy of my agreement?

I don't want hubby to be seen as obstructive or anything, so I would lean towards the latter, but I know a hell of a lot of you are far more knowledgeable about these so I would rather bow to your advice than steam in and do the wrong thing

Thanks in advance

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completely unenforceable.

Jogs

Totally agree though they may have complied with CCA s78 request (debatable) what has been supplied is unenforceable, the following is part of the response I received when I asked for a legal opinion on a very similar copy of a so called agreement for my CCA request with MBNA agreement.

The agreement does not appear to state the credit limit, the rate of interest, details of any power to vary the agreement or debtors repayment obligations. Although this is difficult to determine when referring to this agreement as it is impossible to read. These terms are prescribed terms within the CCA 1974 and must be contained within the agreement

I would advise that you write stating you believe the agreement is improperly executed, and as a consequence is irredeemably unenforceable (See Wilson v First County Trust CA).

All the best dpick

Hi

Thanks for your responses. I was kind of thinking it was caput for them, but I've not done this before so didn't want to do anything without checking first.

dpick, I don't suppose you could point me in the direction of a good letter at all? I've built up a bit of a template library of my own from my trawling around on here, but nothing that seems to fit this yet. I'm not bad with letter writing, but I don't think I can compete with the ones on here that state points of law so accurately!

I did want to ask you as well about one of your wins if you don't mind - am I right in thinking that with the JD Williams one that the cca was not enforceable (due to it not being there!) and you then managed to get the interest you'd paid back too? Or am I reading that all wrong...

Also, can anyone tell me if now is the time to tell my OH to stop payments to them, or does he wait until the 30 calendar days are up? I really don't want to put a foot wrong, so any help with this is much appreciated.

Cheers all

Hi again this is a copy of my first response to MBNA after they sent me an agreement that was almost unreadable and did noy contain any of the prescribed terms

MBNA Europe Bank Ltd
Stansfield House
Chester Business Park
Chester
Cheshire
CH4 9QQ
Account: XXXXXXXXXXX
Thank you for the information you sent following my request under the CCA 1974.

However, I made a request to you on 12th March 2007 for a true copy of the original executed agreement applicable to the alleged debt. Under the CCA s77/78, you are obliged to send me a true copy of the actual credit agreement in a clear and readable condition.

A regulated credit agreement contains all of the prescribed terms, other required information and statements of my statutory rights. Any separate terms and conditions (which should have been referred to in the original agreement) should also be provided to me and must be those applicable at the time that the agreement was signed.

It would appear that this agreement is unenforceable as it has have been improperly executed. The agreement does not contain all the prescribed terms set out in the Consumer Credit Act namely, The agreement does not state the credit limit, the rate of interest, details of any power to vary the agreement or debtors repayment obligations. Although this is difficult to determine when referring to your agreement as it is impossible to read. I believe that this agreement is improperly executed, and as a consequence is irredeemably unenforceable as an example see ( Wilson v First County Trust CA).
As I believe this agreement to be irredeemably unenforceable all payments will stop and all further correspondence must be in writing I will not under any circumstances make or receive any other type of correspondence.

Yours

dpick

You are correct my claim against J.D Williams was for all interest applied to the account and charges. I never signed any agreement so there was no agreement to allow them to make charges or to apply interest.

dpick

That's excellent, thanks very much I can't click your scales as it won't let me do it again, but I would if I could!

I didn't realise it was possible to try for interest/charges back - I can see I'm going back into the black hole of time that these forums have become to find out more

Thanks again!!

Ok, quick update...

I fired off a letter after the application was sent (your letter was a big help thanks dpick) detailing the issues raised from it and sent it at the end of last month.

Today OH received a standard 'we're looking into your complaint' letter (what complaint, I just stated facts, no complaining there!), so I guess we'll hear more in the next few weeks.

The 30 days was up a couple of days ago, and the d/d for this month has been cancelled so I imagine we'll be hearing from them about that before the 'complaint' is looked into

That's it for now - until the phone calls start at least

I've just remembered something I forgot to mention yesterday, which may or may not be of use to me.

The reply received yesterday was from HBOS at their Lovell Park Road address, but I sent the 'you've only sent a application form' letter to Blair Oliver Scott at their Rosyth address. And, on noticing that, I then checked the application envelope I received and found that despite sending the original CCA request to BlairOS, and the compliment slip being from them, this also came from the Lovell Park Road address.

I know that it's generally acknowledged that they are one and the same, but I still find it odd that I write to one company and receive a reply from another, who supposedly don't want anything to do with hubbies account.

Can anyone shed some light on this for me at all please

Right, another quick question about this...

I'm not actually sure whether this account has been sold to, or is being managed by BlairOS. If I'm getting letters from one when I write to the other I would assume managed by, but I'd rather not just assume. Unfortunately OH used to chuck correspondence about debts (I know I know, I've told him too) so I can't look back on anything.

Is my best bet here to SAR them, as there are charges which could be claimed too and I would be able to see if it's been assigned or sold? Alternatively I could just write to HBOS and ask them directly (cheaper, but may be ignored as Goldfish did for my account with them).

Also, if we're stating that the CCA is unenforceable, does this preclude going after charges as surely that's saying you have a debt? I know you did this and won dpick, but they actually didn't have anything in writing to say there was a debt, and we just have a dodgy CCA as opposed to a non existent one.

Only me again Oh, and apologies for the lack of paragraphs in this one - my return key isn't working (obviously, as that's an extremely common problem isn't it) I meant to also add in #8, the letter they sent hubby yesterday was not sent to our address. It went to my mum and dads home instead. Now this used to be where statements/correspondence etc went to, but we moved a year ago, and since then everything from BlairOS and HBOS has been to the new address, except this letter. Should I bring this up with them, as they know damn well he's not there anymore, so why would they send anything there - what's in it for them and what are they playing at?