Thread: Nastywest - Advice Please re SAR

Hi I'm new to the forum and have been reading how successful you have all been and hoping for some advice.

Nastywest paid in full for all my bank charges in Sept 2007 and now I am claiming for all the PPI for loan and credit card accounts.

Basically I wrote a complaint letter to Natwest in Feb 2008 for various things one of them being refund of ALL my PPI. Now I have received a letter following their investigations stating:

'On this occasion I have been unable to confirm precisely what information you were given at the time you purchased the policy. In the circumstances, as a gesture of goodwill and without any admission of liability, the Bank is prepared to make you the offer detailed below'

The bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums and interest that you have paid to 28 Feb 2003...'

Amounts to £876.47 which I know cannot be correct as I am asking for ALL PPI to be refunded.

As it stands I have a loan (taken out May 2003), o/d and a credit card balance which are in the hands of Wescot Finance and I have an agreement with them to pay a monthly amount.

I was going to argue that because my current loan is being paid off including all the PPI and interest, surely because I am paying Wescot that I couldn't use the PPI element even if I needed to?

I think that the PPI element amounts to about £10k in total but to be sure do I need to do a SAR?

IMO if Natwest are unable to confirm what information was given then surely I have a case?

On another note - if I get a SAR will this show where my payments to Wescot have been allocated with regards to loan, credit card and o/d? In my credit file there is no consistency because the loan account has only just starting reducing monthly when I've been paying Wescot for over 2 years??

HELP!! Where do I find a copy of a standard SAR?

If I'm in an agreement with Wescot should this still come up as a Default on my record every month?

One more thing Natwest never closed my account when it was referred to Wescot but I can't access it. Am I within my right to close my accounts so that if I get a refund for PPI they will have to issue a cheque instead or use a different bank account? Last time with the bank charges they insisted on paying into my NatWest account and transferring across to Wescot -said I didn't have any choice??

Sory to ramble but any advice most welcome.

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I will bump this up. The bank would have a note with regards to the loan itself, ie paperwork. I think you need to ask them to clarify and provide copies of the loan paperwork so you can be certain that their figures are correct. Has the PPI on the current loan been cancelled? That I would do straight away.
Not sure on the Westcot questions so hopefully someone will come along and have a look at that.

I'm definitely not taking the easy option and settling for just over £800 - they owe me far more than that - they are not getting out of it that eay haha!

I will do as you suggest and send an SAR and a letter.

I'll also find out re Wescot. Last time I spoke to Nastywest was in Oct 07 when i got all my bank charges refunded but they refused to pay by cheque or into a different account. They would only refund into my Natwest account which I don't use and have no card etc for. This in turn was supposed to have been credited against my loan debt but I'm still sorting this out as this doesn't show on my credit file ?!!

What happened was I couldn't afford to keep up the £493 monthly payments and sort advice from a Branch Manager and Customer Service Advisor who couldn't help. The CSA advised me to wait until it was referred to debt management who would set up a payment plan - this is where Wescot came in.

But as far as I know my account is still open with Natwest - am I able to close this and keep my payment plan with Wescot?

If I then get more PPI refunded can I insist they pay by cheque or into a different account - or legally can they insist it comes of the debt??

With regards to Defaults - I have 3 defaults monthly on my credit file all from Natwest. 1 - Loan, 2 -Credit Card and 3 - overdraft. But I have it in writing from March 2008 that the Overdraft account has actually been paid off (according to their records) but it still shows as a debt and a monthly default!! This is something I need to get sorted a well - where do I stand with this? Can I claim compensation if I send a copy of the credit report and their letter?

Thanks for the help so far

I have received a second letter today from Natwest offering me another gesture of goodwill.

I have requested copies of my credit agreements but think that this letter is in relation to my current loan that is managed by Wescot.

As background: I took out the loan in February 2003 for £25k with monthly payments of £493.47 over 7 years It was then referred to Wescot for non-payment and I started paying Wescot in March 2006. Overall I made a total of 26 monthly payments of £493.47 initially giving a total paid of £12,830.22 before Wescot took it over.

The total at the beginning of the loan to be repaid including interest and protection is £41,451.48 so £16,450 is interest and PPI!

The letter today states:
On this occasion I have been unable to confirm precisely what info you were given .... as a gesture of goodwill and without any admission of liability ... the offer detailed below:

The bank is prepared to refund the insurance premiums to your loan account that you have paid to date as a gesture of goodwill. Our calculations show that you have paid a total of £2742.32 for the PPI element of your loan. .. credit my loan account with your refund of £2742.32 reducing the arrears on the loan.

'They are also crediting my loan account with a further £2857.96 as part of our committment to putting your loan back into the position it would be if you had not taken the PPI.'

Erm where does the £2857.96 come from - anyone??! How have they worked this out??

Where do I stand asking for this refund to be paid directly by cheque seeing as it's my money? Legally are they in their rights to pay it off the loan account??

Apparantely they are going to continue with my payment plan but surely now the PPI has been taken off the overall outstanding debt should be reduced significantly as it would have reduced the total interest and ppi down from £16,450.
Anyone know how to work this out without the ppi from the beginning?

Sorry If I've confused anyone but if you can help it would be much appreciated...

Update for you. I sent off letters to Natwest re 2 out of 3 of my PPI Claims.

First PPI Claim
In my previous post I explained that Natwest had offered a refund of my current loan's PPI as a gesture of goodwill and also would credit the loan account to bring it in line with a non-ppi loan. They have also cancelled the PPI for this loan and will credit the PPI cancellation.

Great .. but I've tried to negotiate and ask that the PPI that I've already paid (over £2.5k) is refunded directly to me and not credited to my loan account. They have refused - as my account is managed by Wescot and I have £1.4 k in arrears they are crediting it all to my loan account. But the arrears would be cleared anyway by the other 2 credits.

They are also refusing to pay interest because it is a gesture of goodwill.

So, my question is where do I go from here? Can I legally request a direct payment as it is my money and can I push for interest? Surely if I threatened to take them to court as they've offered a gesture of goodwill they are admitting liability anyway?

Claim 2
Again they've offered me a gesture of goodwill refund payment of £867 which is correct. I asked for details of this loan which they gave me but did state that 'The Loan Agreement for this policy is no longer available'. Loan was taken out in May 2002 and cleared in Feb 2003.

Again they will not pay interest because it's a gesture of goodwill.

To be honest I'm happy if they will pay £867 direct plus the other £2.5k direct because it will help clear my other debts. So what's the best option now?

I want to try and get letters in the post tonight if possible as it's been dragging on since February!

Hi thanks for your comments. I haven't formally made a CCA request - it's actually been quite easy so far to get them to offer this money!

I sent my original PPI refund letter in February and they have sent the offers as my previous post.

PPI Claim 2 - I asked Natwest in July for the personal loan info for my PPI Claim 2 - this loan was re-financed in Feb 2003 so not in the hands of Wescot. They initially offered me the £867 but didn't include any details of the loan so I asked for details which they sent me but said that the Loan Agreement is No Longer Available (loan dated May 2002 - Feb 03)

PPI Claim 1 -My first PPI claim I never requested a CCA but do have details of the monthly payments with and without PPI etc, total loan amount and amount payable etc. I've been paying Wescot for this one for over 2 years but haven't requested a CCA from Wescot.

They first wrote and gave me a goodwill gesture of nearly £8.5k consisting of: refund of PPI premium upon cancellation, PPI refund of premium paid so far and refund to bring my account in line with that of a non-ppi account. I wrote back requesting stat 8% interest and agreed that the PPI cancellation refund and their offer of a refund for non-ppi account be credited against my loan account (was happy to do this because it brings the debt down) but I requested that the PPI paid so far plus my interest refund be forwarded by cheque - they have refused and say it will all be credited to my loan account.

But a new development - I called Wescot lunchtme to get a settlement figure -thought I would be cheeky and offer them the amount that Natwest have agreed to refund so far (nearly £9k). Wescot tell me that the account was withdrawn from them by the client on 7 August and that I needed to cancel my Standing Order to Wescot for this account.

How strange - why would Natwest do this?

So do I accept their offers in part settlement on condition that they pay me direct by cheque. They have said they won't pay me direct because I have arrears of nearly £1.4k on the loan account which needs to be cleared - but if they are refunding nearly £9k then obviously the arrears will be cleared and I'll be in credit!

They have already admitted that for my PPI Claim 2 they no longer have the loan agreement so there is no CCA for this one. They have offered a GOGW of £867 but no interest - what exactly can I claim for if they have no CCA on file?

I shall send a CCA request off for PPI Claim 1 to both Natwest and Wescot. If this has now been withdrawn from Wescot and Natwest don't have a CCA on file what do I do? The balance is £27k but would reduce by nearly £9k with the refunds - is there any way of settling this as an unenforced debt if they do not produce the original CCA??

I also owe Wescot £8k for a Natwest Credit card so will CCA for that as well!

On another note I really do want to settle some debts and make a fresh start. I pay both CL Finance (Debenhams) and Cabot (Citi) a monthly payment and would like to make a cheeky offer for settlement. Is it wise that I again get a CCA to make sure the debt is actually enforcable?

I called Cabot today and offered a F&F settlement of £700 for the outstanding £1800 and they tried to push it to £1k. I've declined and they are supposed to be getting back to me. But think I'm wise to hold off until I know about the CCA and then if no CCA I'll make a really cheeky offer of say 10% plus removal of the default.

Is there anything else I need to do?

I had 2 overdrafts with Natwest purely made up of charges which I reclaimed but they refuse to remove the default on my account. When questioning the date of the default I was told it was Jan 06 (correct) but that one default was issued to cover all four of my 'accounts'. (1 loan, 1 ccard, 2 overdrafts). Can they legally do this??

Anyone any advice re my last thread? As time is ticking i really want to get letters in the post today.

I have drafted a letter to Natwest requesting the CCA's on all my accounts. I am also agreeing to part-settlement on my terms on the offers of goodwill so far.

Part settlement includes interest payable at 8% plus direct payment to me by cheque and not to my loan account/current account.

Does this sound good or should I hold off on the part settlement?

I've also told them that if they can't produce current CCA then they are in breach of the DPA by providing my details to Wescot and then withdrawing the account from them.

Just want to make sure that I'm doing the right thing by agreeing to part settle...

Sorry me again! I have just drafted this letter to Natwest and wondered if someone could have a look and let me know if it's ok. Sorry for the long post:

[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']I am writing in response to your letters dated 26 June 2008, 16 July 2008 and 6 August 2008 I relation to the above 3 PPI Policies with Natwest.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Credit Agreements[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']After seeking legal advice I now request a copy of the credit agreements in relation to all of the above Personal Loan and PPI Policies.

Under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77−79), I am entitled to receive a copy of my credit agreement on request. I enclose a payment of £3.00 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act.

According to this Consumer Credit Act a copy of these credit agreements should be supplied within 12 days.

I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreement under these sections of the Act.

[/FONT][FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Offers of Goodwill[/FONT][FONT='Arial','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Again I refer to my letter dated 22 July 2008. After seeking legal advice I accept unconditional Part Settlements on these accounts. Until I receive my Credit Agreements I am unable to agree to a Full and final Settlement.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']I request that the following Part Settlement for your Offers of Goodwill are made payable to me direct by cheque and not credited against my loan account or refunded into my dormant/closed current account. This is money that I have been deprived the use of due to mis-selling of the PPI which has caused me financial issues with various organizations not just Natwest. It has also caused emotional stress and upset. I’ve been advised that it is therefore my money to distribute to creditors as I wish and Natwest cannot control access to this money.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']I had a conversation with Stuart, Section Manager at Credit Management Services in Telford on 5 August 2008 to obtain the status of my accounts. He has advised me that you are aware that my current account is Dormant and I have subsequently requested full closure on this account. Stuart confirmed that when claiming against Natwest for a refund for PPI that the claimant can request how the money is refunded – company policy allows it to be refunded by cheque and it doesn’t have to be refunded against a loan account or into a current account.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']In your letter dated 16 July 2008 you informed me that my Loan Account is in arrears by £3947.76. Once I have received the cheque for Part Settlement as per this letter and copies of all of my Credit Agreements then I will look into bringing these arrears to a zero balance.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']I am also going to continue to claim for the statutory interest at 8% as again this is money that I have been deprived the use of whilst paying for PPI. If I referred this case to Court then any money payable to me would be in the form of a personal cheque and would include statutory interest at 8% (according to S69 of the county court Act). It would also be highly in my favour as they would question why you have made Offers of Goodwill if there is no liability to be questioned, so I feel the claim for interest is justified. [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']I would accept unconditional Part Settlement as per below:[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']1 Payment Protection Insurance Policy – [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif'] [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Credit of PPI premium to Loan Account when PPI was cancelled: £2626.68[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Refund of PPI paid to date: £2742.32[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Refund a further amount to bring account in line with non-PPI account £2857.96[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']+ Claim of Statutory Interest at 8% APR on paid PPI amount (£2742.32) £943.10[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']TOTAL TO BE CREDITED/REFUNDED £9170.06

[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']2 Payment Protection Insurance Policy - [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Refund of PPI Paid £876.47[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']+ Claim of Statutory Interest at 8% APR on paid PPI amount (£876.47) £408.36[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']TOTAL TO BE REFUNDED £1284.83[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif'] [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']3 Payment Protection Insurance Policy – [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Advised in your letter of 16 July 2008 that you are still investigating this policy but I have still heard nothing as of today’s date. I look forward to your findings within the next 7 Days.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']TOTAL TO DATE TO BE REFUNDED BY CHEQUE: £10,454.89[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif'] [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']Wescot Credit Services[/FONT][FONT='Arial','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']After communication with Wescot Credit Services on 11 August 2008 I have been informed that my Agreement with them in relation to my current personal loan has been withdrawn by ‘the client’ (namely NatWest) on 7 August 2008. Wescot have therefore advised me to cancel the monthly Standing Order to them with immediate effect as they are no longer managing this account.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']If you are not able to supply me with a copy of my Credit Agreement in relation to this account then you have been in breach of the Data Protection Act by supplying my details to third parties without a Credit Agreement. If this is the case then I may have to inform the OFT, Trading Standards and the FSA of this breach[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif'] [/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']As this investigation has been ongoing since February 2008 I look forward to hearing from you within 12 days with copies of all of my Credit Agreements and a cheque to the sum of £10,454.89.[/FONT]
[FONT='Arial','sans-serif']
Does it look ok - any comments welcome!
thanks

[/FONT]

Well the CCA letter has gone to Natwest as per my previous post - see what they come up with!

Now I want to ask a 'what if' situation as I have also CCA'd other creditors including Cabot, CL Finance, Wescot and Natwest Credit Cards. I understand that I give them 12 + 2 Days for initial response and then wait for the 30 days to lapse. What if they don't respond - do I send the original letter again after the initial 12 or 30 Days??

What happens if they come back and say that they don't have the original Credit Agreement? I don't want to stop paying and start up all the letters/calls again so would be looking at offering Full and final settlements. What is best to offer them in this situation - 10%??

I'm hoping they don't have the original agreements because if this is the case and 10% is acceptable then it looks like I could be debt free and will push for the defaults to be removed.

I've had my first response back from my CCA requests - this is from Cabot who manage my Citi CCard.

When I called Cabot on Monday 11 August they told me the outstanding balance was £1804 and I wanted to find out a F&F settlement figure. I offered then £700 but they basic tried to push me to £1250 which I refused.

I sent the CCA Request off and they have replied today returning my £1 as they 'do not accept the statutory fee required...'.

They replied:

'The Cabot Group is not obliged to provide this information but we are pleased to help and have already requested the documentation for you from the original lender'.

Am I right in thinking that Cabot actually needed to have the CCA in order to enforce the debt and make me pay? My payment schedule is now with Cabot not Citi.

Also they tell me in this letter that I currently owe £2554 and not the £1804 over the telephone!

Where do I stand or are they correct in applying for this from the original lender, Citi?

Thanks - any advice or letters that I can use would be most grateful

Any advice re my CCA letter from Cabot. I really want to get a response back to them today

Thanks!

Hi, still waiting for advice re my last post re Cabot CCA letter.

But an update re my Natwest Credit Card. I sent CCA request to both NatWest and Wescot (I pay Wescot as they manage the payments).

NatWest Card Services want me to confirm my new address with signature (surely it should be enough that NatWest have already corresponding since August 07 at my address)!

Wescot have sent a letter back with the £1 stating:
'our client has requested you write to the followig address and state in your covering letter that this is a section 77/78 request ....'

I understood that for Wescot to take payments that they needed to have a copy of the CCA on file. Same as Cabot on behalf of Citi..

Can anyone advise me what to do know since all my last updates?

Thanks!

I'm hoping if I post again this will bump it up the threads and someone might give me some advice before the weekend - please!!

If you read my other threads for more info but basically I'm trying to claim PPI from Natwest who have agreed for 2 out of 3 loans but won't pay interest which I'm still fighting for.

To get more fuel for my fight I sent off my CCA requests on 12 August to:

Natwest: 3 x CCA Request for Personal Loans
Natwest: 1 x CCA Request for Credit Card
Wescot: 2 x CCA Requests as they manage my outstanding Natwest Personal Loan and the Natwest Credit

Update so far:

Natwest: No response so far re any of the CCA requests for Loans but but from their PPI offer letters they do state no agreement available for the 2 previous loans which have been settled.
Natwest: Re Credit Card: Told me I need to write in with signature to confirm change of address (they already have this address from 12 months ago so I've wrote again with crossed through signature). How long do I give them to respond?
Wescot: Sent postal order back for NatWest Credit Card CCA request and tell me to write to Card Services at Southend - even though they manage the payments they obviously have no CCA on file. Where do I stand with making further payments now they have admitted to having no CCA themselves?
Wescot: No response re Personal Loan CCA but when I spoke to them 2 weeks ago they informed me that the client (Natwest) had taken the account back from them and to cancel my Standing Order to Wescot! Have nothing in writing confirming this and am unsure what to do now

As you can see I seem to be getting nowhere with these CCA requests and really don't want to stop payments and start up the hassle again.

What would you advise now that the 12+12 days have passed? Legally as Wescot were instructed to collect payment on Natwest's behalf, should they have had a copy of the CCA in order to comply with the Data Protection Act? If so, what next?

Thanks for anyone who can help me with the next stage!

Update for you re Natwest/Wescot:

NatWest: 3 x CCA Request for Personal Loans (2 settled and 1 outstanding)
NatWest: 1 x CCA Request for Credit Card
Wescot: 2 x CCA Requests as they manage my outstanding NatWest Personal Loan and the Natwest Credit

Update so far:

NatWest: No response so far re any of the CCA requests for Loans but but from their PPI offer letters they do state no agreement available for the 2 previous loans which have been settled. STILL NO RESPONSE RE CCA REQUEST - ORIGINAL REQUEST DATED 12 AUGUST and 2nd LETTER SENT INFORMING THEM THEY ARE IN DEFAULT DATED 29 AUGUST

NatWest: Re Credit Card: Told me I need to write in with signature to confirm change of address (they already have this address from 12 months ago so I've wrote again with crossed through signature). How long do I give them to respond? RESPONDED - NO PPI HAS EVER BEEN ADDED TO THIS ACCOUNT. I'm STILL WAITING FOR A LIST OF CHARGES

Wescot: Sent postal order back for NatWest Credit Card CCA request and tell me to write to Card Services at Southend - even though they manage the payments they obviously have no CCA on file. Where do I stand with making further payments now they have admitted to having no CCA themselves?

Wescot: No response re Personal Loan CCA but when I spoke to them 2 weeks ago they informed me that the client (NatWest) had taken the account back from them and to cancel my Standing Order to Wescot! Have nothing in writing confirming this and am unsure what to do now

RE: WESCOT. I WROTE AGAIN SAYING THAT AS THEY ARE COLLECTING THE MONEY THEY SHOULD ALSO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE A COPY OF THE CCA's FOR THESE ACCOUNTS AND ATTACHED THE £2 PO AGAIN. THEY SENT LETTER and £2 PO BACK DATED 4 SEPT Stating:

'As you are aware we previously instructed you to send your request for a copy of the opening agreement directly to our client with the postal order made out to them. This is their instruction and we cannot request the details on your behalf.

I'm also still waiting for Natwest to confirm that Wescot are no longer managing my Personal Loan account. How much more time do I need to give them for this info?

So where do I stand now? The original CCA requests were dated 12 August and I have had NO response from Natwest and Wescot won't provide info?

Any advice would be appreciated as I've come to a standstill and not sure what to do now

Sorry to be a pain but I wondered if an expert could give advice on my last post.

Natwest have still not responded following the CCA request dated 12 August and 29 August.

Wescot are refusing to provide CCA and have twice informed me to contact the client direct as it is basically not their responsibility!

Not sure what to do now as I don't have any info from either party in relation to CCA, Notice of Assignment etc.