Hi all,

This looked a great place to ask for some advice...so I'm keeping my fingers crossed. It's a bit of a long story but here goes.....

My daughter has only had a car for 2 years. The first year she was insuured she had an accident. When the time came for renewal this year, we opted for AA, as they were the best quote, and we filled out the on line form. She stated that she had an accident (therefore had no 'no claims). Also the address wouldnt come up correctly as the postcode and the name of the road didn't match (although the house number did) We overwrote the address and thought all was fine. Although a cover letter arrived, the insurance certificate had not after 2 weeks. So she rung them up...no probs they said 'its in the post'. It did arrive although the street name on the address was still incorrect.

Last week, she had a shunt in the car, and althought this involved 3 cars, not any damage except to the very first car. But my daughter thought she should tell AA insurance. When she rang, they said, they had cancelled the insurance in January!!!!! She asked why..they said that she had claimed 1 years no claims and hadn't provided proof. They also said they had sent letters. They also said they had refunded the credit card MINUS £100!! It was paid for by my partners credit card and when we looked back, yes there was a refund in there, but as we had a dispute with the AA at the same time, we had no way of knowing that the refund was for her insurance. We had tried ringing them, but they couldn't tell us what the refund was for!

I was with her when she filled the online form, and there is no way she would have claimed a no claims bonus and I remember over writing the incorrect address.

So we rang them, and have asked for copies of these so called letters they sent. We also went to the other house to ask if anythign had arrived from AA, they said NO.

No other insurers would then cover her because of the cancellation, we did find one in the end, but at 3 times the price. She is so worried that she could be prosecuted and get a conviction .

Where do we stand..I have tried to no avail to find a copy of the code of conduct the AA should adhere to.

Why didn't they try to ring her...or send recorded? They did say that letters had been returned to sender!!!! And she had no trouble getting car tax with the insurance certificate that she had.

We have had sleepless nights, and she is struggling to find the extra money...it all seems very unfair. Any advice would be gratefully received.

P.S Some of the drivers involved in the shunt are claiming damages.

There seems to have been a subtle change in the insurance industry over the last few years, that I must admit I don't quite follow.

If an insurer issues a certificate of insurance (A certificate is an official document affirming some fact). then they are afffirming that you have insurance. If they wish to cancel or revoke that insurance then they should be unable to do so until they have had the certificate returned.

When the policeman calls, show him the certificate, this is the evidence that your daughter was insured, and I would hope that the officer would take that at face value.

Unfortunately whenever insurers send out a certificate, they also send a statement to confirm the details recorded, this should be read and amendments made as required.

Would it be possible for your daughter to pay for the repairs to the other vehicle?

Thanks Rippedoff, She has already shown her certificate to the police, so I am hopeing they won't take it any further.

Unfortunately neither her nor I are in any position to pay for damages to the other drivers. She has put herself heavily into debt just to get re-insured.

Only one other car was damged in the shunt (scratch on the bumper) as she was only do a max of 2 mph. But I think one driver may be claiming whiplash.

I can't believe that the AA have had such a nasty attitude over the whole thing. She has Never received any communication from them apart from to receive the insurance certificate.

as the docs had arrived. albeit with wrong address, you should have contacted them to amend it to the correct address then there would be no error in the issuing of letters.

in regards to rippedoffs comments r.e ins companies should be unable to cancel without the return of the cert is totally unworkable, it is now stated in letters that if a policy is cancelled, the cert is invalid and remains the property of the insurance company and should be returned, it also quotes the RTA.

Just thought I would update this thread..police have said that my daughter will be prosecuted, probably 6 points (which will mean she will lose her licence, as only passed her test less than 2 years ago) plus a large fine. I don't know how she will pay a fine, as she only earns a pittance. The police did say that it was in her favour that she went directly to them as soon as she discovered she wasn't insured.

Vusys, I understand about the address. I should have said earlier that this crops up all the time, happened with utility companies etc. Although the house number, street name and postcode are correct, they just seem to fail to recognise the terrace she lives in, so that part doesn't come up. It must be something to do with certain computor systems. She's rang other companies to change it, but they still send to the original address, but she normally gets the mail. Its only a problem because there are 2 houses with the same number in the same road.

I can see that we have no recourse, but it still seems unjust, when you are trying your hardest to be above board. I just hope this post gets others to double check, so they don't find themselves with a criminal record, severe hardship and sleepless nights,

Many thanks

Sorry about that homegirl, however it is not a criminal offence, and she may not get six points, as there are extenuating circumstances.

Edit

I am fairly certain you don't get a criminal record anyway.

Link

Your driving licence is automatically revoked if you build up six or more penalty points within two years of passing your first driving test. This includes any penalty points you had before passing the test, which are still valid. You’ll have to reapply for your driving licence as a learner driver and resit your driving test.

just going back to the address thing?

if you called them r.e the cert and they sent it, then they should have confirmed your name address,postcode due to DPA?, what address has the insurance company got recorded for you? Ask for the telephone recording etc

if your correct address & theirs match, then this looks like a delivery issue and can be used in your defence. Under Article 75 of the RTA the insurer has to deal with the TP claims, but they can then pursue you for the outlay. If there are claims people on this forum, they might be able to advise further.

Just out of interest, don't the AA ask your for your address as a DPA check when you call in?

You would have thought that if you have called in several times and given the wrong address, then someone there would have picked up on it and amended it?! If we had a call monitored at our place and this had happened, we would get battered for it!

I think its worth pursuing this as a complaint to the AA and see what they say.

Yes, ultimately the onus is on your daughter to provide the correct information and she clearly hasn't done that as she has just put the closest thing she could find on the website, but i think that the AA should take some responsibility for this mess.

I just have to respond to some of "rippedoffagain's" comments.

Firstly, a certificate of motor insurance only proves that you have taken out insurance at the date of issue and assumes that the terms of the policy are adhered to for the full 12 month contract. Giving a certificate to a police officer knowing full well that the policy is cancelled is tantamount to fraud.

All they would do is check on the PNC and find the policy was cancelled and then the OP would be in a whole world of trouble. Advising them to do this is irresponsible.

secondly, of course driving without insurance is a criminal offence (it has to be declared to insurance company's for the next 5 years under the rehabilitation of offenders act).

It is a motoring conviction which can lead to points on you licence and also a fine, both of which the OP's daughter is liable to get, although in this case she will also lose her licence due to the revised legislation brought in a few years ago.

It is also looked upon un-favourably by the insurance industry and will almost certainly result in her paying higher premiums and XS's for the next 5 years.

DA

Hi Darkangel,

Thanks for your comments. I have confirmed with my daughter that when she rang AA they did ask her to confirm her name and address, and she told them the CORRECT address, thinking they would amend their records, but obviously they did not.

We are hoping to get a transcript of the telephone call...and will go from there.

As to the points and losing her licence, this will probably happen. As you rightly say, she was uninsured so we will wait to see what happens when she gets to court.

I appreciate all the help and advice offered.

Hi Homegirl,

If you want a transcript of the call then you have to make a request in writing to the AA's data protection officer and pay a fee of £10. This is standard practice under the DPA.

I'd be interested see what happens with this so I'll keep tabs on this thread.

Post back when you have an update and if you have any questions or need any help, feel free to ask.

DA

Hi DA

and thanks for the advice. We are currently waiting for them to send copies of the letters, and when she requested them, she told them her correct address umpteen times. So if they dont arrive or are incorrectly address, we will want a transcript of that call as well!!

Will let you know when something occurs...may be a while:(

I work for a Insurance company so subbing with interest and I will help where I can.

Thanks adzya,

It seems to be a continuing sage...and if anyone has advice on my next query I would be grateful.

The Policeman who came to see my daughter was very understanding..and he said that he would contact the other drivers and their insurance companies to advise that that due to 'a technical problem' she was uninsured and they were not to contact my daughter.

But she has received a letter from one of the insurance co's and another has left voicemail for her requesting details. She doesn't know whether she should contact them or not? Where does she stand legally.Other people may think she ought to. But she has long term health problems, and since this happened she has panic attacks, severe insommnia and hasn't eaten for days. She won't answer her phone unless she knows who's calling, Plus she won't even drive her car now!!!

I am really concerned for her health, and I must say I'm not fairing too well myself!!

Nothing requested has arrived yet from the AA...and the PC said to contact him if nothing had arrived with 10 days. Can the police request all copies of letters and phone calls?? Perhaps they would have more success.

Many thanks

hi all,

you may be interested in the update on this thread. It is still on going.

My daughter has received a police caution for driving without insurance. Although, today we were told by the claims company dealing with it, that she WAS insured on the date of the claim!!

The AA are trying to cover their tracks now as they had not cancelled the insurance at that point even though they told her on the phone that they had! They have still not provided a letter saying that the insurance has been cancelled ( only a copy dated months ago saying that if she does not get in touch that it 'would be cancelled')

They deny any of her phone calls, although we have dates times and names of people spoken too.

They have also now changed the web site and it will now give her correct address. They still say we must have imput it incorrectly, difficult to do on an automated system that only allows you to enter house number and postcode, and these were both correct!!!

She is getting bills sent to her from the other poeple involved in the accident, but I believe we can pass these on as the insurance company say they are dealing with it , as far as they are concerned she was insured.

I don't know if we can get the caution overturned?

This goes on and on, but am now contacting Watchdog, Dail mail, and continuing to try and get justice.

any comments gratefully received, cheers

if the AA are saying you were covered & are dealing with the claim then yes you should get this overturned then (who advised the Police you were not insured AA or MIB??)

Pass any TP bills to AA claims, although I would have thought that the other partys Ins companies would be liasing with AA claims & leave you out of the loop???

Vusys1 thanks for the reply...This is where we are confused.

The AA say it was cancelled and that she was unisured at the time, but the claims handling agents for Markerstudy say that she WAS covered at the date of the incident.

We have asked the AA for confirmation in writing, as to the date of cancellation , but so far nothing.

When we asked the Claims company the date it was cancelled, they told us that they didn't have the details!

Who should I approach next??

Hi DarkAngel,

Can you point me in the direction that supports the statement:

Quote by DarkAngelsdelite

secondly, of course driving without insurance is a criminal offence (it has to be declared to insurance company's for the next 5 years under the rehabilitation of offenders act).

I can find nothing under the, Rehabilitation of Offenders Act to support your statement.

There is no power of arrest for driving without insurance, unless arrested under S25 PACE.

So there is no fingerprints, no DNA and no record at the CRB.....

regards

Hi DarkAngel,

Can you point me in the direction that supports the statement:

Quote by DarkAngelsdelite

secondly, of course driving without insurance is a criminal offence (it has to be declared to insurance company's for the next 5 years under the rehabilitation of offenders act).

I can find nothing under the, Rehabilitation of Offenders Act to support your statement.

There is no power of arrest for driving without insurance, unless arrested under S25 PACE.

So there is no fingerprints, no DNA and no record at the CRB.....

regards

No probs,

I'm on my holibobs for a few weeks but i'll dig it out when i get back to work and post it for you.

Just to help you though, have a quick read of this Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974

DA

Obliged DA,

Enjoy your holidays.

regards