Thread: PCN issued, council claiming different information

Hi all,

Any advice on this situation would be appreciated if anyone has any experience of it.

I was issued a pcn by Ealing Council for overstaying a 30 minute free space. The PCN on the car states:
Time first seen: 17.48
Time PCN issued: 17.51

This is quite clearly not 30 minutes. I appealed informally and was told that the council have photographic evidence that proves the car was there at 17.14. However, they included 4 photos with this letter and not one of them is timed 17.14.

Can I appeal again on the grounds that the PCN must state the contravention (as per the road traffic act)? Are the council allowed to change information after the PCN is issued? If they have evidence that the car was there at 17.14 (which it probably was) can they use this despite not sending it previously?

Many thanks for your advice.

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The council must treat you fairly. The council do not have to, by law, respond to informal challenges but if they do they must be truthful. I would be tempted to respond as follows:

Dear Sirs,

Thank you for your letter of dd/mmmm/yyyy enclosing photographs.

You had previously advised that you have photographs timed to show my vehicle present at 17:14. The photograps are not timed at that time and are not timed to show that the vehicle was present, as alleged, for more than 30 minutes.

As you are aware, you are under an obligation to treat the motorist fairly. My understanding is that PATAS' expectation is that LAs should share with motorists sufficient information to enable the motorist to determine whether the alleged contravention took place and thus enable the owner to decide on the relative merits of paying the discounted penalty or proceeding to appeal.

I therefore, again request that to provide the photographs you claim to have that show my vehicle present at a time that supports your allegation of a contravention. If no such evidence exists, I would expect the pcn to be cancelled.

Thanks for your reply, I am outside of the 'informal' appeal window and have to appeal formally, can I claim that the contravention did not occur since, according to the ticket, it didn't or are the council within their rights to use other evidence if the ticket was wrong?

Are you saying that when the LA sent photos they did not give you an extra 14 days or that they did and they have now passed.

You could argue that they had the opportunity to produce photos to prove their case but did not. You are no entitled to rely on the expectation that they do not exist and the doctrine of estoppel to prevent them producing them later.

You can then argue that there is de facto no evidence of the contravention having occurred.

Do't know if this would be accepted. Nothing to lose in trying though.