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    • One other point to note, the more I read, the more I study, the more proficient I feel I am becoming in this area. Make no mistake DBCL if you are reading this, when I win in court, if I have the grounds to make any claims against you, such as breach of GDPR, I shall be doing so.
    • Yep, I read that and thought about trying to find out what the consideration and grace period is at Riverside but not sure I can. I know they say "You must tell us the specific consideration/grace period at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is"  but I doubt they would disclose it to the public, maybe I should have asked in my CPR 31.14 letter? Yes, I think I can get rid of 5 minutes. I am also going to include a point about BPA CoP: 13.2 The reference to a consideration period in 13.1 shall not apply where a parking event takes place. I think that is Deception .... They giveth with one hand and taketh away with the other!
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    • the Town and Country [advertisments ] Regulations 2007 are not easy to understand. Most Council planing officials don't so it's good that you found one who knows. Although he may not have been right if the rogues have not been "controlling" in the car park for that long. The time only starts when the ANPR signs go up, not how long the area has been used as a car park.   Sadly I have checked Highview out and they have been there since at least 2014 . I have looked at the BPA Code of Practice version 8 which covers 2023 and that states Re Consideration and Grace Periods 13.3 Where a parking location is one where a limited period of parking is permitted, or where drivers contract to park for a defined period and pay for that service in advance (Pay & Display), this would be considered as a parking event and a Grace Period of at least 10 minutes must be added to the end of a parking event before you issue a PCN. It then goes on to explain a bit more further down 13.5 You must tell us the specific consideration/grace period at a site if our compliance team or our agents ask what it is. 13.6 Neither a consideration period or a grace period are periods of free parking and there is no requirement for you to offer an additional allowance on top of a consideration or grace period. _________________________________________________________________________________________________________________So you have  now only overstayed 5 minutes maximum since BPA quote a minimum of 10 minutes. And it may be that the Riverside does have a longer period perhaps because of the size of the car park? So it becomes even more incumbent on you to remember where the extra 5 minutes could be.  Were you travelling as a family with children or a disabled person where getting them in and out of the car would take longer. Was there difficulty finding a space, or having to queue to get out of the car park . Or anything else that could account for another 5 minutes  without having to claim the difference between the ANPR times and the actual times.
    • Regarding a driver, that HAS paid for parking but input an incorrect Vehicle Registration Number.   This is an easy mistake to make, especially if a driver has access to more than one vehicle. First of all, upon receiving an NTK/PCN it is important to check that the Notice fully complies with PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 before deciding how to respond of course. The general advice is NOT to appeal to the Private Parking Company as, for example, you may identify yourself as driver and in certain circumstances that could harm your defence at a later stage. However, after following a recent thread on this subject, I have come to the conclusion that, in the case of inputting an incorrect Vehicle Registration Number, which is covered by “de minimis” it may actually HARM your defence at a later stage if you have not appealed to the PPC at the first appeal stage and explained that you DID pay for parking and CAN provide proof of parking, it was just that an incorrect VRN was input in error. Now, we all know that the BPA Code of Practice are guidelines from one bunch of charlatans for another bunch of charlatans to follow, but my thoughts are that there could be problems in court if a judge decides that a motorist has not followed these guidelines and has not made an appeal at the first appeal stage, therefore attempting to resolve the situation before it reaches court. From BPA Code of Practice: Section 17:  Keying Errors B) Major Keying Errors Examples of a major keying error could include: • Motorist entered their spouse’s car registration • Motorist entered something completely unrelated to their registration • Motorist made multiple keying errors (beyond one character being entered incorrectly) • Motorist has only entered a small part of their VRM, for example the first three digits In these instances we would expect that such errors are dealt with appropriately at the first appeal stage, especially if it can be proven that the motorist has paid for the parking event or that the motorist attempted to enter their VRM or were a legitimate user of the car park (eg a hospital patient or a patron of a restaurant). It is appreciated that in issuing a PCN in these instances, the operator will have incurred charges including but not limited to the DVLA fee and other processing costs therefore we believe that it is reasonable to seek to recover some of these costs by making a modest charge to the motorist of no more than £20 for a 14-day period from when the keying error was identified before reverting to the charge amount at the point of appeal. Now, we know that the "modest charge" is unenforceable in law, however, it would be up to the individual if they wanted to pay and make the problem go away or in fact if they wanted to contest the issue in court. If the motorist DOES appeal to the PPC explaining the error and the PPC rejects the appeal and the appeal fails, the motorist can use that in his favour at court.   Defence: "I entered the wrong VRN by mistake Judge, I explained this and I also submitted proof of payment for the relevant parking period in my appeal but the PPC wouldn't accept that"   If the motorist DOES NOT appeal to the PPC in the first instance the judge may well use that as a reason to dismiss the case in the claimant's favour because they may decide that they had the opportunity to resolve the matter at a much earlier stage in the proceedings. It is my humble opinion that a motorist, having paid and having proof of payment but entering the wrong VRN, should make an appeal at the first appeal stage in order to prevent problems at a later stage. In this instance, I think there is nothing to be gained by concealing the identity of the driver, especially if at a later stage, perhaps in court, it is said: “I (the driver) entered the wrong VRN.” Whether you agree or not, it is up to the individual to decide …. but worth thinking about. Any feedback, especially if you can prove to the contrary, gratefully received.
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PCN from Vehicle Control Services LTD


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Hello,

 

 

Got issued with the following ticket (below) on my motorbike yesterday evening. I parked in a side street in the centre of Nottingham and didn't realise it was a private street it was dark etc, however when I looked properly there were actually 4 signs on display.

 

I have read this forum thoroughly and have seen all the advice on how the system appears to work (the Private Parking Stickys and threads) and pro-forma letters etc. I've also noticed that the company who issued my notice (VCS Parking Enforcement Specialists) are a member of the BPA: (British Parking Association)

 

It would appear that the maximum amount allowed to charge is £75 under BPA guidelines and the company has asked for £80. So it would appear that they have breached the BPA code of conduct?

 

Other than that the option open to me seems to be that I pursue the letters option and hope that they drop the charge?

 

I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions on what would be my best course of action.

 

Kind regards

tom4rse

 

 

 

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Best course of action -ignore it. It is a private ticket proporting to look like an official police/council one - which is an under a few acts, namely the Fraud Act 2006.

 

The BPA is nothing more than a trade body, it has no legal standing. They will act like this whether they are in the BPA or not. It's like some of us setting up the "BMA" (British Murderers Association) and saying that you're only allowed to stab your victim not more than twice when killing them - it's still murder and it's illegal like the above notice.

 

See the sticky threads. If you receive a DCA letter then say the debt is in dispute. Don't worry. :)

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On a slightly pedantic note, and although the very bottom of the back of the ticket is not visible, it seems that the Vehicle Control Services Ltd may be in breach of company law - they are supposed to show their company registration number and place of registration and registered office address (which cannot be a PO Box) on their stationery.

 

Why not drop them in it with Companies House?

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Also, "Issue Date" is not good enough. To be valid the ticket has to have "Date of Issue" according to the DoT Model Ticket. There may be other infringements - I can't remember the whole model ticket. Look up a thread by "MondeoST24" - there's a lot of cracking information about PCN's in there.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Aaaaand we're off....

 

Just to keep you informed, my "Notice To Owner of Intent to Issue Court Proceedings" letter dropped on the mat this morning. (quite intimidating letter to the untrained eye!)

 

But fear not, my response will be in Monday's post.

 

Will keep you informed of their response.

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Aaaaand we're off....

 

Just to keep you informed, my "Notice To Owner of Intent to Issue Court Proceedings" letter dropped on the mat this morning. (quite intimidating letter to the untrained eye!)

 

But fear not, my response will be in Monday's post.

 

Will keep you informed of their response.

 

First the invoice designed to look like a valid PCN and now an NTO its getting a bit rich. These guys are sailing close to the wind with their documentation. I'd say they are acting they are either committing fraud or are very close to it. Are you going to report them?

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To whom and for what?

 

Office of Fair Trading

Local Trading Standards Officer

The Police

 

The offence at the moment would be under Administration of Justice Act 1970 by mimicing official documents, purporting to give them status which they simply don't have. Later, further down the line, when their threats become repetitive and oppressive there is the Prevention of Harressment Act 1997 and even the Fraud Act 2007?.

 

Sounds cynical but don't expect too much. A lot of forum members have complained about an awful lot more and got nowhere. The Police simply aren't interested, local Trading Standards have a patchy understanding of Private Tickets and OFT usually don't respond to individual complaints. If however, you enjoy letter writing and are up for it then by all means go ahead.

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  • 5 weeks later...

Hello there,

 

I have a response letter (see below) also included with the letter was a lovely photo of my motorbike next to the no-parking sign and also a copy of the parking ticket issued.

 

Was interested to read in the 5th paragraph: "A recent decision by the Court of Appeal has confirmed that provided adequate notice of unauthorized parking is given, the driver/registered keeper accepts the Terms as set out and therefore consents to the penalty charge which maybe incurred for contravening the regulations"

 

Now lets ignore the fact they have admitted this is a penalty charge (thus no contract etc) I was wondering to which decision by the Court of Appeal the nice lady who wrote me this letter was referring?

 

Anyone know?

 

Also, any comments on the letter to include in my response?

 

Cheers

Tom

 

 

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Hello there,

 

I have a response letter (see below) also included with the letter was a lovely photo of my motorbike next to the no-parking sign and also a copy of the parking ticket issued.

 

Was interested to read in the 5th paragraph: "A recent decision by the Court of Appeal has confirmed that provided adequate notice of unauthorized parking is given, the driver/registered keeper accepts the Terms as set out and therefore consents to the penalty charge which maybe incurred for contravening the regulations"

 

Now lets ignore the fact they have admitted this is a penalty charge (thus no contract etc) I was wondering to which decision by the Court of Appeal the nice lady who wrote me this letter was referring?

 

Anyone know?

 

Also, any comments on the letter to include in my response?

 

Cheers

Tom

Sounds like they are in fantasy land. As they would say in the house of commons "they are not being entirely straight forward". I'm sure we would have heard from our legal friends such as PeteJ and legaladvisor had this been the case not to mention our resident PPC apologists.

 

A recent decision that overturned the precedents of the Dunlop case which has stood for over a 100 years.

 

I think you have covered the salient points.

 

Only the driver can be held to any "contract". Regardless of any case law third parties cannot be made party to terms in contracts that they have no knowledge of and do not agree to.

 

One other comment ask them to quote relevant cases to back their claims that the BPA charges are "not unfair at law". Says who?

 

I think a Have Sex and Travel letter quoting the salient points is required.

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One other comment ask them to quote relevant cases to back their claims that the BPA charges are "not unfair at law". Says who?

Had a thought on this one last night. Could they be referring to the charges for clamping. There is some case law about reasonable charges there. But the BPA charges that is complete rubbish.

 

The BPA is a trade association with a very loose code of compliance. They don't set the rates that their members are required to charge just that they follow the code of conduct.

 

While we're on the subject of the BPA you might want to point out the BPA requires in their code of conduct requires them

 

Quoting from section 2..... (click here for the full code of conduct)

 

2. Manage their affairs professionally so that their operations are

conducted efficiently and effectively and in accordance with good

business practice including –

Trading fairly and responsibly and only employing contractors

that are competent to the task in hand.

Undertaking their activities honestly and with integrity and not

knowingly misrepresenting themselves or misleading others.

Ensuring that they operate to the highest possible standards

thereby protecting the interests of their shareholders and

customers.

• Employing staff who are competent and qualified and adopting

an approach to staff development that encourages further

training.

• Operating from established premises and ensuring that they are

adequately insured for all relevant risks.

Striving to resolve any complaints and disputes quickly and

equitably.

 

You might want to point out that their documentation is bordering on or is dishonest by mimicing official documents which is an offense under the AJA S40. etc. So are they acting honestly. Hoist on their own petard.

 

I would suggest that you complain to the BPA but as this a trade body made up of the "enemy" (i.e. PPCs) you are probably urinating in the breeze for all the good it will do.

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please does anyone know of anybody who has actually gone to court with ukpc ltd as i am currently in litigation with them and i will fight to the death!!!!!!!!!!

 

I think the lack of answers to your post is probably a good indication. Have a look at this thread here. You'll see a number of people indicate that they had loads of letters and threats of court action but the reality is zilch.

 

Stand firm.

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  • 1 month later...

Progress report so far for those considering what to do:

 

I got a Notice to Owner of Intent to Issue Court Proceedings on 3rd Jan, I wrote a letter to the company (see template letters). They ignored my letter.

 

I got a "Final Demand Notice" on 12th Feb which stated Failure to Pay Will Result in Court Action in big bold letters. I wrote a letter which was very similar to the earlier letters as they never actually answered any of my requests for information.

 

They ignored my letter and sent a I included the Cease and Desist line (see template letters).

 

I have received no further correspondence from the Parking Company to date.

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  • 3 months later...

Hello I am new to the site and have been reading Tom4rse's threads the same happened to me last night and I am furious £80 is extortion. The signs were very high up and not very clear.

 

Can you tell me please of you have heard anything more from these crooks?

 

Thanks

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Hello I am new to the site and have been reading Tom4rse's threads the same happened to me last night and I am furious £80 is extortion. The signs were very high up and not very clear.

 

Can you tell me please of you have heard anything more from these crooks?

 

Thanks

Hi,

 

Welcome to the forums.

 

I think the lack of activity on this thread indicates the level of court action i.e. none.

 

You have an invoice for an alleged breach of contract.

 

Don't pay up. It's a [problem]. Have a read of the private parking charges guide in the stickies section and you'll see why.

 

They'll follow the usual business model of these companies which is loads of threatening letters and then silence.

 

This company isn't the only one at it. One of them recently took people to court and lost (google "Excel Mansfield").

 

A word of caution VCS lurk on these forums and will attempt to identify you from anything you post. Don't put dates, times, names, locations etc in any of your posts. They won't win in court but they will try to coerce you into paying with all manner of threats.

 

Some people advise ignoring everything apart from court documents. Others advise using the template letters in the stickies section.

 

What you should definitely do is wait until they have obtained the RK details from the DVLA, which costs them £2.50.

 

The choice as to how to proceed is then yours.

 

If you have any questions post back.

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  • 5 months later...

Hi,

 

Firstly I am new to this site and must thank you all for your threads because I too got a PCN. I have appealed which was a waste of time, I went to see the police which was a waste of time because it is a private company, but then fortunately hit on this site and received more valuable information.

I intend to now take your advice and wait for the court letters!

Just so annoying when I have got 101 other better things I could be doing with my time but on principle I intend to stick it out!

Thanks again to all and I will keep you posted

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  • 1 month later...

Parking Charge Notice - Vehicle Control services LTD

 

£80 fine.

 

URGENT HELP NEEDED AS GOING ON HOLIDAY TONIGHT

 

I was parked in a private car park which was locked at 18:45. I called the car park number at 21:00 and decided not to release and go early the next day as advised. A ticket had been issued at 20:47 the previous evening. The latest you can buy a ticket until is 18:30.

 

Should I pay or not?

 

Ticket looks to be completed ok.

 

Ticket says 'issue date' and not 'date of issue'.

 

Payment address is a PO Box with city and postcode.

 

It had been snowing heavily.

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Hi,

 

I was parked on a Private Road and not in a car park, but I have followed other threads and basically ignored all letters.

 

I appealed prior to joining this consumer group which was a waste of time and since then I have had a 2 letters (notice of intent to issue court proceedings and a final demand notice). I was even advised by a solicitor to ignore all letters until I receive letters from the court.

 

I have not yet received any court letters and hope that's the last of it.

 

My advice, enjoy your holiday and forget about it!!

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I am new to this forum and I hope someone can give me some guidance on a similar issue.

 

 

My car was parked in a bay which looks like a parking bay (with double yellow lines though!) outside a NCP car park today. (these bays are are parked with cars everyday). There are notices along the access road about it being private property, etc, however they are all displayed on the other side of the road and nothing was displayed on the side of the "parking bay". I genuinely thought that those notices only apply to one side of the road where there is no parking bays as the same road also leads to a recently disused Council car park.

 

After reading all the threads, I am not sure if the driver has "willingly" entered into a contract with them as the notices are quite well displayed. If they have CCTV (at entrance of the NCP car park) that could proof whom the driver was at the time (whether it is the RK or not) , would it mean that the driver has no case for appeal?

 

 

The ticket is exactly the same type as the one issued to tom4rse in Dec 2007 and it doesn’t mention anything about penalty on the ticket. It just asked for £80 payment or additional £40 charge after 7 days, etc.

 

btw, anyone know what happed to tom4rse case?

Edited by NOGLOW
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Hi,

 

I received a PCN very similar to the one tom4rse shows at the start of this thread. I was parked behind my oen rented house in a private car park that I do have a permit for. The permit had slipped down and was partially obscured by the dark tint at the bottom of the windscreen and an old parking ticket. I have since appealed and sent VCS a copy of the permit to which they replied with a picture of the obscured permit in my windscreen. I am a student and as such was not around over christmas to check post at my term time address. By the time I had recieved this second letter the charge had gone up to £120 from the original, and still proposterous, £80. This was when I though it was time to have a look into this and started reading various threads on here, eventually deciding to ignore the letter, particularly because I have already shelled out £80 this term after falling for the threatening letters.

 

This morning I got back having been at my mum's house since Thursday to find a brightly coloured letter titled (in red font) "NOTICE TO OWNER OF INTENT TO ISSUE COURT PROCEEDINGS". It then follows with large yellow highlighted sections and more red capitals that if I do not pay them I will have to pay court fees and solicitors fees totalling another £80 and "WHICH MAY LEAD TO A WARRANT BEING ISSUED TO THE BAILIFFS".

 

Does anyone have any experience of these types of letters or any knowledge of VCS actually taking anyone to court in one of these cases?

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated,

 

Thanks.

 

P.s. £120 is not something that I can have in the next 7 days so my hand is somewhat forced into not paying!

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Hi,

 

I received a PCN very similar to the one tom4rse shows at the start of this thread. I was parked behind my oen rented house in a private car park that I do have a permit for. The permit had slipped down and was partially obscured by the dark tint at the bottom of the windscreen and an old parking ticket. I have since appealed and sent VCS a copy of the permit to which they replied with a picture of the obscured permit in my windscreen. I am a student and as such was not around over christmas to check post at my term time address. By the time I had recieved this second letter the charge had gone up to £120 from the original, and still proposterous, £80. This was when I though it was time to have a look into this and started reading various threads on here, eventually deciding to ignore the letter, particularly because I have already shelled out £80 this term after falling for the threatening letters.

 

This morning I got back having been at my mum's house since Thursday to find a brightly coloured letter titled (in red font) "NOTICE TO OWNER OF INTENT TO ISSUE COURT PROCEEDINGS". It then follows with large yellow highlighted sections and more red capitals that if I do not pay them I will have to pay court fees and solicitors fees totalling another £80 and "WHICH MAY LEAD TO A WARRANT BEING ISSUED TO THE BAILIFFS".

 

Does anyone have any experience of these types of letters or any knowledge of VCS actually taking anyone to court in one of these cases?

 

Any help would be greatly appreciated,

 

Thanks.

 

P.s. £120 is not something that I can have in the next 7 days so my hand is somewhat forced into not paying!

 

If you've read these threads then you'll know they aren't likely to take you to court. Unless the contract for the permits is very precise you have complied with it in that it was displayed albeit partially, as their photo demonstrates - you've got them QED.

 

I would suspect that the contract terms will fail under the "Unfair Terms in Consumer contracts" because the term puts you at a considerable disadvantage and the terms were not individually negotiated.

 

It could be argued that no loss has been demonstrated and therefore this amount is a penalty charge and again unenforcable.

 

Lastly this is a typical desperate "plea for some money before we give up." They are very unlikely to take this to court and even if they do you still get to defend yourself and will in all likelihood win.

 

I would continue to ignore and respond only to actual court papers -which you need to check with the HM Court Service as these companies are sometimes known to send a copy of a claim form before they actually initiate court action.

 

Have a read of the private parking charges guide in the stickies and you'll see there is a lot that they fail on. Look also at Problems PPCs face.

 

VCS, like most PPCs, are good at threats and not very good on follow through.

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