Written by John Kruse, one of the leading experts on Bailiff Law, this consumer friendly guide is essential reading for anyone who comes into contact with a bailiff.
The book is easy to understand and clearly explains the rights
a bailiff has, and also what they cannot do when collecting debts and repossessing goods etc.
PO Box 30 Chester CH4 9FD www. mbna.co.uk
Ref: BYS/CA
13 November 2007
Dear Mr xxxxxx Accounts: -
Thank you for your recent request; I can confirm the following are enclosed;
• Copies of the Original Credit Card applications
• Terms & Conditions
• Recent statements of account
If anything needs clarifying please call us on freephone 0800 389 9002 Monday to Thursday 8am-8pm and Friday 8am-6pm.
Jayne Sevan Customer Assistance Manager
MBNA Europe Bank Limited is authorised and regulated in the UK by the Financial Services Authority and subscribes to The Banking Code. Registered Office: MBNA Europe Bank Limited, Stansfield House, Chester Business Park, Chester CH4 9QQ. Registered in England Number 2783251.
If you can scan the document, and post it on here (cross out all the personal details) one of the experts here can ascerrtain if it has all the precsribed terms and is enforceable......by virtue of the fact that they have said 'Credit Card Applications' means it may be just that and not an Agreement....
8.2 What if prescribed terms are missing or incorrect?
s127(3) provides that the court may not make an enforcement order unless a document containing all the prescribed terms of the agreement was signed by the debtor – see Q1.21.
If therefore any of the prescribed terms is missing, or incorrect, the agreement is not enforceable against the debtor, and the court is precluded from making an enforcement order.
8.3 What are the prescribed terms?
The prescribed terms specified in Sch 6 are as follows:
* amount of credit – see Q8.
* credit limit – see Q8.5
* repayments – see Q8.9.
* rate of interest – see Q8.6
Sch 6 was not amended by the 2004 Regulations.
They need to keep documents such as a copy of the agreement for 6 years after the closure of the account to comply with money laundering legislation.
IS MY AGREEMENT ENFORCEABLE( Via section 127(3) CCA1974) PRESCRIBED TERMS FOR THE PURPOSES OF SECTIONS 61(1)(0) AND 127(3) OF THE
CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974 Taken from sced.6(1983/1553) regulations
(If you just want to find out, skip the bits in between the stars it’s just some extra information)
**What do we mean by unenforceable?
In the Consumer Credit Act section 127 there is a provision for making an agreement unenforceable if it does not contain certain pieces of information.
Subsections 1,2,3,4 state which pieces of information these are, and everything mentioned there must be included within the body of the agreement, if one is missing the agreement is unenforceable.
How doesunenforceable differ from enforceable with a court order only?
When an agreement is unenforceable it means that the court or the judge cannot make a ruling on it. The court cannot make it enforceable.
When an agreement is enforceable only by ruling of the court it means that the agreement can be stopped by the debtor but the court has the power to re-instate it and allow the credit to continue to enforce.**
The Pescribed Terms are these
A Amount of credit
A term stating the amount of credit
B Repayments
A term stating how the debtor is to discharge his obligations under the agreement to make the repayments, which may be expressed by reference to a combination of any of the following- (a) Number of repayments; (b) Amount of repayments; (c) Frequency and timing of repayments; (d) Dates of repayments; (e) The manner in which any of the above may be determined; or in any other way, and any power of the creditor to vary what is payable.
C Rate of interest
A term stating the rate of interest to be applied to the credit issued under the agreement D Credit limit
This may be a term or the manner in which it will be determined or that there is no credit limit.
--------------------------
Which of these applies to you depends on the type of agreement you have?
For a Running Account (credit card) agreement
BC and D Apply
For a Restricted Use Debtor Creditor Supplier
Where the dealer is the supplier and the creditor is the one providing the finance.
The money can only be used for the purpose it is given.
There is no interest on the purchase (the cash price is the same as the total price)
And there is no advance payment
A is applicable
For a fixed Sum Credit Agreement
A conventional credit agreement with none of the above restrictions
A and B apply
For a Hire Agreement
B is Applicable
This paper only covers section 127(3) of the Act agreements can also be unenforceable by contravention of sections 1 and4 this will be the subject of the next paper. Please note that these Prescribed terms where not changed in any way by the 2004/1482 Ammendments although the form in which they appear on the agreement was. Subsection127(3) was repealed on the 6th of April 2007 so that unenforceability due to 127(3) will only apply to agreemens executed before that date.
Are you scanning using the 'photo' setting or auto...it should pick up the fine print.....bear in mind whatever they send you it should be a legible copy too....
CREDIT AGREEMENT REGULATED BY THE CONSUMER CREDIT ACT 1974. teued by U8NA Europe limited, OiKler CH4 9fB Ptcxe tty\ &b form below.
MY NAME AND ADDRESS IS HERE
Credit Reference: 1XXXXXXXX Credit Limit: £XXX
IMPORTANT - DATA PROrECTlON Condition* provided. Ygu agre* Uwt *Mt {MBNA Eirupa B*nh Lmtcd] orocea. u3a.rocan)anddecJtt« Ptcpnal (ntcnnabon 04 Ov 1 1 . and ffiai mi may roka cnqwncj «j necessary. nduerg Abbey carveebon wtrt r-a or any Oner apptcatan a norcerncfi Mtf> cny r A&Sey NatnnaJ ptc n t/« MBNA Group W» nt* credo cconng pr i^x«>rwngiL»x] cy^Wmj n a=3«B ECC*cataxa W« rroy «na » tr aJ you req^drq ytXf oppkcatoa ajKUim a recue^l You *9w e ia ftsoKcjng your ou*..diiia fccourt o«at; to fraud pnncrttn v crwU nrf«renCB &gonc«a, •*« k»ep ctoutad t«archc9, find riormabon otvul ocrourcs noudi^rj Octxd cb< m on 01459 714 724 tor dcfj*l of tw «gcnccs tram *fxxn •« citun. nrel wn Nton ** record, your rfernBtm tdm have * eoe drta a S*jCh •Avrrotnn wd be tfomt mdh oBm cr&anojaara O iOoU you By VmmX f»teipi-»•gencMn may ttexty b« lr*«d « ona or mata pcopia *ilh whcrri jrou ha«* * hnancal •£3oculxm. fct trur purpcc«n q* thra nppfecsuon. yourruy &• bvjlad 03 fcr*«d la iron end yatr
You concert) o us JaAc»^ iifaytraaort about you, your B«amam» iC taia d your «ppbcMnrt. fau taxunt and you •grvemrm k> Abtxry Naborol (*SBCTtst*! ua | and Ihem) to krm • ww C" you « an nfvwhia* arc ycu pn*oroXG9 t) ixrO js ( jnc nem) dcacjn. fiokd »nc ot-r goods on] E-er*tca cSercd by ui < o"U lHe*n j mj la crat*» in fait] rwm) o aamayou by cr^t kA^un ot dtcimnc mcdu a noy bo rJ fftcid u you You r»M canxn rigTa to rccc*v«•copy of Pmuiul KBurOtcn w< hoti «CcU horn Comp4ijnct M*n«O*r, MBNA Europ* bank LbrWttd, Ch*U*r
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Consumer Credit (Cancellation Notices and Copies of Documents)
Regulations 1983 (SI 1983/1557)
2 Legibility of notices and copy documents and wording of prescribed Forms
(1) The lettering in every notice in a Form prescribed by these Regulations and in every copy of an executed
agreement, security instrument or other document referred to in the Act and delivered or sent to a debtor, hirer or surety
under any provision of the Act shall, apart from any signature, be easily legible and of a colour which is readily
distinguishable from the [background medium upon which the information is displayed].
(2) The wording of any Form prescribed by these Regulations shall be reproduced in copies of unexecuted or executed
agreements or in Notices of Cancellation Rights sent [by an appropriate method] under section 64(1)(b) or (2) of the Act
without any alteration or addition, except that--
(a) the creditor or owner may enter the name and address of the debtor or hirer in any Cancellation Form prescribed
by these Regulations; and
(b) every Form shall be completed in accordance with any footnote.
(3) Any such footnote shall not be treated as part of any Form prescribed by these Regulations and may be reproduced
in addition to any such Form.
(4) Where any such footnote requires any words to be omitted, those words shall be omitted or deleted.
Not too sure Phatram, as it is their answer to your bona fide request for your Consumer Credit Agreement and it is illegible, I really wanted to get one of the experts on here to ascertain whether it has the prescribed terms and conditions, is correctly signed etc.....It would be good to see a copy of it to hopefully give you more ammunition....
I have asked them to provide legible copies and informed them these accounts are in dispute.They are ringing me numerous times a day.
Yesterday I received a call from NEIL FORRESTER from the collections department who was one of the most obnoxious people I have ever spoken to. At one point I asked him if he knew who he was speaking to? He of course said "yes", so I asked him how he knew?, as he had not done any security checks or anything. His reply was that "who in their right mind would discuss someones account if it wasn't theirs"? I laughed and he terminated the call.
For anyone looking in from MBNA,
THESE ACCOUNTS ARE IN DISPUTE !!!!!
I would send them a letter saying that PLEASE DO NOT CALL ME IN THE FUTURE - ALL CORRESPONDENCE WILL BE MADE IN WRITING - IF ANY CALLS ARE MADE TO ME THIS WILL BE CLASSED AS HARRASSMENT AND TREATED AS SUCH....
Told Forrester that, as I have already sent that letter, he said I was fully aware of the facts that these are telephone banking accounts and they will ring me as many times as they like.
They are not bank accounts, they are credit card accounts and that was the first I had heard of them being telephone accounts.
Your agreement looks like it's been scanned and put through OCR (Optical Character Recognition) software. If this OCR stage is disabled (check your settings) you should be able to obtain just a 'straight' scan; and be able to closely reproduce the original image, including small print.
HTH
Mac
04/04/07 - £104 exit fee refund - Portman BS
Halifax Current a/c 20yr (closed) - in progress - all 20 years statements recovered!
Halifax Platinum Card 15 yr - Court Action Commenced - all 15 years statements recovered!
A&L Current a/c - You're next..
Write to your MP and COMPLAIN about the ANTI-CONSUMER way in which the OFT Test Case is being handled!
Me v MBNA ABBEY AND MBNA VIRGIN
Europe Bank Limited
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