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Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
This appears to be rather bizarre.
I sent a CCA request to Barclaycard on the 6th May 2007 but they only replied on the 27th June with an illegible copy of the application.
I replied on the 10th July and informed them of the above in the hope they would stop giving me grief.
I have received countless threats from Mercers, before, during and after these dates.
I then received a letter from Optima, 5th November, who threatened legal action to put a charge on my property.
I have now received a summons, 15th November, for this debt.
How (Why?) are they doing this when they have passed the period of having to provide it to be enforceable, have committed an offence, have not provided a legible copy and the copy is not an agreement in any case!?
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Hi Weird Al Yankovic,
This is typical behavour from Barclays, there are countless others in your situation (myself included a few months ago) who are respondents in legal action to a debt which is simply unenforcable.
Optima are expressing scare tactics, no doubt hoping to shove through court action as fast as possible and obtain judgement by default.
It would be useful if you could post up a copy of the alleged agreement they provided, if as you say it is completely illegible it contravenes the Act & Regulations and cannot be deemed an enforcable agreement. Also, did they provide any t&c's or any other documents with the response?
If you've had sight of the claimants Particulars of Claim it would be useful to post that up as well
I would also send the following letter to the claimant requesting disclosure for now:
REQUEST FOR INFORMATION UNDER THE Civil Procedure RULES.
Dear Sir/Madam,
I have received the Court claim filed by your Company. To enable me to file a defence and counter-claim, I require specific information regarding the account to be provided forthwith. Given that this matter is now the subject of legal proceedings, you are obliged to disclose under the Civil Procedure Rules, the information and documents detailed below. The information must be furnished by the **DATE**, which gives you ten days to provide what has been requested. If you fail to comply, this will be reported to the Court, a copy of this letter will be provided as evidence to the same and an Order enforcing your compliance will be sought.
1. A true copy of the executed credit agreement and any terms and conditions that applied to the account at the time of default and at the time the account was opened.
2. All records you hold on me relevant to this case, including but not limited to:
a. A transcript of all transactions, including charges, fees, interest, repayments and payments and both the original amount of the loan and any repayments made to it the account.
b. Transcriptions of all telephone conversations recorded and any notes made in relation to telephone conversations
c. Where there has been any event in my account history over this period which has required manual intervention by any person, I require disclosure of any indication or notes which have either caused or resulted in that manual intervention, or other evidence of that manual intervention in relation to my account formerly held with Barclaycard.
d. True copies of any notice of assignment and/or default notice or enforcement notice that you or the original creditor sent me, with a copy of any proof of postage that you hold.
e. Documents relating to any insurance added to the account, including the insurance contract and terms and conditions, date it was added and deleted (if applicable).
f. Details of any collection charge added to the account; specifically, the date it was levied, the amount of the charge, a detailed financial breakdown of how the charge was calculated, and what the charge covers.
g. Specific details of the fees/charges levied by any other agency in respect of this account and a detailed breakdown of said fees/charges and what each charge relates to and on what date said fees/charges were levied.
h. A genuine copy of any deed of assignment, or proof that you have a legal right to this money.
i. A genuine copy of any notice of fair use of my data as required by the Data Protection Act 1998
j. A list of third party agencies to whom you have disclosed my personal data and a summary of the nature of the information you have disclosed.
3. Any other documents you seek to rely on in court.
4. A copy of your complaints procedure, as required by the Consumer Credit Act 2006.
5. Clarification of the date you acquired the debt, what organisation you acquired it from, their registered office, their company number (if any) and what legal title they had to this debt, and what credit license number they had at the time that the debt was purchased or entered into.
I will require this information within the next ten days. I must advise you that if the information is not forthcoming, it will be reported to the Court that you are trying to frustrate proceedings and denying me the opportunity to file a defence and counter claim.
I would appreciate your due diligence in this matter.
I await your rapid response.
Yours Faithfully,
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
This is actually quite worrying as I am in a similar position, in that they sent the application form and various T&C's all on separate sheets, I too have threats from Mercers, however I did not request my CCA until July so no doubt still have all this to come. Out of interest how much do you owe them (roughly)?
Also they must be pretty confident that they have the correct documentation else surely they wouldn't push it as far as they have?
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by Duffers Mum
This is actually quite worrying as I am in a similar position, in that they sent the application form and various T&C's all on separate sheets, I too have threats from Mercers, however I did not request my CCA until July so no doubt still have all this to come. Out of interest how much do you owe them (roughly)?
Also they must be pretty confident that they have the correct documentation else surely they wouldn't push it as far as they have?
Simply not the case, in my experience there is a great deal of reliance by these companies that you simply wont know what to do or how to defend such action, which would mean that if you didnt defend they wouldn't need the credit agreement anyway as thy would simply file for judgment in default
i have seen companies go to court with absolutely nothing at all in legal terms and you would be amazed.just because they are taking legal action it should not be a for gone conclusion that they have a strong case
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Hi my hubby has recently sent for his CCA from barclaycard, and they missed the deadline, but did send us a copy, very poorly photocopied i might add, . They also sent another photocopy of another blank application form with some terms and conditions attatched. Now I'm no expert but for a start the application is not even signed by anyone appart from my hubby, and secondly the terms and conditions wont apply to his account because they obviously are not the original ones. Thirdly, credit security have been collecting this debt (from 1998) for years yet in their cover letter they say the balance on assignment to CS was £2K, but infact thats the balance NOW so I think we have a pretty good case should it go any further, although it's all gone very quiet at the moment, and we stopped paying when they failed to supply on time.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by Fallenangel
Hi my hubby has recently sent for his CCA from barclaycard, and they missed the deadline, but did send us a copy, very poorly photocopied i might add, . They also sent another photocopy of another blank application form with some terms and conditions attatched. Now I'm no expert but for a start the application is not even signed by anyone appart from my hubby, and secondly the terms and conditions wont apply to his account because they obviously are not the original ones. Thirdly, credit security have been collecting this debt (from 1998) for years yet in their cover letter they say the balance on assignment to CS was £2K, but infact thats the balance NOW so I think we have a pretty good case should it go any further, although it's all gone very quiet at the moment, and we stopped paying when they failed to supply on time.
FA x
Hiya,
Could you post up a copy of what they've sent you, being Barclays I think it's pretty safe to say it isn't compliant with the regs.
Might be worth starting your own thread on this as well.
With regard to the assignment from original creditor to CS do you know if it was an abolsute assignment or just an equitable one? By this i mean are CS simply collecting on behalf of BC or do they own the debt along with all duties, rights and responsiblities outright? If any notice of assignment incorrectly states the balance it legally renders the notice invalid.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by shane5408
... If any notice of assignment incorrectly states the balance it legally renders the notice invalid.
kind regards,
shane
Hi Shane
Does that mean that if the balance stated on the NoA includes penalty charges previously accrued on the account, then the NoA is invalid?
If so, presumably those penalty charges could have been added at any time during the previous 6 years?
If the NoA is rendered invalid, does that therefore mean that the debt has not effectively been assigned to the new creditor (DCA), and if so does that have any bearing on the obligations of the new creditor if a CCA request is made to them?
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by Weird Al Yankovic
This appears to be rather bizarre.
I sent a CCA request to Barclaycard on the 6th May 2007 but they only replied on the 27th June with an illegible copy of the application.
I replied on the 10th July and informed them of the above in the hope they would stop giving me grief.
I have received countless threats from Mercers, before, during and after these dates.
I then received a letter from Optima, 5th November, who threatened legal action to put a charge on my property.
I have now received a summons, 15th November, for this debt.
How (Why?) are they doing this when they have passed the period of having to provide it to be enforceable, have committed an offence, have not provided a legible copy and the copy is not an agreement in any case!?
It gets worse.
Having checked my paperwork Barclaycard have not even sent me a default notice!
Am I able to alert the court that this is a vexatious action as without merit?
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Yes you can inform the courts that you dont have a default notice but just becasue you dont have one it does not mean they have not sent one. All they have to do is prove to the courts that it was sent. I dont know how they are expected to do that if it was not sent recorded or special delivery but they dont have to proved you are in recipt of one.
From what i have read all they have to say is it was sent on XX/XX and the courts would consider that as enough evidence.
You could always use this paragraph but i dont know if it will help,
ln january of 2007,your honour, Royal Mail admitted to losing about half a billion items of mail for the whole of 2006 on the BBC television programme Dispatches. This post included all items of mail which include parcels sent buy standard post, parcels send buy recorded delivery and parcels sent buy special delivery. This also includes letters sent buy standard delivery, letters sent buy recorded delivery and letters sent buy specail delivery.
As i said i dont know if it will help but the judge may be nice to you and throw the case out of court based on that especially if the judge has lost mail due to royal mails incompidence.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Thanks for that but it appears they are in error.
Their PofC state a Default Notice was issued on the 25/09/07 and ' (I) have since not complied with it.'
However, I have a letter from Barclaycard the same date, 25/09/07, stating I have not complied to a Default Notice that they say was issued 'recently,' which would mean before the 25/09/07!
I have no Default Notice and this confusion seems to confirm it.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
It would appear that is hte case,
they must issue a default notice compliant to the regs which sets out what the breach is and how if poss it can be remedied, also it must state teh time frame which you must remedy such default.
this must be at least 14 days
it would appear that this is an unlawful rescission of contract as they are not allowed to cancel the agreement and demand payment nor take legal action until a default notice is issued under s87(1) CCA 1974
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Hi weird al,
since they have started legal action, i would slap all this into your defense, putting them to strict proof in your defense will make them look total pillocks in front of the judge.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Hi al,
I dont know if this is true but because they have failed to get your name rite you can have the case struck out of court and they would have to refile giving the courts the correct details.
I read this on another thread but you might want to check with Paul before you take this as the truth as l dont know if it is true.
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by tomterm8
Hi, wierd al, defend all the claim is what I would do at this stage
Thanks tomterm.
What is evident at this stage is:
1 Barclaycard have only ever sent me an application form in my request for the agreement with obviously no prescribed terms.
2 Application form was only sent some 6 weeks after original request for the agreement.
3 No Default Notice has been issued and a letter from Barclaycard themselves confirms their error without them obviously realising that fact.
4 Penalty charges are included in the amount on the POC.
5 Their collection division, Mercers, continued to harass me even though I wrote a letter to Barclaycard disputing the amount owed due to penalty charges.
6 They have even spelt my christian name wrong-leaving out the R from Christopher (Christophe) which implies I may be French!
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by The GodMother
Hi al,
I dont know if this is true but because they have failed to get your name rite you can have the case struck out of court and they would have to refile giving the courts the correct details.
I read this on another thread but you might want to check with Paul before you take this as the truth as l dont know if it is true.
Chrissi
Hi there.
Would the court consider it better I just agree for Barclaycard amending my name as I will be seen as being as compliant as possible but, obviously, disputing the action due to their other errors?
Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Hi al,
Maybe but i dont really know, I have heard of cases where only a small error, like yours, being thrown out of court due to the companys inabilitys to get things rite. I would check with PT2537 or shane5408(i think) regard this one as pt is training to be a lawyer and i think shane is to.
Regarding the penelty charges on the POC. Have you SAR'd barclay card over this as you will be able to have procedngs stayed due to the SAR request
Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
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Re: Barclaycard taking me to court even without a CCA!
Originally Posted by Duffers Mum
