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    • Hi, In my last post I mentioned I had received an email from SS who were asking me to hand over the keys to my mother’s flat so they could pass them to the Law firm who have been appointed court of protection to access, secure and insure my mother’s property.  Feeling this, all quickly getting out of my hands I emailed ss requesting proof of this. I HAVEN’T HEARD BACK FROM SS.  Yesterday, I received an email (with attached court of protection order) from the Law Firm confirming this was correct (please see below a copy of this).  After reading the court of protection order I do have some concerns about it:   (a)   I only found out yesterday, the Law firm had been appointed by the court back in January.  Up until now, I have not received any notification regarding this.  (b)   Section 2   - States I am estranged from my mother.  This is NOT CORRECT    The only reason I stepped back from my mother was to protect myself from the guy (groomer) who had befriended her & was very aggressive towards me & because of my mother’s dementia she had become aggressive also.  I constantly tried to warned SS about this guy's manipulative behaviour towards my mother and his increasing aggressiveness towards me (as mentioned in previous posts).  Each time I was ignored.  Instead, SS encouraged his involvement with my mother – including him in her care plans and mental health assessments.   I was literally pushed out because I feared him and my mother’s increasing aggression towards me. Up until I stepped back, I had always looked after my mother and since her admission to the care home, I visit regularly.   .(c)    Sections -  4, 5 and 7  I am struggling to understand these as I don’t have a legal background.  I was wondering if there is anyone who might be able to explain what they mean.  It’s been a horrendous situation where I had to walk away from my mother at her most vulnerable because of; ss (not helping), scammer and groomer. I have no legal background, nor experience in highly manipulative people or an understanding of how the SS system operates, finding myself isolated, scared and powerless to the point I haven’t collected my personal belongings and items for my mother’s room in the care home.  Sadly, the court has only had heard one version of this story SS’s, and based their decision on that. My mother’s situation and the experience I have gone through could happen to anyone who has a vulnerable parent.    If anyone any thoughts on this much appreciated.  Thank you. ______________________________________________________  (Below is the Court of Protection Order)  COURT OF PROTECTION                                                                                                                                                                                   No xxx  MENTAL CAPACITY ACT 2005 In the matter of Name xxx ORDER Made by  Depty District Judge At xxx Made on xxx Issued on 18 January 2024  WHEREAS  1.     xxx Solicitors, Address xxx  ("Applicant”) has applied for an order under the Mental Capacity Act 2005.  2.     The Court notes (my mother) is said to be estranged from all her three children and only one, (me) has been notified.  3.     (Me) was previously appointed as Atorney for Property and Affairs for (my mother).  The Exhibity NAJ at (date) refers to (me) and all replacement Attorneys are now officially standing down.  4.     Pursuant to Rule 9.10 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 and Practice Direction 9B the Applicant 2must seek to identify at least three persons who are likely to have an interest in being notified that an application has been issues.”  The children of (my mother), and any other appointed attorneys are likely to have an interest in the application, because of the nature of relationship to (my mother).  5.     The Court considers that the notification requirements are an important safeguard for the person in respect of whom an order is sought.  6.     The Court notes that it is said that the local authority no longer has access to (my mother’s) Property.  7.     Further information is required for the Court to determine the application.  IT IS ORDERED THAT  Within 28 days of the issue date this order, the Applicant shall file a form COP24 witness statement confirming that the other children of (my mother) and any replacement attorneys have been notified of the application and shall confirm their name, address, and date upon which those persons were notified.  If the Applicant wishes the Court to dispense with any further notification, they should file a COP9 and COP24 explaining, what steps (if any) have been taken to attempt notification and why notification should be dispensed with.   Pending the determination of the application to appoint a deputy for (my mother), the Applicant is authorised to take such steps as are proportionate and necessary to access, secure and insure the house and property of (my mother).   This order was made without a hearing and without notice.  Any person affected by this order may apply within 21 days of the date on which the order was served to have the order set aside or varied pursuant to Rule 13.4 of the Court of Protection Rules 2017 (“the Rules”).  Such application must be made on Form COP9 and in accordance with Part 10 Rules.              
    • Unless I've got an incorrect copy of the relevant regulation: The PCN is only deemed to have arrived two days after dispatch "unless the contrary is proved" in which case date of delivery does matter (not just date of posting) and I would like clarification of the required standard of proof. It seems perhaps this hasn't been tested. Since post is now barcoded for the Post Office's own tracking purposes perhaps there is some way I can get that evidence from the Post Office...
    • I would say You should accept it - I HIGHLY doubt you will  be able to claim for letters at trial ans they’re offering you that, which is higher monetary value than interest.   Also they raise a good point, getting interest at anything above 4% is lucky these days, yes judges give it, but rarily above 4%   Also you might find depending on the judge  you don’t get some costs if you take it all the way over £7.40 when court woukdnt award letters costs and thus meaning their award would be less than evris offer which was made    Up to you though but the wait will be 3-4mo for a trial date at least
    • Hi Folks, Been 162 days! Just by way of update. Today I received a text from Opos Ltd so no doubt Capquest are renting the debt out to anybody who fancies a nibble. Safe to say I will not be responding.
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      The judge's reasoning is very useful and will certainly be helpful in any other cases relating to third-party rights where the customer has contracted with the courier company by using a broker.
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Moorcroft Debt recovery


loubyb
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I had a letter from Moorcroft Debt Recovery in Stockport in August this year. I rang them and agreed that I would pay them a small amount every Friday. I also told them that as I was going away for 2 weeks my mum would be ringing on my behalf and making the payment. The man that I spoke to said that would be fine. My mum rang as agreed on the 31st August to make the first payment and she was told that there was no record of me phonong and agreeing that my mum would phone on my behalf. They told her that she would have to pay the full amount of £206 there and then. My mum paid this on her credit card for me and we thought that would be the last of it. I then recieved a letter on 3rd Oct saying that i owed £215 and that my debt was in the process of being passed to the courts. I rang them again and was told that if I didn't pay the full £215 there and then I would be taken to court. I explained that I simply didn't have that amount of money at the time at which point the lady on the phone became quite aggresive and I ended up in tears. After the phone call I remebered that my mum had paid it and got her to check her bank statements and ring them back. She did this and told them that the payment had been taken from her account on 3rd Sept. They had no record of the payment ever being made. My mum has now had to send them a copy of her bank statement in order to prove to them that she had paid it and to add insult to injury they told my mum that she would have to pay and extra £9! Mymum refused and we are currently going to CAB and getting advice on how to deal with these aggresive people! All this stress that they have caused me is making me really ill and all for £215!!!! How can companies like this be allowed to get away with such aggresive behaviour!!!!! :evil: :evil: :evil:

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As it's paid up, I would try and put this one behind you now. In future however, never have any dealings with any debt people on the 'phone because they will come out with all kinds of bowlarks in order to get money from you. As for the £9 charge.... forget about it. If they contact you in writing, then come back on here. If they try and 'phone you, just hang up.

  • Haha 1
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Oh loubyb, if only you'd found this site earlier. Don't beat yourself up, you did nothing wrong. Companies like Moorcroft prey on fear and ignorance of the law, and believe they have carte blanche to threaten and intimidate people into payment.

 

Please tell as many people as possible about this site, and don't let Moorcroft upset you.

 

As PO says, do NOT speak to them on the phone, no matter what. If they get back in touch, politely but firmly tell them to put all correspondence in writiting, then post here for more advice.

 

:)

  • Barclays: WON!!! It took four months but was totally worth it!
  • Cabot: I'm still waiting for an enforcable agreement, more than a year after requesting it. Go on, Uncle Ken, take me to court if you dare. You know you want to!
  • Elephant.co.uk: VICTORY - they admitted there was no debt!
  • Ashbourne Management (gym membership): Finally got my default removed and out-of-court settlement; I'm not finished with them yet!

<--- If I've been helpful please remember the scales ;)

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No !! Don't ring them !!

 

You have to understand how these guys operate to know where all these exclamation marks are coming from. DO NOT EVER RING A DCA !! They will lie, intimidate, threaten and bully you into making payments. You will never get the closure that you're after.... all you need to do is keep all proof that payments were made somewhere safe and ignore all attempts to contact you by 'phone.

 

If they WRITE to you, then come back on here for ways of dealing with it.

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I'd echo that. Phone them ONLY if you're recording the call AND totally confident dealing with them.

 

I'm not accusing Moorcroft of this (of course), but DCAs have in the past been known to lie on the phone. Or they'll tell you that everything is fine, then write demanding more money.

 

Give me a minute or two and I'll suggest what to write. :)

  • Barclays: WON!!! It took four months but was totally worth it!
  • Cabot: I'm still waiting for an enforcable agreement, more than a year after requesting it. Go on, Uncle Ken, take me to court if you dare. You know you want to!
  • Elephant.co.uk: VICTORY - they admitted there was no debt!
  • Ashbourne Management (gym membership): Finally got my default removed and out-of-court settlement; I'm not finished with them yet!

<--- If I've been helpful please remember the scales ;)

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I'd put something like this:

 

Dear Moorcroft,

I do not acknowledge any debt to your company.

You have recently been sent a bank statement which clearly shows that £215 has been paid in respect of this alleged debt. I appreciate there may be some confusion as this payment was made by a relative, however I expect that you will now consider this matter closed.

Please be aware that any further demands for payment will be treated as harrassment under the Administration of Justice Act.

Yours,

I wouldn't bother with anything else, to be honest. As others have said, if they still write back or demand payment, let us know. :)

  • Barclays: WON!!! It took four months but was totally worth it!
  • Cabot: I'm still waiting for an enforcable agreement, more than a year after requesting it. Go on, Uncle Ken, take me to court if you dare. You know you want to!
  • Elephant.co.uk: VICTORY - they admitted there was no debt!
  • Ashbourne Management (gym membership): Finally got my default removed and out-of-court settlement; I'm not finished with them yet!

<--- If I've been helpful please remember the scales ;)

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loubyb,

 

Do not let these vultures get you down. They are the lowest of the low!

 

Remember you are not a criminal!

 

I would also echo what others have posted on here. DO NOT SPEAK TO THEM ON THE PHONE!

 

Good luck

you are among friends here.

The only man who sticks closer to you in adversity than a friend is a creditor.

 

Debt Collection Charges

 

There is no legal basis for a creditor or a debt collection agency acting on its behalf to claim collection costs from a debtor unless there is an express provision in the original agreement.

 

Without such provision, collection charges cannot be demanded as a debt due under the agreement.

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I'd report their behaviour to your local Trading Standards (TS). The Tactics used are completely deplorable and are arguably not in the spirit of the OFTs guidelines on Debt Management.

 

You could S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) Moorcroft & request all data on all systems this should include recordings/transcripts of all telephone calls. If they supply these then you could use this as evidence should you wish to push it with TS.

 

Other than that write don't call & put it down to experience.

I'm not an expert so check everything I tell you, however click me scales if I've been useful.

Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.

 

There is no freemasonry like the freemasonry of Golf

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I'd report their behaviour to your local Trading Standards (TS). The Tactics used are completely deplorable and are arguably not in the spirit of the OFTs guidelines on Debt Management.

 

You could S.A.R - (Subject Access Request) Moorcroft & request all data on all systems this should include recordings/transcripts of all telephone calls. If they supply these then you could use this as evidence should you wish to push it with TS.

 

Other than that write don't call & put it down to experience.

I agree 100%. Report them to TS. In fact when you write DJ Daves letter to them DEMAND a copy of their complaints procedure. They are legally required to have one. If they do not supply you with the details of the procedure or fail to deal with your complaint then I would suggest you report them to the FOS and it will cost them another £185 on top of the money they conned (allegedly) from your Mum. Theres more than one way to skin a rat:eek:

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  • 2 years later...

I have been trying to deal with this issue for over a week now, and have had no help to sort out the outcome.

 

Basically I have a default on my credit report from O2. Fair enough I had an pay monthly phone and didnt pay the debt, so I hold my hands up and am willing to pay the debt back to O2 exclusively.

 

I have also seen I have a CCJ issued by Northampton CCBC by MOORCROFT DEBT RECOVERY on behalf of O2.

 

 

I am more than happy to pay the debt back to O2 directly but only on the following conditions:

 

1. O2 REMOVE DEFAULT FROM CREDIT REPORTS

2. O2 SATISFACTORY REMARK ON CREDIT REPORTS

3. ACCEPT MY OFFER OF MONTHLY,REDUCED NO INTEREST PAYMENTS

4. TO GET IN TOUCH WITH MOORCROFT DEBT RECOVERY AND NORTHAMPTON CCBC TO GET THE CCJ REMOVED.

 

 

Do you think I am likely to get this sorted?

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  • 4 months later...

I have just received a pre court division letter from moorcroft. This is their third letter to me but they have twice ignored my requests for agreements to be sent to me. They even said that they had contacted their client and told me to write to their client to get these agreements. Ha Ha. Up til now they have had money off me until I found out what rights I had. Payments have stopped reason for court letter. Sending nasty letter back telling them I will take my chance in court if they want to go down that route.

Edited by lightningd
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Also, DO NOT send any of these leeches any info like bank statements, I and E forms and the like. They are not entitled to any of that information. Only a court can legally ask for that info.

jed

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I have only sent them letters. Last one Ive told them to take me to court if they so wish. Made a few payments to them but stopped them until or if they send me documents I have asked for. In the beginning I agreed over phone to pay a certain amount after basically been threatened by them. Now Im a lot wiser. They tried to tell me because of missed payments Im in default but Ive put them straight as to who is in default. Watch this space Jed.

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Message for Loubyb - I tried to phone the DCA but after a couple of calls realised that it wouldn't get me any where. Thankfully I found this site. In my 'naive' days I offered to send a cheque to my creditor but was told it wouldn't get cashed in time because of the postal strike which had already ended lol. They will come up with all kinds of excuses so DO NOT SPEAK TO THEM. I used to leave them hanging on the phone and went back to watching Coronation Street. I used to be stressed like you but not any more. Keep coming to this site.

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As Lick the Wall has posted in another thread Moorcroft Pre Court Division is more akin to Moorcroft Pre School Nursery.#

 

I can vouch for the fact that a curt letter containing our solicitors details plus all of the relevant regulation infringments, much on the lines of the CAG "doorstep letter" sent them running for cover after only two phone calls.

 

They do not understand the law and do not expect you to either which is a very dangerous assumption on their part. If you stick your ground and DO NOT TALK TO THEM they will run. Either to court which can be dealt with here or return the account to the OC toute suite. Their ONLY weapon is to threaten you.

 

Regards

oilyrag.:)

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As Lick the Wall has posted in another thread Moorcroft Pre Court Division is more akin to Moorcroft Pre School Nursery.#

 

I can vouch for the fact that a curt letter containing our solicitors details plus all of the relevant regulation infringments, much on the lines of the CAG "doorstep letter" sent them running for cover after only two phone calls.

 

They do not understand the law and do not expect you to either which is a very dangerous assumption on their part. If you stick your ground and DO NOT TALK TO THEM they will run. Either to court which can be dealt with here or return the account to the OC toute suite. Their ONLY weapon is to threaten you.

 

Regards

oilyrag.:)

Hello Oilyrag. Thanks for your reply. Just received another letter from moorcroft downgraded from pre court division to doorstep rep. Just typed out reply to them enclosing a copy of my last letter telling them that i will take my chance in court. Also re-iterated that they have ignored my letters of requests for documents & threatened them with court action for harrasment & demanding money with menaces. Told them i will no longer tolerate their attitude.

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Good for you, stay in control.

jed

Hello jed told you to watch this space. Got letter which is now stating agent will call round rather than pre court division. They are running scared now. Threatened to sue them for harrassment & demanding money with menaces. Sent them copy of my last letter as they chose to ignore it first time round. Once again watch this space.

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Hi Lighning,

 

Well we're back and running with:

 

"Notice of Intended Litigation" all outlined in a big red box. The joke is that it is full of ifs, maybes, will tell tales to BC and their sols. AND it only gives three days to pay or else on an already terminated account. Sols advice--- just ignore and send us a copy but watch out for any claims forms.

 

regards

oilyrag.:)

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Hi Lighning,

 

Well we're back and running with:

 

"Notice of Intended Litigation" all outlined in a big red box. The joke is that it is full of ifs, maybes, will tell tales to BC and their sols. AND it only gives three days to pay or else on an already terminated account. Sols advice--- just ignore and send us a copy but watch out for any claims forms.

 

regards

oilyrag.:)

They are running scared and are quickly becoming a joke. Sticking together we will beat these jokers/chancers. As i stated earlier i have now threatened them with legal action and i await their reply. They must put up or shut up as far as im concerned.

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Hi Oilyrag. Told you to watch this space regarding moorcroft. Just had letter from their compliance dept saying they want a speedy solution. I pointed out just how flawed their letter was & that they have not once complied with my requests & they want me to send a letter to their client asking for the relevant documentation. I told them the responsibility lies with them. They also said that they have sent me a statement of accounts which is totally false. They assure me that they are acting as agents for a client but still offer no proof. Theyve come down from pre court division to doorstep caller to compliance dept. I think im winning Catch you later.

Edited by lightningd
correcting spelling
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