Patricia Pearl - Small Claims Procedure - A Practical Guide


An excellent guide for the layperson in how to use the County Court - a must if you are intending to start a claim.

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  1. #1
    Basic Account Holder Diceboy Novitiate

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    Default Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    hi,
    currently living in another country (within the EU) and might be staying here for a while. My banks do have my address here however the debt agency that was harassing me back in the uk dont. Now the question that im sure many have thought about.

    Can i leave the debts behind and do a sort of a runner on them? (changing my address here soon again).


    what can happen? have herad about alot of ppl that have done similar things and got away with it.

    thanks
    diceboy

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  2. #2
    Basic Account Holder Oh Boy! Novitiate

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Yes indeed interesting.

    What tends to happen is that the DCAicon will be given your address in Timbuktoo, however the DCA is in it to make money so they may just send a cursory letter or two, till you move. Whilst your away, the letters will escalate and it may go to court some 2 years time and the bailiff will turn up and someone at your uk address will say oh that bloke left moons ago. the bailiff will return the warrant as debtor left address, and will return the warrant back to the bank, the bank will then sit on the debt for a while even though they know you are abroad.

    Now then depending on how much you owe they may decide to take the matter up in the country that you live in, that is to say, they may ask the court of the country you live in, to serve on you via the Foreign Process Section of the Royal Courts of Justice a summons to appear at court etc,

    However that is highly unlikely, its a bit like a UFO picking me up to go to an Elvis Concert. Why ? because its too much hasle to high a cost, and the chances are you may refuse to accept UK summons issued in a Eu country.

    So the answer it may seem is simple:-

    You go to timbuktoo.

    Bank can't find you.

    2 years down the line issue warrant to bailiff at address you no longer live at.

    No further action.

    Until of course you call your bank and say "Honey I'm Home!"


  3. #3
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    You can run, but you can't hide. Sooner or later it will catch up with you and who knows what the charges might be then.

    The CAGicon does not condone debt avoidance.

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  4. #4
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Just to expand on what Rooster has said, there is now reciprocal debt collectionicon arrangements in a lot of the EU, where he debt can be passed to local enforcement agencies, and sanctions can be placsed on your assets, I believe this goes further to Canada, Aus, US and NZ.

    So it is very true that you can run but can't hide.


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  5. #5
    Basic Account Holder Diceboy Novitiate

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    thanks guys for the advice,
    the question was a theorethical one, morally i understand that it is wrong and if have spent the money im willing to payit (but not when it comes to charges piled on charges)


  6. #6
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Just to add what my site colleagues have said. It may seem appealing to move abroad to escape UK debts, the person in debt can run but they can't always hide. Creditors have been known to stop chasing those they can't find, however moving abroad doesn't always mean they can't find the debtor. Creditors use the following tactics to trace debtors, talking to neighbours at their debtor's last known address and tracing their activity through using cash. In some cases creditors have relations with other credit companies in that country, making it easier for them to find you. Once the creditor knows which country you are in, they can trace you relatively quickly and start pursuing you for the debt. So it may seem a good idea to move abroad and leave your debts behind, but the creditors can and probably will find you and demand the debt is repaid.
    You should ideally establish a repayment agreement with the creditors before leaving the UK. There are many options to clear your debt, even if you no longer live in the UK, for example bankruptcy, IVAs or DMPs. Payplan can offer advice on all UK debts even if you no longer live in the country, however if you are abroad you should make it a priority to make a payment agreement with your creditors. If you fail to make a payment agreement your new life in a new county could be affected as your credit rating may result in you being unable to get jobs or a simple bank account.
    Good luck, but think wisely.


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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Also what happens when and if you return to the UK?

    Running from things is the easy option, but like the others have said they do catch up with you and by then it far worse than the original problem,

    Good luck though with you move

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  8. #8
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    They're not all that great.

    My brother moved just over one hundred miles away from his home ten years ago to try out a new area.

    He went with a mate, ended up getting married to a local lass, kids, bought a house etc, but he didn't move to avoid debt.

    Yet all debt he did have previously was written off as no creditor even bothered to contact him.

    Not a jot on his credit record where he owed about 8k including council tax.

    Why go abroad?


  9. #9
    Basic Account Holder wanderingsoul Novitiate

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    An interesting question here. Don't know if it helps, but I have moved TO the UK from far far away, and relatively small debts back home have now been erased from what I can tell.
    Still, the Estate Agent I went through to rent a flat tried to charge me for searching my history, though he also told me this search is only done within the UK, not in my home country. Of course, I refused to pay it.

    Though, in reply to Weird Al's comment 'Why move abroad?' - I mean no offence, as England has in my opinion some of the most beautiful country in the world - but I must say............'Why not?'
    I have read that it is approx 20% more expensive to live in the UK than the US (not where I am from). It is very very expensive here, and I can see that it is very easy to get into debt. The government and almost every business I have dealt with in the UK have attempted to charge me ridiculous fees, taxes, TV licence etc...I like it here, but it is so corrupt and ridiculous that websites like this one must be started. Rather than get into trouble with debts in the UK, I can't see the problem in moving to a much sunnier, more friendly, and FAR cheaper country.

    Having said that, home is always home, no matter what.
    ...and debt is always debt.......
    ...and Karma is always Karma!

    Please don't mistake this for a complaint about the UK - that is not my intention. The UK is wonderful - just too expensive compared to other countries. I think the evidence speaks for itself, though I welcome any comments - especially regarding the UK being approx 20% more expensive than the USA.


  10. #10
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    I am not sure of the % difference, but I have met people who say they can earn the same outside UK, buy much bigger houses for the same money and their day to dasy expenses are less.


  11. #11
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Why do you think this is called rip-off Britain?

    Vandermerwe


  12. #12
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    I lived in Munich, Germany after moving there from London where I was working at the time. My work contract specified that should I leave my job within 2 yrs I would have to pay back my relocation costs pro rata.

    Cutting a long story short I had a very well paid job and quite a bit of credit, I broke my back whilst skiing on a weekend trip to Austria and ended up breaking up with my wife and resigning from my job. I returned to the UK to try and patch up my marriageicon and failed.

    I had been unable to work for some time at this point and moved around a lot, starting to work at a reasonable level soon after.

    Debts had mounted to around 70,000 and I basically buried my head in the sandicon and tried to pay back what I could when I could.

    My accountant pestered me to go bankrupt which I put off for 5 years, I eventually did go bankrupt and since I had no assets, house/mortgageicon etc. and comparatively low earnings I walked away from the debt's legally.

    I wished I had taken his advice 5 years earlier and done it then, it really was the best thing I could have done. I would have struggled to pay that amount back for many more years to come. Instead it was all over in 3 short years.

    I believe it's only 1 year or as low as 6 months in some cases nowadays until a bankruptcy is spent.

    My credit rating returned very quickly and getting a mortgageicon or credit card has been no problem since.

    I left many debts behind when I moved to Germany but did come back and face the music eventually. The problems became much smaller when I did finally sort through it all and complete a bankruptcy. I did find in many cases that banks had written off debts as well as HP firms etc and they responded saying I owed nothing.

    Daft thing was I finally went through with the bankruptcy over a 500 fee my solicitors tried to charge me for a service I didn't ask for. They hassled me constantly and I had to go for verbal something or other at court over it. Amongst the many other things they did.

    I regretted many of the debts that where left unpaid but screwing the solicitors made the bad taste at least a little minty


  13. #13
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Quote Originally Posted by gizmo111 View Post
    Just to expand on what Rooster has said, there is now reciprocal debt collectionicon arrangements in a lot of the EU, where he debt can be passed to local enforcement agencies, and sanctions can be placsed on your assets, I believe this goes further to Canada, Aus, US and NZ.
    North Korea might be worth a try.


  14. #14
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Quote Originally Posted by Annoying Twit View Post
    North Korea might be worth a try.
    North Korea is a dump! zero prospects & no quality of life.

    Dubai, I fly plenty of expats to/from DXB who take on 3 & 6 year contracts and return to Britain with a tax fee lump sum and UK debts expired under the limitation acticon 1980.

    You can leave your debts behind but its irresponsible. Why dont you tip them into a bankruptcy before you go? At least you have cleaned up after yourself.


  15. #15
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Quote Originally Posted by 10110001 View Post

    You can leave your debts behind but its irresponsible. Why dont you tip them into a bankruptcy before you go? At least you have cleaned up after yourself.
    AIUI, a bankrupt cannot hold a passport.


  16. #16
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    A bankrupt can hold a passport and have freeedom of mobility, even pilots can be bankrupt and continue to work. There is nothing in our contract of employment requiring disclosure of bankruptcy.

    I come across revenue passangers, many of them travel in First class! who are bankrupt and able to board the aircraft. They only lose the right to be a company director, but they can still travel on business as an employee.


  17. #17
    Basic Account Holder darling1 Novitiate darling1 Novitiate darling1's Avatar

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    We have paid off all our debts (mostly due to recovered bank charges!!) but we still have a very bad credit rating - thank you Tesco Finance, as they say every little helps -
    A member of my family recently went bankrupt - loosing my Mothers house into the bargain and then his wife went bankrupt a couple of years later. They have now got a mortgageicon - have loads of holidaysicon and seem generally quite well off....
    We on the other hand still have 2 1/2 years to go before we can cancel the bad credit, even though we paid the debt off on the day we realised that Tesco were going to "recover" the money.
    We have really suffered trying to cope and It really makes my quite cross that the more you try in this country the more you are ripped off. Ex doesnt pay child maintenance (for his 3 kids) at the correct amount.....and I c ouldn't afford to sue him AGAIN -as I wasnt entitled to legal aid! - I ended up paying up the court costs from the last case - even though the cost were given to him..but attached by the land registry to my house!- but he has lots of holidays and a new family -
    We are really getting fed up of Rip Off Britain, and are now considering leaving to sunnier climes
    My new husband and I work hard and try to cope - but we really are the suckers in all this. We should just have sold our house, spent the money and then gone bankrupt, we should have abandon the kids to yheir father and his family and done a runner to spain - ! But unfortunately we choose to keep trying! More fool us!
    Rant Over!!!

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Feel much better with that off my chest! I am usually such a positive person!

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    Halifax Bank...December 2006 ..... WON! 1 week after N1 filed.
    Lloyds TSB....... April 2007 Lloyds TSB.....WON, 1 day before prelim. court date, still went before judge.
    Nationwide.........April 2007 Nationwide.......WON, 3 weeks after N1 filed.
    Nat West....June 2007 (on behalf of friend) Settled after LBA and before filing.
    HSBC - full settlement ...on behalf of my son...
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  19. #19
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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    Quote Originally Posted by darling1 View Post
    I ended up paying up the court costs from the last case - even though the cost were given to him..but attached by the land registry to my house
    Land Registry wouldn't file a legal charge on your property unless asked them to, or a court orders a charging order.

    On what basis did the court decide you should be liable for a costs order made against your ex?


  20. #20
    Basic Account Holder darling1 Novitiate darling1 Novitiate darling1's Avatar

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    Default Re: Living abroad, can I leave uk debts behind?

    I dont know the answer to that...
    But I know that at the time I thought that it was very unfair - my solicitor told me that it was because the legal aid people would want to be paid come what may, and that as I had assets (the equity in the house) worth more than 30k, as my "winnings".

    The costs were first awarded 50/50 then he argued with the judge who then said to him that he was right and it wasn't fair, and they then awarded the cost 75% against him and 25% agaisnt me. this was then attached to the land registry/ when I remarried and we moved 2 years later the money was automatically taken from the proceeds of the sale. 7K
    I have constantly wondered if there is a way to get this money back - it was 11 years ago - but he lied in court about having a new woman in his life - and moved in with her straight after court....they bought a house together when they got married a couple of years after that.
    Any help is greatly appreciated - from anyone....?

    If I have been of any help to you please be kind enough to click on my scales! Thank you

    Halifax Bank...December 2006 ..... WON! 1 week after N1 filed.
    Lloyds TSB....... April 2007 Lloyds TSB.....WON, 1 day before prelim. court date, still went before judge.
    Nationwide.........April 2007 Nationwide.......WON, 3 weeks after N1 filed.
    Nat West....June 2007 (on behalf of friend) Settled after LBA and before filing.
    HSBC - full settlement ...on behalf of my son...
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