Overpayment of HB - I'm the Landlord

[homer192]

Wonder if anyone can help with helping me understand rules and regs on this - I am the landlord:

1. Tenant claims HB and the monies were paid directly to me.
2. Last summer I got a letter stating that tenant had claimed £4800.00 too much and that the Council were going to reclaim this money from me.
3. Tenant went to council and said that the £4800.00 was in fact his debt and the Council agreed to reclaim the money from him in installments by deducting it from future HB payments.
4. Tenant has now started working so is not claiming HB and the Council have therefore 'lost' their abilty to receive the installments regularly.
5. Outcome is that I have just received a letter from the Council stating that they want £3600 back from me.

By the way, I had no idea that the tenant was overclaiming - as I do not live anywhere near to the property..........even though he is my nephew!

Obviously I do not want to have to repay this but wanted to seek some advice here before I contact the council and the tenant/nephew on Monday.

Much appreciated.

[Boobaby]

Originally Posted by homer192

Wonder if anyone can help with helping me understand rules and regs on this - I am the landlord:

1. Tenant claims HB and the monies were paid directly to me.
2. Last summer I got a letter stating that tenant had claimed £4800.00 too much and that the Council were going to reclaim this money from me.
3. Tenant went to council and said that the £4800.00 was in fact his debt and the Council agreed to reclaim the money from him in installments by deducting it from future HB payments.
4. Tenant has now started working so is not claiming HB and the Council have therefore 'lost' their abilty to receive the installments regularly.
5. Outcome is that I have just received a letter from the Council stating that they want £3600 back from me.

By the way, I had no idea that the tenant was overclaiming - as I do not live anywhere near to the property..........even though he is my nephew!

Obviously I do not want to have to repay this but wanted to seek some advice here before I contact the council and the tenant/nephew on Monday.

Much appreciated.

To be honest I cannot understand how the Council can now chase you for the outstanding debt when it was agreed that the debt belonged to the tennant.
What they would normally do in situations like this, as they never 'lose their ability' to receive payments is to make an application for an 'Attachment of Earnings' from your tenants' Employers, if of course they have tried to enter into a payment schedule from the tennant and that has failed.
I suggest you speak with the Council tomorrow and ask why they now think they can chase you for this outstanding debt and how come the HB was overpaid in the first place?

Hope this helps
Boo

[homer192]

Thanks. In my panic and anger I did not even think of that. Overpayment was made because tenant started working and was claiming HB at the same time so its definitely his doing rather than an Official Error.

Many thanks

[Bookworm]

Unfortunately, the law allows (extremely unfairly) for HB to be recovered from you rather than your tenant if HB was paid directly to you. Basically, it is easier to chase you than a tenant who might disappear and be untraceable, whereas you're a sitting duck.

In other words, you're b*****d. You will have to repay HB and chase tenant yourself for repayment of those through the courts if he refuses to repay you.

[Esio Trot]

Originally Posted by Bookworm

Unfortunately, the law allows (extremely unfairly) for HB to be recovered from you rather than your tenant if HB was paid directly to you. Basically, it is easier to chase you than a tenant who might disappear and be untraceable, whereas you're a sitting duck.

In other words, you're b*****d. You will have to repay HB and chase tenant yourself for repayment of those through the courts if he refuses to repay you.

I respectfully suggest that Bookworm is painting a bleaker picture than that which is current procedure.

There is now official guidance that limits the time, amount and circumstances where claims can be made against landlords. However, council employees will always have a natural tendency to to claim off the easiest target - invariably the landlord.

Homer, I recommend that you spend some time on Landlordzone. The site has articles and a forum where this subject has been well commented on. By following the advice, I have no doubt that you will not be required to repay anything.

[Esio Trot]

Homer, Just re-read your original message.

You had better not mention that the tenant is your nephew. Depending on your relationship (maybe this was the reason for the overpayment!) you may be defined as "family" and so your nephew would not be entitled to benefit.

I got away with it (after appeal) as all my properties are in a Ltd Co - a separate legal entity and no relation to my half-brother (who was in a bad relationship - his lass having serial partners, and often upstairs when the children came home from school "boozing and screwing" as one of his daughters said on the phone when he spoke) who I rehoused with his 4 kids (1 x 8, 1 x 11 and 2 x 13 yr teenagers))

Anyway, I have found the changed guidance. Its on the DWP website under "professional advisers" section at the following link

You said Summer in your post. This should take it to after April, when the new regulations came in. Look at para 34 onwards.

[Esio Trot]

Posting again as I've really got into this.

I was certain I found chapter and verse some time ago. I was right. It is buried in the DWP website, and not at all easy to find. However, here it is the full OVERPAYMENT MANUAL

Happy reading

[Boobaby]

Originally Posted by Esio Trot

Posting again as I've really got into this.

I was certain I found chapter and verse some time ago. I was right. It is buried in the DWP website, and not at all easy to find. However, here it is the full OVERPAYMENT MANUAL

Happy reading

Excellent piece of investigative work agent Esio Trot!! I knew I'd seen something myself but couldn't remember where (not this site)....

Thanks for that - I am sure Homer 192 will be very grateful it now forearms him prior to him speaking with the LA.

Boo x

[Bookworm]

Be as less bleak as you like, Esio, I'm always delighted to be proved wrong when it benefits the innocent party, and even more so as I used to be in the same boat!!! . My knowledge stems from answers given to me a few months ago on this forum, so I have absolutely no problems with a better answer!

(I may well need to read up on this myself, as it would appear that if that is the case, my LA is way behind -not that it comes as a great surprise- since they recently sent paperwork that confirmed what I said earlier... )

[homer192]

Brilliant advice all round. Much appreciated.

Going to visit nephew and Council tomorrow now and having read the overpayment manual I feel much better informed (thanks again Esio)

H

[bazak1]

sorry, not hijacking, but this is just a stab in the dark.
if you and your nephew get on and he is willing to pay the debt, but you are still found liable ( even after all the advice on here ), then get him to pay you, and then you pay it to the LA as if it was your debt.

[edin53]

Originally Posted by Boobaby

To be honest I cannot understand how the Council can now chase you for the outstanding debt when it was agreed that the debt belonged to the tennant.
What they would normally do in situations like this, as they never 'lose their ability' to receive payments is to make an application for an 'Attachment of Earnings' from your tenants' Employers, if of course they have tried to enter into a payment schedule from the tennant and that has failed.
I suggest you speak with the Council tomorrow and ask why they now think they can chase you for this outstanding debt and how come the HB was overpaid in the first place?

Hope this helps
Boo

I have just waited for HB from a tenant and they took 4 months to sort it out and when they finally did it is much less than the tenant was previously getting and I am now having to evict her at this time of the year too. They have sent me a letter telling me that \i am responsible to any over payment due also and no apology after taking so long to sort out after several complaints. They wan t it all their own way B ------ everyone else.

Edin53

[furndire]

How on earth are we supposed to know if the tenant is working and claiming illegally.
I had this a year or two back, and actually informed the council that the tenant was working, took them 6 weeks to "find out", and then they tried to get the rent from me.
What is so totally wrong with the system is that the tenants have no idea how much rent they can claim until it is assessed, and by the time its is, they are weeks/months down the line.
For example, round here a single parent with one child can only claim £65 per week rent in a terrace, whereas a single parent with 2 or more kids can claim more for the same property.