dwp and jsa want bank statements and want to know how i got my savings

[irishbhoy67]

I had no clue that when i claimed jsa that my claim would be affected if i had between 6k and 16k in savings so didnt think to tell them what i had. Recently the customer compliance unit got in touch and demanded up to date totals in my account and jsa subsequently docked my benefit by £13 per week. Now they want to know how i amassed the 9k in my bank. before i claimed jsa i did not work but did gamble in poker clubs etc with good wins and i banked the money. Its legally and rightfully mine and i no longer gamble which is the reason im on jsa to try and gain long term employment but will anything come of my decision to tell them that i got it from gambling before i even claimed any money from them? Any info would be greatly appreciated.

 

Joe

[honeybee13]

Hello and welcome to CAG.

 

Are you on income-based JSA or not please?

 

My best, HB

[irishbhoy67]

Hi Honeybee and thank you. Im guessing im on income based as the amount i get has dropped from £71 odds to £58 odds because of savings i have.

[tomtom256]

Look up capital threshold. Any savings should have been declared on your claim, they have obviously found out about it and want to know where it came from.

 

As you have won it ambling prior to your claim tell them this and give them proof and/or just provide the bank statements.

[tokenfield]

I can sort of understand the not knowing to disclose capital in excess of £6000 but where are the DWP coming from in wanting to know where it came from during a period prior to claiming a means tested benefit? It may well have come about through illegal activities as well as legal ones. What would happen if you said that it was your share of the proceeds of drug dealing for example?

 

Personally I think that it has nothing to do where it came from - just that it is there and should have been disclosed from the start.

 

Am I missing something?

[irishbhoy67]

I can sort of understand the not knowing to disclose capital in excess of £6000 but where are the DWP coming from in wanting to know where it came from during a period prior to claiming a means tested benefit? It may well have come about through illegal activities as well as legal ones. What would happen if you said that it was your share of the proceeds of drug dealing for example?

 

Personally I think that it has nothing to do where it came from - just that it is there and should have been disclosed from the start.

 

Am I missing something?

 

Your 100% correct! they found out about it last year and deducted money but now they have come back with a letter saying they want statements from when i first made my claim which was 2yrs previous to them finding out. I think they should have asked me then what i had in the accounts from the start and i cant prove that i won it gambling, i used to visit poker schools, pubs, private sessions etc and had the money saved at home and then decided to bank it just before i quit gambling for good as gambling whilst on jsa is illegal as no one is gonna give you money to look for work when they know your gonna gamble it. Its my money fair and square but i dont see their angle here.

[tomtom256]

They would have asked about your accounts and what was held in them, its a standard question on the customer statement.

 

They want to know where it has come from as for all they know you may have been working whilst claiming and until you explain how.where it has come from they may sanction your benefit..

 

Unfortunately when you ask for assistance from the state, this is what you have to do.

[estellyn]

they are probably looking to see if you've deprived yourself of capital - so to see how high your capital went in the couple of years prior to your claim. And they want to know where it came from for the same reason.

[irishbhoy67]

i'll give totals for the accounts in the month before i claimed just so as they know i havent deprived myself of the capital but im not giving details of transactions going in and out cos as far as im concerned they only need to know the totals. Catch 22 situation, if i spend the capital its deprivation of capital and if i dont spend it they'll wonder how i can afford to live on benefit and not spend savings

[tokenfield]

They would have asked about your accounts and what was held in them, its a standard question on the customer statement.

 

They want to know where it has come from as for all they know you may have been working whilst claiming and until you explain how.where it has come from they may sanction your benefit..

 

Unfortunately when you ask for assistance from the state, this is what you have to do.

 

Of course it is a standard question when you make the claim - but is it standard to ask where the money came from in the years leading up to making that claim? I don't think so.

 

I have always had about £10k in my bank accounts for years, but in 2009 I inherited £38,000. I spent £20k on a car, £10k on my home and £8k on a once in a lifetime cruise.

I didn't claim any benefits - but if 12 months later I had done, I don't see that it has anything to do with the LA or DWP what I spent the windfall on.

 

Are people supposed to watch their spending just on the off chance that years later they may claim a benefit?

 

I do expect the state to verify my capital and wealth when I make a claim, I don't accept that what I do in the preceding years has anything to do with them.

[tokenfield]

The OP should ask the DWP as to what regulation empowers them to investigate what he was doing in the years leading up to making a claim.

[tomtom256]

off topic

Edited July 16, 2013 by tomtom256

[estellyn]

At the time of inheritance were you working or not?

[san_d]

I had no clue that when i claimed jsa that my claim would be affected if i had between 6k and 16k in savings so didnt think to tell them what i had.

Joe

When filling the online form you must have been asked thw amount and nature of your savings. Sorry, but in this case the DWP has all the right to investigate and if necessary sanction.

[Helen2264]

When filling the online form you must have been asked thw amount and nature of your savings. Sorry, but in this case the DWP has all the right to investigate and if necessary sanction.

 

I agree, you are asking for money from the state but you don't expect them to ask you anything about savings etc, if you don't want the aggro just live on what you have for now and then applying for JS in meantime perhaps start looking for a job as you don't sound like a vulnerable sick person!

 

I am surprised you didn't have a clue the DWP's form do state clearly about the amount of savings you have could affect your claim!

[irishbhoy67]

At the time of inheritance were you working or not?

At the time of making the money i was not working at all, was paying full rent for my property and not claiming a thing

[irishbhoy67]

I agree, you are asking for money from the state but you don't expect them to ask you anything about savings etc, if you don't want the aggro just live on what you have for now and then applying for JS in meantime perhaps start looking for a job as you don't sound like a vulnerable sick person!

 

I am surprised you didn't have a clue the DWP's form do state clearly about the amount of savings you have could affect your claim!

 

I told them i had over 3k but was told by somene that i didnt have to declare the isa as it was tax free and thats what i did, i really had no clue otherwise

[Helen2264]

I told them i had over 3k but was told by somene that i didnt have to declare the isa as it was tax free and thats what i did, i really had no clue otherwise

 

I believe you can have up to 16k savings in your bank before it affect your claim, I am afraid nowadays DWP ask for bank statement and the housing benefit too, I was asked by both to supply a bank statement, I don't normally have two pennies to rub together after I spent my benefit money so it was easy for me to just give them the bank statement without worrying!

 

DWP digs into people lives and I pray it doesn't get worse, god only know what they might do next, we just have to go with the flow and hope for the best. I am on benefit for ill health myself! The more you have the more they dig, the less you have they'll leave you alone! I wish you luck and don't worry , you'll get good advices from here!

[Nystagmite]

You can have up to £6k before your claim is affected. For each £250 (or part of) above £6k, £1 is deducted per week from your benefits. If you have £16k or more, you can't receive income based benefits.

[bio]

I believe you can have up to 16k savings in your bank before it affect your claim, {SNIP} you'll get good advices from here!

 

Rather than get advice from 'someone' - like the ISA comment, and inaccurate advice like that above, you are best to ask for advice from DWP or your LA.

[Nystagmite]

Regarding the ISA - all bank accounts have to be declared.

[tokenfield]

At the time of inheritance were you working or not?

 

Semi retired actually. I used to earn £150 a week part time (8 hours). I presume that what you are driving at is that the DWP & LA should be able to examine what happened to the capital that the OP had in the month or so leading up to the making of the claim, but why do they want to know where it came from? It has nothing to do with them.

 

Besides which what someone spent their capital on shortly before making a claim can only cause a problem if the claimant spent that money with the intention of getting the level down.

 

In my example, and if I claimed say JSA (IB) on my return from the holiday, as long as I stated that I spent the windfall not even thinking that I may have to claim a benefit in the future, I cannot be held to have deprived myself.

 

In the OP's case they want to know where the capital came from and presumably question him on how he managed to live on no known income. It has nothing to do with them. He could well have been a prolific shoplifter for all it matters.

 

On a personal note, I have a bank deposit account with Barclays that is in a semi - alias name - only because I don't want to have to explain where the money came from. It was opened in 1990 and between then and 1995 there were 7 deposits and no withdrawals. Since 1995 the account has been left dormant.

Edited July 17, 2013 by tokenfield

[estellyn]

Basically, the way deprivation of capital works, is that it is expected that someone not working, who receives a large lump sum, would be expected to make provision for themselves long term, otherwise the accusation of deliberately depriving themselves of capital in order to be able to claim benefits, can be levelled at them. Yes, intent is part of the requirement but is hard to prove intent or indeed lack of intent, but the fact that the OP has not declared capital and gained increased benefits from this, makes intent more believeable by the DWP.

 

They can ask for what they like if it may affect benefit entitlement. Regarding where the capital came from, some capital is disregarded,so it is important to know this. Such a large payout, increasing capital to 48K would be relevant to a benefit claim for a few years following the payout.

 

You must understand that people can't be allowed to spend large lump sums willy nilly, knowing that they have no current way of supporting themselves other than the capital, and then with all their newly purchased items around them, be able to claim state benefits.

 

I would be curious to know if 'I was supporting myself by gambling' is accepted as valid.

[irishbhoy67]

Basically, the way deprivation of capital works, is that it is expected that someone not working, who receives a large lump sum, would be expected to make provision for themselves long term, otherwise the accusation of deliberately depriving themselves of capital in order to be able to claim benefits, can be levelled at them. Yes, intent is part of the requirement but is hard to prove intent or indeed lack of intent, but the fact that the OP has not declared capital and gained increased benefits from this, makes intent more believeable by the DWP.

 

They can ask for what they like if it may affect benefit entitlement. Regarding where the capital came from, some capital is disregarded,so it is important to know this. Such a large payout, increasing capital to 48K would be relevant to a benefit claim for a few years following the payout.

 

You must understand that people can't be allowed to spend large lump sums willy nilly, knowing that they have no current way of supporting themselves other than the capital, and then with all their newly purchased items around them, be able to claim state benefits.

 

I would be curious to know if 'I was supporting myself by gambling' is accepted as valid.

well its the truth, couldve hid the money and signed on but i didnt and im not gonna say i got the money from somewhere else bcos i didnt. All i can be now is truthful and if they dont believe that or make it really difficult for me then i'll sign off and live off what i have, keep all the statements to show what ive spent it on i.e. living expenses and then sign on again if need be

[tokenfield]

then i'll sign off and live off what i have, keep all the statements to show what ive spent it on i.e. living expenses and then sign on again if need be

 

That's exactly what they would want you to!