Ukcps Ltd

[shelleym26]

Hi,
I was wondering if you could advise me. I was given a ticket for parking in a permit only parking area in Leeds. I was told to leave my car in a space the person i was working for could see and she would pay any fines / clamping charges that i may get / if i got any.
I did this having not noticed there were signs there stating permit only parking as the signs were at bumper level and a vehicle was in the space next to me therefore blocking the sign.

When i returned to my car at 12.30am i had a ticket on it stating that i had been parked without a valid permit or authority! I must pay £75 within 10 days or £3 per day will be added thereafter. It also states that if no payment is recieved then ownership will be obtained from the DVLA and further failure to pay will result in court action being taken and court costs and baliffs costs will be added to the final sum owed.

I am a student nurse struggling to complete my final year at uni and am already over £1000. in debt - I simply do not have the money to pay for this as I am struggling to support myself through university and the odd job I do pays for my food and petrol for the car!

Can anyone offer me some helpful advice as I am petrified over what could happen. The employer has since gone back on their word and is not giving me the money to pay it.
Thanks

[pin1onu]

Originally Posted by shelleym26

Hi,
I was wondering if you could advise me. I obtained a ticket last night for parking in a permit only parking area at a residential place in Leeds. I was there to work and when I arrived rang my employer to state that there was no parking and was told there was a pay and display car park further down the road - which isn't very well lit and is past where some building work is being carried out. I said I wasn't happy parking and walking back to my car in the early hours of the morning so was told to leave my car in a space she could see and she would pay any fines / clamping charges that i may get / if i got any.
I did this having not noticed there were signs there stating permit only parking as the signs were at bumper level and a vehicle was in the space next to me therefore blocking the sign.

When i returned to my car at 12.30am i had a ticket on it stating that i had been parked without a valid permit or authority! I must pay £75 within 10 days or £3 per day will be added thereafter. It also states that if no payment is recieved then ownership will be obtained from the DVLA and further failure to pay will result in court action being taken and court costs and baliffs costs will be added to the final sum owed.

I am a student nurse struggling to complete my final year at uni and am already over £1000. in debt - I simply do not have the money to pay for this as I am struggling to support myself through university and the odd job I do pays for my food and petrol for the car!

Can anyone offer me some helpful advice as I am petrified over what could happen. The employer has since gone back on their word and is not giving me the money to pay it.
Thanks

Hi Shelleym,

Welcome to the forums.

First up - Don't panic.

The "ticket" you have received is nothing more than invoice for an alleged breach of contract. As you did not see the signs you cannot have entered into a contract.

Have a read of this guide and the template letters which you will find in the stickies section of this forum. They will explain the legal validity of this invoice and give you some suggestions on how to deal with it.

The threats they have made are standard ones and this mob, as with most private parking companies, are notoriously court shy.

They will obtain the RK details from the DVLA. If they are true to form then eventually they will call a debt collection agency. They have no more authority to enforce the debt than you or I.

This is a civil case and the onus of proof lies with UKCPS not you. Legally you do not have to provide any information to them whatsoever. You have the right to remain silent and not incriminate yourself.

Use the template letters and if you are unsure about anything post back here. There are plenty of people willing to help.

BTW I think it is pretty low of your employer to promise one thing and then renege on the promise.

[shelleym26]

Thanks Pin1onu,
Feel much better now - my father has told me to ignore it aswell so I think that it is what I will do.

Other factors to include is that it was dark when i parked there and notices on the side of the building were by the stairs - which i noticed today when i went in daylight to look - and i went up the ramp where there were no notices.

I also share with a police officer so may see what he has to say on the matter....

"BTW I think it is pretty low of your employer to promise one thing and then renege on the promise"

- thanks so do I especially as they haven't actually told me this but have contacted the company I was contracted through and told them!!!

[MikeBigg]

Originally Posted by shelleym26

I also share with a police officer so may see what he has to say on the matter....

It is generally believed here that these private parking companies regularly break the law - using documents purporting to be official documents in order to obtain money, not having proper company details on letters - to name just two.

When the police are informed of this they are usually dis-interested, or claim it to be a civil matter.

If you could post the ticket here (blurring personal details first), some of the more knowledgeable ones could have a look and see whether laws have been broken.

It would be interesting to know if your policeman friend would follow this up.

Mike

[shelleym26]

Originally Posted by MikeBigg

It is generally believed here that these private parking companies regularly break the law - using documents purporting to be official documents in order to obtain money, not having proper company details on letters - to name just two.

When the police are informed of this they are usually dis-interested, or claim it to be a civil matter.

If you could post the ticket here (blurring personal details first), some of the more knowledgeable ones could have a look and see whether laws have been broken.

It would be interesting to know if your policeman friend would follow this up.

Mike

If someone could tell me how to post the ticket I would be extremely grateful and I will.
Thanks

[Michael Browne]

Scan it into your computer and open it in Paint or similar program. Edit out the personal information and save it

Open an a/c on Photobucket, (here: Image hosting, free photo sharing & video sharing at Photobucket ), download them there from your computer and then post the link from Photobucket in your thread here.

See how to in post #15 here:
"How do I...?" A Dummies' Guide to this Forum

[shelleym26]

If you'd like to see the ticket please message me and I will forward you the link.

The ticket was in a plastic documents enclosed sticker......
Thanks

[robin9342]

Unbelievable. I'm not even going to begin to write down whats wrong with it, I would be here all night. Suffice it to say, your ticket is just like the one I keep in my fridge - full of holes:

[shelleym26]

An elaboration would be helpful....... it might help me with my case....

[robin9342]

OK, lets start with "The owner of the vehicle". UKCPS know that under contract law (which applies here), it is the driver, not the owner who allegedly broke the "parking contract".

"..must pay a charge of £75". The charge itself is far greater than any loss incurred by the landowner and therefore amounts to a penalty: again, unenforceable under contract law.

"Note £3 per day will be added after 10 days...." They cant do that either:

The contractual remedy for late payment is interest. The courts routinely allow about 8% / year. On a typical UKCPS ticket of £60 this would amount to £4.80. In UKCPSs world they consider that 365 x £3 = £1,095 is more like it, 228 times what a court would allow

(thanks, Barnsleyboy)

And " Unauthorised removal or interference is an offence" Really? Under which law? Someone mentioned on another thread, tongue-in-cheek, removing the ticket could be "theft" or ripping it up "criminal damage". Throwing it on the floor might earn you a litter fine.

"vehicle ownership will be obtained from the DVLA, a letter requesting payment will be issued to the registered keeper..." The registered keeper is not necessarily the owner (or the driver).

There are plenty of other holes too, but hope the above helps...

[Barnsley Boy]

shelleym26

wholeheartedly agree with others on this. The parking charge is pure BS. Please don't worry about this - get on with your life.

I've noted Robin's observations [thanks for the mention in dispatches]. The ticket really is virtually identical to UK PAO's offerings, so much so that it seems beyond coincidence. I wonder if my mate Steve Hall [Hi Steve ] is lurking in the background.

The normal advice on this forum is to use BtBs excellent template letters. However, given what I know about how UK PAO operate and the fact that the "liquidated damages" of £3 / day are so completely indefencible, I'd say the best tactic with this lot is to blank completely. Just ignore the many reminders you will receive.

It will take some nerve, those £3 / day additions will mount up. In my case they were demanding over £300 before Steve stopped writing to me. I've heard of them demanding over £600. Despite what you may think, this is a GOOD THING. It demonstates the charges as being a penalty and therefore unenforceable.

Stand firm and DON'T PAY!

[shelleym26]

Cheers for that - I've passed it all over to my father to deal with as I have enough on with writing a 10,000 word dicertation and finals lol. I will keep you posted on the progress!

[robin9342]

Originally Posted by peternet

Shelley - Please get in touch with UKCPS to sort this - our parking charge notices are correctly issued. leaving it will not make it go away. We act sympathetically in many cases but you need to be aware that people actually pay for parking rights at this location. As far as the comments from other users about the legality of the parking Charge Notice please be assured the wording and terms are approved and have been tested in court. It is not wise to listen to 'barrack room lawyers' - their advice is often wrong and proven to be.

Shelley, please ignore the UKCPS troll. He wouldn't dare take you to court with all the backing you have from members of CAG.

[robin9342]

Originally Posted by peternet

BTW UKCPS Ltd is not associated in any way with UKPAO - a cursory examination of Company House details will reassure all of this

That may be, but your tactics and charges are virtually identical. Which still doesn't change the fact that the ticket remains unenforceable.

[shelleym26]

Right I am confused - can someone please tell me what would happen if i ignored them, went to court and lost. Would i have any kind of record / be on my financial record too?

I have been advised by my flatmate who is a police officer to write to the company stating that I wish to contest it and the reasons behind it.

All your input is gratefully recieved....
Cheers

[RichardM]

Shelley

To answer your question. Nothing at all would happen.

Firstly, they have to have the guts to take you to court. If it got to that stage, there are an awful lot of people on this forum who would be itching to help form a defence.

In case you haven't seen it, this is what happened to one firm who tried their hand at taken someone to court very recently.
Judge says Excel parking fines illegal - Mansfield Chad

Secondly, in the unlikely event that you were to lose, they can ONLY register a CCJ or do anything with your financial record if you fail to pay the settlement. Even then, they have to go back to court.

Ignore all the BS about affects on your financial record, defaults, CCJ's and everything else that the, and their tame debt collectors come up with, because it is exactly that, BS intended to scare you into paying something which they are not entitled to receive.

Send them the template letters, read the stickies, and relax. They can't touch you.

[shelleym26]

Thanks you