parking ticket in work carpark!

[unbeliever]

my car was ticketed the other day -I wasn't the driver (but I know who was). It was parked in a bay at work that is not assigned to my company and the fine is £60 rising to £100 if I don't pay in 14 days. There is good signage but they say if you don't have a valid ticket or permit then you may be clamped fined or towed away. There are no tickets for the carpark and you don't get a permit for the car, the spaces are assigned to companies sharing the office. The fine was given by a private company acting for the building management company. I am of course inclined not to pay - the person was in the wrong to park in the wrong bay I suppose but the bays are not marked for each company- simply marked with a reserved sign.

If I don't pay the fine in 14 days I assume they will get my details as registered owner from dvla and issue me a charge for £100. My plan is to write to them saying I was not driving and please don't contact me again- is this all I need to do?

Also, I've read some of the posts about cases that have been lost by the defendant - with transcripts. Whilst I understand the arguement that the only ones that get to court are the ones with weak defences, could somebody reassure me that they have refused to pay a ticket and the company has dropped it? If so, how did you first reply to the charge?

Thanks for your time

[Sidewinder]

Originally Posted by unbeliever

I've read some of the posts about cases that have been lost by the defendant - with transcripts. Whilst I understand the arguement that the only ones that get to court are the ones with weak defences, could somebody reassure me that they have refused to pay a ticket and the company has dropped it? If so, how did you first reply to the charge?

You have obviously done quite a lot of reading already so know the score. Yes it is possible for a PPC to take civil action to enforce payment of their invoice (most do not), but fundamentally they will have to do so against the driver of the vehicle, for only they can be party to any alleged contract. Since you were not the driver (and are under no legal obligation to disclose who this might have been), your defence will be that you were not the driver, therefore did not make any agreement to parking conditions, therefore they must take this up with whoever that might have been.

I suggest doing nothing until they write to you (and it will cost them to obtain your details) then write:-

Dear Sir,

I note that you have written to me as the Registered Keeper of vehicle xxxxxxx. Please note that on the day and time which you state I was most certainly not the driver and can therefore not under any circumstances have entered into any agreement to pay you the amount which you are claiming. The only person who can have made such an agreement is the driver at the time, and I suggest that you contact them directly in relation to this matter.

Please do not contact me further with regard to this matter.

Yours faithfully,


They will not let this drop and you will receive umpteen threatomatic letters from the PPC then debt collectors, stating that you will be hung, drawn and quartered and your children will be sold into slavery if you don't pay up, and you will have to deal with these all in the same way, confirming that you have no knowledge of any contract. I would suggest that after the 'denial of liability' letter, and the 'please cease and desist' letter, the third should be 'sue me or go away but be prepared for a robust defence and a counter claim for costs' then refuse to respond to anything further unless a Court summons - it will almost certainly not come.

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by unbeliever

There is good signage but they say if you don't have a valid ticket or permit then you may be clamped fined or towed away.

and

There are no tickets for the carpark and you don't get a permit for the car, the spaces are assigned to companies sharing the office.

So they don't abide by the contract they are trying to enforce with thier signage. Since there are no tickets or permits, they cannot enforce for non-usage. The contract term is unfair, as it is impossible to comply with.

Oh, and if the signage uses the word 'fined'...

[unbeliever]

thanks- these views reflect my thoughts. One more thing though- can you point me to a thread with people who have successfully got out of paying their tickets?

[GuidoT]

This is a bit tricky because PPCs very rarely pursue these cases through the courts because they know they are very unlikely to win and or the financial risk to their business is just too great.

In my experience you will find if you do not pay, they just keep threatening and then eventually they fizzle away.

I have a long ongoing battle with OPC here now for about 50 tickets where they keep threatening to commence proceedings but they have not done so yet.

[Barnsley Boy]

My direct experience is limited, 2 tickets with different companies [UK PAO & Europarks] but it is backed up by extensive viewing on this and other forums.

It is usually a war of attrition, you receive up to 10 letters [alternating between PPC & Debt Collector] some of which you answer, some of which you don't. Then it goes quiet - that is it. In less than 1% of cases the PPC might fly a kite and issue a summons but this is truly rare.

[unbeliever]

thanks for your help- let battle (or scuffle!) commence

[unbeliever]

I have now received a letter about this - from another company that do debt collection. So, the contract for parking is with the building owners who have a parking company acting as their agent who have not written to me but their debt collection company have. Should I now send a letter to the parking company stating I was not the driver and another to the debt collectors saying I am in dispute and don't write to me again, or should I just write to the debt collectors saying I was not the driver and dispute it.- Question is, who should I actually dispute this with? Great site by the way!

[unbeliever]

heres my proposal
1st a letter to the parking company:

I have just received a letter from xxx Ltd stating that they have been asked to act on your behalf. It seems that you or they have got my details from the DVLA and I confirm I am the keeper of the vehicle in question. You need to take this matter up with the driver concerned.

Regarding the letter from xxx Ltd, given that this debt is in dispute I have simply advised them that the debt is in dispute and that they will have to refer back to you.

In the meantime I absolutely deny your claim that the amount claimed, or any amount at all, is due to you from me.

Yours faithfully

and at the same time send this to the debt collectors:

This alleged debt is in dispute. I have written to your principal denying their claim that any amount is due from me to them.

In the circumstances please refer this matter back to your client.

Any further correspondence from you in relation to this matter may result in a complaint to the authorities under the Protection From Harassment Act 1997.

Yours faithfully


Any thoughts/suggestions?

[pin1onu]

Originally Posted by unbeliever

Any thoughts/suggestions?

I'd say you'd covered all the salient points. It might be worth mentioning OFT guidelines in your letter to the debt collectors. Something along the lines

In the circumstances, and in line with the OFT guidelines, please refer this matter back to your client.