Camden won't budge, what now?

[ossian]

On March 28th 2007 Equita Bailiffs clamped my car and forced me to pay the £575.88 release fee. This was due to a warrant they had been granted for an unpaid PCN issued by Camden Council.

The reason it had got to this stage was that all the PCN’s and the Notice to Owner had been sent to an address where I was no longer resident.

On 27th September 2007 I have successfully filed an Out of time statutory declaration. This stated that the order for recovery of the unpaid charge be revoked, and the charge certificate and the notice to owner/enforcement notice be cancelled.

QUESTION:

Does this means I’m entitled to a full refund of the £575.88, or at least part of it? I've written to Equita and they've said it nothing to do with them, they did what the warrant told them to do. Camden have said they are under no legal obligation to reimburse me, is that correct?

If the courts have excepted that I didn't receive the original tickets, then surely I should get something back?

Thanks for your help.

[Bernie_the_Bolt]

Not my field (no direct experience) but my belief is that if after a stat dec the council fail to serve an NTO within 3 months (but may be 6?) they can no longer enforce the PCN and therefore the charges have to be returned.

[jampot]

If the stat dec is accepted, and the NTO and Charge Certificate have been revoked, then as you quite rightly suggest, you are back at the 'just received a PCN' stage.

It is my belief that you are due this money back from Camden, although you may need to go through the courts for it. Even if you are now served a correct PCN and NTO, providing you pay it within the allowed timescales, effectively there will never have been a legal reason for your car to have been clamped, since the CC has been quashed and that stage hasn't been returned to. So with no legal justification for the charge, they are not entitled to keep your money.

[ossian]

Thanks for the replies. Camden said to me in their letter:

"....This instructs us (my stat dec) to revoke the order for recovery of unpaid penalty charge and reverse the case accordingly in the event that the penalty charge is unpaid."

They go on to say that Equita confirmed that I had paid them. Which I think is why they feel they are not legally obligated to reimburse me. Of course I paid Equita! they wouldn't unclamp my car!

Can't be true, surely?!

[Bernie_the_Bolt]

Talk to Camden again because different rules apply after clamping.

[tomtubby]

This is a really difficult one and it shouldnt be, but let me first say that it is a shame that the majority of people have no idea at all that they can file an Out of Time. Just today we have had 5 vehicles released from the pound....one of which was removed in MAY last year !!

If for instance, the vehicle had been clamped this morning ( and we had 4 of these) and an Out of Time was filed AND served at TEC today, then ALL companies that we deal with will release the vehicle ASAP.

However, if the vehicle had actually been taken to the pound then nearly always the bailiff company will insist that the vehicle remains in the pound until the Out of Time application has been "determined" by TEC. Typically this can range from a minimum of 19 working days to as much as 35 days.

If the Out of Time is accepted, then in all cases that we deal with, the vehicle will be released and no fee is payable.

If you have previously paid the bailiff company within the past six years and file an Out of Time which is accepted, then from our companies experience, the bailiff company will reluctantly pay all of the charges that they appplied....and the local authority will repay the cost of the PCN.

This is because, once you have paid the bailiff...they in turn pay the local authority the cost of the PCN and retain the rest to cover their fees and charges.

Sadly, the bailiff company will not want to refund you as they would have already paid commission to their bailiff who may well have left the company ( in particular when claming for a very old PCN)

If the bailiff company refuse a refund, then a very simple letter before action together with the threat of a small claim summons nearly always ensures a payment.

If you encounter problems then contact the local authority who instruct their agents (bailiff companies) to enforce these debts.

PS: THE ABOVE ONLY RELATES TO PCN's.

[patdavies]

Originally Posted by ossian

The reason it had got to this stage was that all the PCN’s and the Notice to Owner had been sent to an address where I was no longer resident.

Whilst it may seem unfair, whether or not you arre resident there is irrelevant. The Council send documents to the address on the V5 - that is the address that they obtain fron the DVLA

If that address is no longer your address, you are required by law, to inform the DVLA and change the address on the V5.

[ossian]

Thanks for the replies. The V5 stuff is true however that's between me and the DVLA, which has been resolved. Despite the fact i should have updated my address, I was still personally never received a PCN hence i should be given the opportunity to pay the ticket at it original fee.

I'm going to be a bit more threatening (legally) in my next letter to the Bailiffs. Cheers