No credit agreement

blackrain · 2nd July 2006, 09:29

I took out an MS card more than six years ago and paid it off around 2000 and closed the account.

About a year later being a little hard up at Christmas (and being dumb) I phoned them up and asked if my account was closed. To which they replied yes. I asked if I could re-open it to which they replied yes.

Now if I have cancelled a credit card I have surely cancelled the credit agreement so how does it work then when I restart it a year later by phone? Does the original agreement stand or is there in fact no credit agreement for this account?

maverik1979 · 2nd July 2006, 09:52

if the original account was truly closed then your credit agreement ceased to exist with them, to be able to repoen your account so easily is worrying to be honest

poochball · 3rd July 2006, 00:22

I think it would be a good idea to request your credit agreement to see what they produce.

blackrain · 3rd July 2006, 16:58

Yeah, I think I will see what they can come up with. Sending off the Data Protection Act request this week to them , will I need to request the Credit Agreement under that or in a separate letter?

poochball · 3rd July 2006, 20:43

Personally, I would make a separate request for this information. Below is the letter I have used in the past:

Dear Sirs

Re:− Account/Reference Number 0121254

With reference to the above agreement, I would be grateful if you would send me a copy of the credit agreements relating to this account. I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (Sections 77−79), I am entitled to receive a copy of my credit agreements on request.

I enclose a payment of £1.00 which represents the fee payable under the Consumer Credit Act.

I understand a copy of my credit agreements should be supplied within 12 working days. I understand that under the Consumer Credit Act creditors are unable to enforce an agreement if they fail to comply with a request for a copy of the agreements under these sections of the Act.

I look forward to hearing from you soon.

Yours faithfully

Mr Poochball

blackrain · 6th July 2006, 13:37

Posting it tomorrow. Wonder if they have any record of me phoning to reactivate account? Would look strange on their files that the account was closed and inexplicably a year later they send me a new card.

poochball · 6th July 2006, 20:46

Good Luck Mate

blackrain · 27th October 2006, 12:34

Ooops. I forgot about this thread. Well, I did get a reply eventually.

I have a letter saying they did indeed CLOSE my account. BUT they took the CLOSURE BLOCK off a year later when I rang up to reopen....

Surely if it is closed then it's closed????? How can they give me credit again without a new CCA and a credit check etc.? What if I had been defaulted or made bankrupt in the meantime??

Any opinions?

blackrain · 27th October 2006, 23:57

Ok. It just got better. I replied asking for a copy of CCA. Replied to default warning saying we are in dispute and you haven't provided CCA so you cannot enfore debt.

Today I received a Default Notice giving me 14 days. So how do I stand? They can't default me on an account where they have defaulted on CCA surely?

noomill060 · 28th October 2006, 02:26

No.

Read this thread

Loan Company Cannot Supply The Original Agreement

blackrain · 28th October 2006, 09:59

I have tried to read that before but I never have enough time to get the whole way through! Will sit down with a cuppa today and take what I can from that.

tamadus · 28th October 2006, 10:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackrain

I have tried to read that before but I never have enough time to get the whole way through! Will sit down with a cuppa today and take what I can from that.

Ok I just found this thread and I need to clarify the trail of events slightly so bear with me please.

Your account was closed and then re-opened on a telephone request ? I assume a new card was sent and you have used it.

You then made a request under the CCA section 77/78 for a copy of the agreement which has not yet been satisfied? Do you have proof of them recieving that request ?

Sorry about the questions but the postings have been over a period of time and become a little disjointed.

blackrain · 29th October 2006, 09:24

Yes, account closed and reopened after phoning a year later.

The request was sent recorded delivery. I received a reply saying here's your copy of the CCA but there wasn't one included. Either incompetence or a stalling tactic.

tamadus · 29th October 2006, 14:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackrain

Yes, account closed and reopened after phoning a year later.

The request was sent recorded delivery. I received a reply saying here's your copy of the CCA but there wasn't one included. Either incompetence or a stalling tactic.

I may well be wrong but to my mind once the account is settled and closed then a new agreement has to be established. If nothing else your permission to process your data ceased with the account closure and they can't just assume and restart that processing.

spartagates · 30th October 2006, 01:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackrain

I took out an MS card more than six years ago and paid it off around 2000 and closed the account.

About a year later being a little hard up at Christmas (and being dumb) I phoned them up and asked if my account was closed. To which they replied yes. I asked if I could re-open it to which they replied yes.

Now if I have cancelled a credit card I have surely cancelled the credit agreement so how does it work then when I restart it a year later by phone? Does the original agreement stand or is there in fact no credit agreement for this account?

If I'm reading this right, you had an account which u paid off. You then decided to reopen the account again a year later via telephone. I now assume you used the account, spent money etc. Now your questioning if it's a valid account as it was only a phone conversation to restart and you never resigned anything? Are you attempting to get out of this whole debt? Whatever the rights and wrongs of charges and paperwork being in order, you did spend the money they are seeking (minus unlawful charges of course

)? If I'm way of base here I apologise, but I'm pretty sure the founders of this site intend to empower the consumer to fight unfair and unlawful charges, not help people get out of paying back money they borrowed in good faith on a technicality.

blackrain · 30th October 2006, 09:21

I take your point. However I am not trying to get out of the debt. I requested it initially to see what they would come up with regarding the account being closed and then reopened. I wanted to get an explanation of what happened during the 12 months it was closed as they allowed a transaction to go through (I forgot I had a card protection subscription).

Basically I am going for my penalties to be refunded and wanted them in a weaker position before I started. But now they are trying retaliatory tactics I might push it a bit further. There seems to be some very strange practices at MS. I'm sure there are no such things as 'closure blocks' that you can just remove and restart an account without during the necessary checks.

blackrain · 31st October 2006, 15:19

Quote:

I may well be wrong but to my mind once the account is settled and closed then a new agreement has to be established. If nothing else your permission to process your data ceased with the account closure and they can't just assume and restart that processing.

So if nothing else they shouldn't be sending information about defaults to CRA?

Mike220359 · 31st October 2006, 20:50

Agreed.

Mike

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