I also used to pay in the same manner. The way BT USED to charge the PPF wasnt legal since it was a penalty for not allowing them DD, I used to withhold the PPF payments and sucessfully got them written off after a lot of arguing with BT. BT some time ago reworded their T&C's which now makes the PPF perfectly legal since its no longer a penalty for not allowing DD, they now in effect do not charge you extra for not paying by DD but instead give customers who do pay by DD a discount. In effect its exactly the same, theyre penalising you because you dont want BT having access to your bank account but its perfectly legal - hence why Ive left them the moment my 12mth contract was up. Not great business sense really, their stealth charge of £4.50 per quarter or £18 per year has just cost them a minimum of £144 per year in line rental alone (I never actually used the phone line for anything other than internet access). If more people voted with their feet they'd soon get the message.

Im glad you used the term "extort" since legal or not that is what BT do to their customers, and yes im quite aware BT are not going to pay it and are under no olbigation to do so (goes without saying) it simply gets the point across. They are thieving money grabbing ****, charging unreasonable fees for nothing. I just thought it would once be nice to allow them to be on the receiving end of their own BS. I even made sure to use as much of their own pre-scripted rubbish that Ive had to endure from them explaining just how reasonable the charges are. BT have such an unfair monopoly we have no choice but to bow down to them or face their barrage of charges. So as i say, its just my parting shot at them to make the point.

purely for information. These outrageous fees have angered me since they first began. It is MY choice how i choose to pay my bills and I do not for one second trust BT will deciding how much they take from MY bank account each month. I used to also subtract their PPF fees (since i always pay online BACS which costs nothing to process) from the bills prior to BT amending their T&C's which then made them legal. Anyway, Ive now managed to leave BT. The other week I logged in to my online BT account one last time to discover it said they owe me £23 and that it would be paid by 3rd June by cheque. Well the cheque has now arrived (late). Just to prove the point i am now sending BT a bill for £4.50 to cover the cost for me to process the payment they have sent me, and an additional £7.50 since they sent the payment late. I have no doubt they will try to ignore my demands but it will quite clearly demonstrate to BT their charges are utter BS. BTW Ive now moved to Orange as they offer 20Mb broadband for just £17 per month and that INCLUDES the monthly line rental which BT charge £12 for anyway! BT YOU SUCK

I sent the CCA to Lloyds comsumer debt recovery dept, the same place that made me the early settlement offer, so its up to them where they want to send it after that? Hardupnotfedup, that seems like a good idea. One question, im assuming I get a third party to pay it so theres no admission of the debt??? Can I get a family member to pay it?

I'd really like to clear the debts one way or another if possible? Can i not get them to state they do not have the required agreement and the debt is written off somehow? Like I mentioned I how some funds available now to pay off some of my debts, not enough for all of them though. I'd like to get my credit rating back in order. I was hoping to pay those that can provide an enforcable copy of an agreement and get the the ones that cant written off? Is it really just a case of leaving it with the creditor and forgetting about it.

I'm now in a position to offer an early settlement lump sum to clear some of the debts ive had for many years. Before doing so im checking with each of them that they have an enforcable agreement. On Oct 13th 09 I sent the standard CCA request to Lloyds TSB along with £1 payment. Finally, last week on the 9th Nov 09 I got their reply stating they had not received enough details from me to find and process my request? They have returned my CCA request and payment for £1 and asked that I resend it with an up-to-date home adress, any previous addresses and card numbers relating to the debt?! My original letter already had my correct home address on it (and at any point when i have moved they have been informed), it also had the reference number relating to the alleged debt. I have no idea what the card number is or was, surely they should have that information? (ive not had the card for well over 6years) and its not up to me to provide them previous addresses they should already have?! If they cant trace the debt from my name, address and their own reference number then I'm asuming they will have to write the debt off? Their letter finishes by saying that if i would still like to make a request pursuant to section 78 of the CCA, please write with the appropriate authorisation to: Lloyds Banking Group... e.t.c Brighton. I feel no obligation to resubmit my CCA request when it was done correctly the first time. How do I get closer on this since it is already in default, and it would appear they do not have any sort of signed agreement what-so-ever? thanks

thankyou

CitizenB would you happen to have a link to a copy of the OFT guidelines you mention please? all i can find is the Feb09 findings that 1st Credit are bound by http://www.oft.gov.uk/shared_oft/press_release_attachments/1stcreditrequirements.pdf which relates only to statutory demands.

citizenB I am indeed more than happy to take this to court. Im not sure quite how you mean where you quote what i assume are sections from the CCA (2.7, 2.8, k)? I assume you mean to list 1st Credits breaches of the CCA to date whilst making reference to the CCA itself? thanks

thrubolt, i was asking if my reply to them should be along the lines of i look forward to seeing them in court. where i can gives details of all their breaches of the consumer credit agreement to date.

I had their reply today: "We consider that the documentation we is satisfactory to prove your liability to the repay the debt. We note that you do not agree with us, but are prepared to place the matter before a judge to decide. The account is due to progress to our legal department on 1st November 2009, however we must stress that this is our last resort and would much prefer to make an arrangement with you for the repayment of the remaining balance. Please contact us to make an offer or to seek a reduced settlement figure for a lump sum payment. We look forward to hearing from you in due course." signed by their Compliance Officer (RA) any thoughts on the wording of the reply. I'm assuming its along the lines of 'see you in court'?

ok thankyou very much.. if im now involving the OFT i should mention i have kept a history of 1st Credits unlawful actions and harassment going back to Aug 2008. Should i also include these notes to the OFT? Its everything from the usual twice daily harassment calls at work (despite having put in writing not to) and even writing to me at my place of work when they have my home address! right through to ficticiously making up payment agreements between us of £70 per month (even though the account was in default).

My last reply to 1st Credit was as follows: I now have their reply (below), theyre saying that im wrong basically. they are clearly trying to confuse matters. How come the two regulations contain different terminology? One with "credit agreement" and one without?

thankyou very much.. I was going to say its rather long-winded but having read it, it states the points i need clearly thanks.

they actually sent me that already. It appears 1st credit have taken their warnings seriously, they are now acting in a noticibly more professional manner. I'm happy to wait for their next reply. Either they send me an legible enforcible credit agreement or they will have to right it off.