Alternatively you could purchase a CAG email address here, or maybe you'd prefer our address labels here.
UPDATE: Consumer Forums ConsumerWiki is now LIVE - click here: ConsumerWiki
N.B. Please note - due to postage costs these products are only available in the U.K.
Consumer Action Group envelope labels
You are part of a community of over 155,000 people. Let your bank know that you won't give in. Display one of our labels on your envelopes.
Reclaim the Right!
The Lawpack Small Claims Kit contains everything you need to get your bank charges refund. Sample forms, Instruction manual, template forms and an entire set of court forms in .PDF format on CDRom.
Just type in the details of your claim and print them out.
Reclaim the Right!
Sue your bank as often as you like with one Lawpack!!
With a Lawpack and Patricia Pearl’s book on Small Claims, you have everything you need to get your unfair bank charges refunded or assert other consumer rights.
(England & Wales only)
CAG Forum Users Price £11.99
(click image to buy)
Plus £1 P&P
Reclaim the Right!
Small Claims Procedure by Judge Patricia Pearl
An excellent guide for the layperson Not for use in Scotland
We've managed to negotiate a discount for CAG Users on DIY 'Willpacks'
Click on the image to purchase a Wills kit - £12.99 + £1.00 pp
Remember...you can't take your reclaimed bank charges with you ;-)
Do your Internet search here
Your Internet search-box
Reclaim the Right Ltd. - reg.05783665 in the UK
reg. office:- 923 Finchley Road
London
NW11 7PE
Do your Internet search here:-
Your Internet searchbox
Come and chat with us here (NB: External site NOT affiliated with CAG)
CAG Announcements
Welcome Guest
Please register
Registration is free
There are no charges for using any of the facilities of this website.
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ.
You will have to register before you can post.
To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
You will also have to register to access our template letters and claims forms
registration is free
Are you being threatened over debts more than 6 years old? This may be unfair
See our new Unfair Trading Guide
Bought an extended warranty? Not satisfied?
The warranty may be an example of unfair trading
See our new Unfair Trading Guide
Have you been defaulted?
Would you like to clean up your credit file? Check it out
Lloyds BankMeet other Lloyds Bank customers who have also been faced with excessive unfair bank charges. Exchange encouragement and information about getting your bank charges refunded
Welcome to The Consumer Action Group
and The Bank Action Group
Before beginning to claim your bank charges be sure to read the FAQ by clicking the link above. Read it carefully and also read as much of the forum material as you can manage before you start claiming your bank charges refund.
You will have to register before you can post or view the materials which may assist you in reclaiming your penalty charges: click the register link above to proceed.
To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. Understand what you are doing and you will be able to Reclaim the Right more effectively.
Why don't you come and introduce yourself in the Welcome section at the top of the forum. Then have a look around the rest of it.
Do not post or start claiming until you have read the entire FAQ section and step by step guides and you have a good basic idea of what to do and of the layout of the forum.
Good luck claiming your bank charges.
We strongly suggest that you register under a UserID and not your own name
I have just seen the thread in MoneySavingExpert to which you referred. For those that missed it, 3 persons (penniless, ??, daveglove) with court case upcoming in Hull court received today letters from the court that their cases are about to be struck out without a hearing due to the fact that (using my own approximate wording from memory) "following the Berwick verdict your claim has no realistic prospect of success".
It appears that at least 2 of the 3 bear a similarity with Kevin in that their bundles sent to court omitted T&C (probably the 3rd person too). Quite possibly CAG members due in Hull court will also receive similar letters from tomorrow onwards.
Martin Lewis of MoneySavingExpert has gone into overdrive as shown by the paste below. Unfortunate that just as I was making a second cut-and-paste that site went down for scheduled maintenance.
In another post soon after, Martin mentioned he was liaising with CAG leadership (also going into overdrive) to discuss countermeasures. CAG leadership will no doubt make an announcement soon to dispel uncertainties.
Post from Martin Lewis, MoneySavingExpert:
Specific answer to the penniless case.
This is quite a significant letter - I could churlishly suggest that the judge has seen Berwick but not actually read the judgement carefully. Unfortunately I think you may be one of those people at a significant junction in the whole thing.
There are a few things we could do with knowing.
1. Is this at the judges own discretion or is it at the behest of the bank's solicitors.
The main way to do that is to call the clerk of the court and ask. This really needs to be you or your legal representative. If you could call up and politely ask the clerk " Did the bank's solicitors ask for the judgement to be made or is it purely the judges decision - has there been any correspondence to the solicitors of the bank or would you send any copy to me."
It's also worth finding out if this happened to you or other cases are listed in a similar way on Tuesday. You could ask the clerk that.
2. What you need to do.
There are two options
a You need to appear in court on Tuesday properly prepared to argue the legality of this with the terms and conditions (the Consumeractiongroup.co.uk are putting together a pack on this).
b. You need to ask for more time to prepare as this is a substantial point of law. I am going to ask a solicitor friend to draft a wee 'more time to prepare note for you' in case you decide that option - which you can then send to the court - though as always there is no guarantee it will work (and no legal responsbility taken from it, it's just a suggested form of words).
In terms of a defence I am writing to other people involved in the fighting fund to see what the view is on whether this is something we can help provide a solicitor for and whether it is a good juncture to do that to stem the flow.
I am sorry I can't give you anything more concrete - and I can't make any promises whatsoever (alays plan for the worst and hope for the best), but your case seems to have gone to the Court at an 'interesting' time.
Martin
Martin Lewis, Money Saving Expert. Please note, answers don't constitute financial advice, it is based on generalised journalistic research. Always ensure any decision is made with regards to your own individual circumstance.
I tried to PM Bankfodder, Dave, GaryH, but all 3 mailboxes are overflowing. I shall email EVIDENCE@ConsumerActionGr oup.co.uk. Any Mods who see this, might like to pass on news if appropriate.
Anyone due in Hull court, please leave your name on this thread.
Surely, in compliance with Court rules, any such correspondence by the bank's solicitors (if any) with the Judge or the Court, should be automatically copied to the opposing side - and any such breach condemned accordingly - let alone complied with ?
" .....or is it at the behest of the bank's solicitors."
Did the bank's solicitors ask for the judgement to be made or is it purely the judges decision - has there been any correspondence to the solicitors of the bank or would you send any copy to me."
'If' any exists and hasn't been copied to the Claimant by the Defendant bank, then a point should be taken on this to assist in achieving a short delay to allow the Claimant to prepare.
THIS MATTER BE LISTED ON 4 JULY 2007 AT 3PM TO CONSIDER STRIKING OUT THE CLAIM AS DISCLOSING NO REASONABLE PROSPECT OF SUCCESS IN THE LIGHT OF THE RECENT DECISION OF BERWICK -V- LLOYD TSB
Is Kevin going to the appeal court?, if so this seems a little premature.
I have been following these threads closely as there seems to be a worrying development arising from the Birmingham case.
I think Lloyds are really trying it on thick with trying to cloak these penalties as service charges......but there might be a chink of light at the end of the tunnel.
From a recent template letter sent out by Lloyds TSB trying to justify their so called "service charges":
"Like any business, we do make a charge for some of our extra services. When customers don't have enough in their accounts to cover a payment, this always means extra work-abd it has to happen very quickly. We have to agree to make the payment by setting up or increasing an overdraft, or tell customers we can't agree it. We feel it's fair to charge for this service."
They are clearly trying to say that they are charging you a service fee as they have to decide whether or not to give you an overdraft or increase any agreed overdraft.
First point - surely they can only apply such a charge once. If they refuse the overdraft, surely the paying for that service means that any further payments due from the account will not be paid, as you have already been declined an overdraft. Is it really a service to deny an overdraft 3 times in 1 day and charge for each denial?
If they decide to extend your overdraft, will they only extend it by the amount of the 1 transaction and perhaps decide to extend it again later that day if a further item is presented for payment - charging a "service fee" for each decision.
Where is the manager's lending discretion? How much can a manager lend without head office involvement? If I appled for an overdraft of my own free accord and was denied, is it likely that I could apply the same day again and have it accepted? I think not. So how can they justify recking up these "service chagres" for basic lending decisions?
Anyway, let's assume these service charges are for decisons regarding setting up or increasing an overdraft. So I had a little look at their website again to substantiate how much they charge if I were to call at a branch to apply for and arrange an overdraft.
When you borrow from us
If you decide you need an overdraft or think you might go over your agreed overdraft limit, please contact any Lloyds TSB branch or call us on 0845 3 000 000.
How much we lend depends on our assessment of your circumstances. You must be 18 or over. Overdrafts are repayable in full on demand. We won't charge a fee for setting up an overdraft. All you pay is interest on the amount you borrow.(my emphasis).
So there we have it folks. They do not charge a service fee for arranging or extending an overdraft on request from the customer. Their compensation for such a transaction is the interest on the money you borrowed.
So can anyone explain how they can still call these service charges for making a decision regarding an overdraft?
And when we have the famous Clause 9.2 from old T's & C's:
9.2 If you do use your card to create an overdraft we have not agreed or to exceed an agreed overdraft limit, you have broken the terms of the Account, and you must repay the unagreed amount immediately.
If ever there was an example of the cloaking of charges that was frowned upon by the OFT last year - this is it.
I wonder has the Ombudsman been involved in any cases since this decision. It would be good to know thir take on this.
THIS MATTER BE LISTED ON 4 JULY 2007 AT 3PM TO CONSIDER STRIKING OUT THE CLAIM AS DISCLOSING NO REASONABLE PROSPECT OF SUCCESS IN THE LIGHT OF THE RECENT DECISION OF BERWICK -V- LLOYD TSB
Is Kevin going to the appeal court?, if so this seems a little premature.
pete
Whatever you do don't panic!
This is just a strike out hearing.
Now that the cats out of the bag re their previous T's & C's you can argue that you believe the Berwick v Lloyds was bad law in that court failed to examine the underlying reasons for the charges together with their impact. It also relied on Lloyds current T's & C's, obtained by the courts own admission from the internet! when we all know, as should the court, that Lloyds have surreptitiously since these claims started changed the wording on their T's & C's
Further that by agreeing to allow their charges to be described as service charges the court was also failing to recognise that companies have always attempted to disguise their penalty charges through the wording of their contracts & the higher courts have, for almost a century, seen beyond this practice & decreed them as an unlawful indemnity.
Also a reminder that it’s important to have the relevant case law to hand
I also thinks Tide's idea of notifying the press of each win is a great idea. Lets collect some media email addresses so we can sned them notification. They'll soon realise the banks are losing hand over fist
I agree entirely with the comment about publicity.It has often been said that Judges do not live in the real world - and this is not a critisism but as a layman the obvious question is- if the judge is so sure all the cases due to come up in his court are unlikely to succeed he is indicating that it is a simple point of law that the banks are in the right and all claimants are in the wrong. If this is the case why have there been XXXX cases known to this site alone where the banks have paid up without even defending when they can afford the best legal advice going?
Surely he must be aware of this from conversations with his peers?
If he feels the banks are correct then why does he not force them to appear in front of him with the proof just for one case to justify his views?
Publicity may make him re-think??
Jansus
SORRY DONT KNOW HOW I DID THAT THIS WAS A REPLY TO ANOTHER POST ABOUT PUBLISING WINS_ GOT ON TO WRONG THREAD_ BUT STILL RELEVANT
Last edited by jansus; 1st June 2007 at 18:26.
Reason: wrong thread
THIS MATTER BE LISTED ON 4 JULY 2007 AT 3PM TO CONSIDER STRIKING OUT THE CLAIM AS DISCLOSING NO REASONABLE PROSPECT OF SUCCESS IN THE LIGHT OF THE RECENT DECISION OF BERWICK -V- LLOYD TSB
Is Kevin going to the appeal court?, if so this seems a little premature.
If he feels the banks are correct then why does he not force them to appear in front of him with the proof just for one case to justify his views?
Publicity may make him re-think??
Jansus
We are a long way off the banks putting forward an actual argument in front of a Judge, if ever. If my memory serves me correctly, when Jo Bloggs has failed to appear in the past, judgement has gone to the gas company, landlord, bank or whoever has brought the action. I believe Tom Brennan is making a stand partly to put his name in lights. This Judge is doing the same. All publicity is good publicity. Not in this case M'Lud.
Re: Lloyds victory in Birmingham - in perspective 
