Notice of Assignment - both parties?

[The Doctor]

A debt of mine, often moved from one DCA to another, has recently changed hands again...

At least that's what a new one is telling me!

They sent me a Notice of Assignment but I have not received any notification from the 'old' DCA and wondered if that was a requirement more than a nicety.

So the question is - must both the OLD and the NEW send me notice, or is it only necessary for the new one? If the latter, surely this would lead to problems should an unscrupulous outfit obtain details of anyone's debt, claiming they now deal with it!?

I can't seem to find any concrete advice off t'internet elsewhere, so thought I had better ask the experts - CAG!

[I've got no money]

Notice of assignment - should be from the assignor (i.e. the Original Creditor) and served on you.

Incidentally Assignments - The Notice of Assignment Provisions basically say that for an Assignment to be valid notice of it must be served by the assignor on the debtor - s136 Law of Property Act 1925. The important thing to remember is that you can still ask to be provided with a copy of the original assignment

[pt2537]

to be within the Law of Property Act 1925 NOA must be served via recorded post, they must have proof of posting to prove the service was effected

[Valhalla]

Hi
A couple of questions please about notices of assignment and the rights of DCA to issue threats about Warrants of Execution - hope this is the right place to post this

I am in dispute with Marks & Spencer Money and also with First Direct

I have received letters from two DCA's one called Moorcroft Debt Recovery who say that have been instructed by Marks & Spencer Financial Services, the other from Metropolitan Collection services whose letter simply quotes First Direct as a reference.


Moorcroft write
It is a legal requirement to send a letter of intended litigation before legal procedings in the County Court are issued. This letter fulfills this requirement even if it is not read by you.

To prevent legal action from being taken it is essential that you settle this debt without delay .....

We would draw to your atention that if judgement and an order for repayment in full is obtained and remains unpaid enforcement of debt may be sought by one or more of the following
Warrant of execution by bailiffs against goods owned
Application for attachment of earnings....
Aplication for a charging order.....

Metropolitan write

You must telephone us immediately to confirm when full repayment will be made.
If you do not contact us we intend to instruct DG solicitors to issue legal proceedings and apply to issue a Warrant of Execution.
We should explain that a Warant of Execution gives the court bailiff authority to take goods which belong to you from you home and sell them....

Plus more in the same vein


I have never had any communication before from either of these DCAs.
Do they have any right to pursue these claims ?
If the debt has been sold or assigned to them by the alleged creditors then isn't the lender obliged to send me a Notice of Assignment ?

If the debt has not been sold or assigned to the DCA, is it not true that the dispute remains with the original lender and not the DCA so it's up to the original lender to take legal proceedings, not the DCA ?

No CCJ has been issued so is it true that a Warrant of Execution can be issued before the matter has even been heard in court?

Any other comments or advice please.
How should I respond ?

Thaks in anticipation

Valhalla

[creditcardmug]

You should get a goodbye/hello letter each time it happens, however they don allways play by the rules, so you are quite within your rights to ignore them untill they do.

As an aside, a lot of DCAs seem to be saying something like "valid even if not read by you" whats that about?

[Valhalla]

Thanks for your message creditcardmug,
I’m not surprised to read that DCAs don’t always play by the rules, but I'd still like to understand a little more what the rules are exactly.

Can anyone tell me, or tell me where to look to find out :


At what stage must a NOA be issued ?


What right, if any, does a DCA have to threaten to apply for a Warrant of Execution if no NOA has been issued from the lender advising me that the debt has been assigned and to whom ?


Is the threat by the DCA (to instruct solicitors to apply for a Warant of Execution which might result in Bailiffs calling to seize me goods) have any validity at all if no CCJ has been issued?

Sorry to be fussy but I need to respond in some way to the letters I have received and am still not sure what to do for the best.

Thanks to anyone out there in CAG land who knows the answers

Valhalla

[I've got no money]

The Notice of Assignment - the LPA 1925 requires that for an Assignment to be be effective Notice must be given in writing by the Assignor to the debtor. The act doesn't specify when ALTHOUGH the agreement may do - some Consumer Credit Agreements require the Notice to be given within a set period of the Assignment. What is important to remember is that if a creditor alleges an Assignment has taken place you want to see the actual assignment - not just the notice.

The issue of a warrant of execution is a method of enforcing a judgment. If there is no judgment there can be no enfocement. If a DCA threatens a warrant of execution without mentioning that they have to issue proceedings, get a ccj, then arguably the DCA is using improper methods. You should complain to both the OFT and Trading Standards. You need to read their letter carefully as it may not say what you think it says. Of the letters that you quote - Moorcroft is fine - they explain the process. Metropolitan is a little closer to the knuckle...

The valid even if not read by you - actually doesn't add anything. It is stating the obvious - if you have received a LBA - whether you read it or not you've still received the LBA. They would say that they point that out in an attempt to get a response - personally I think its' another subtle form of intimidation.

You should really set your own thread up.

[pt2537]

Originally Posted by I've got no money

The Notice of Assignment - the LPA 1925 requires that for an Assignment to be be effective Notice must be given in writing by the Assignor to the debtor. The act doesn't specify when ALTHOUGH the agreement may do - some Consumer Credit Agreements require the Notice to be given within a set period of the Assignment. What is important to remember is that if a creditor alleges an Assignment has taken place you want to see the actual assignment - not just the notice.

quite , the case of W F Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke and another - [1956] 2 All ER 169 did set out however that the date of assignment must be correctly stated or the assignment is ineffectual in law so there are constraint upon the accuracy of the document

also the figure must be correct or the assignment is again ineffectual

[The Doctor]

Thank you all for your input.

I take it that this means I can certainly demand that the original creditor gives notice and that I have no legal requirement to pay the new one yet...?

[I've got no money]

pt2537 - cheers for that it had been bugging me all day - I just could not remember the case name.

Until the Original Creditor gives proper notice there is no lawful assignment

[tifo]

if the bank sells it to DCA 'A' and i get a letter from DCA 'B' stating they have bought the debt from DCA 'A', doesn't DCA 'A' have to send me an NoA that they have sold the debt to DCA 'B'?

i.e. HSBC sells it to Phoenix, i get notice from Fredrickson that they've bought it now. Nothing ever received from Phoenix, no hello letter and no goodbye letter. So is the Fredrickson NoA valid?

HSBC sold the account when i claimed charges back, while putting my complaint on hold re test case. So Fredrickson are asking for an amount already in dispute with the bank and on hold for now. My claim would wipe the debt out and give me some change.

[The Doctor]

Originally Posted by I've got no money

Until the Original Creditor gives proper notice there is no lawful assignment

Sorry if I seem to bang on about this, but is this the case no matter what type of assignment the new DCA is operating under?

I was under the impression there are two ways, one being equitable assignment. Am I just another confused debtor?

I'm only seeking to clarify this beyond doubt, especially since I need to write back to mine and give them what for!

[robcag]

Hi Paul

Originally Posted by pt2537

quite , the case of W F Harrison & Co Ltd v Burke and another - [1956] 2 All ER 169 did set out however that the date of assignment must be correctly stated or the assignment is ineffectual in law so there are constraint upon the accuracy of the document

also the figure must be correct or the assignment is again ineffectual what if no figure is mentioned at all on the NoA? Presumably this is also ineffective?

Cheers
Rob

[tifo]

Originally Posted by The Doctor

I was under the impression there are two ways, one being equitable assignment. Am I just another confused debtor?

Equitable is where the DCA collects on behalf of the bank, they do not become the creditor so cannot sue or default in their own name.

Absolute is where the DCA buys the debt and becomes the creditor. They then collect for themselves. A notice is sent for this type of assignment as it is a legal action. All assignments under s.136 LoP 1925 are absolute, no matter what Cabot (and others) tell us.

[I've got no money]

In your situation you are talking about an Absolute assignment - where the OC MUST give you the Notice of Assignment

Don't forget ask for a copy of the original

[tifo]

Originally Posted by I've got no money

In your situation you are talking about an Absolute assignment - where the OC MUST give you the Notice of Assignment

In most cases, both Assignment letters from the bank and DCA are sent by the DCA. Check the envelopes and return addresses used.