HSCB intend to defend (^QZ26702) - Settled -

[LouizeM]

Hi, Im not a member of HSBC, but my partner is and Im posting this on his behalf.

He requested a refund of £1,000 at the end of March by letter. Yesterday he received a standard response (which is appearing in other threads on the HSBC section). This was however signed by Phil Beaumont, Senior Service Quality Officer in Leeds.

INITIAL REQUEST LETTER
Can you please send me the information which I am entitled to under the Section 7(1) of the Data Protection 1998 in respect of all bank charges you have incurred on the account listed above.
I would ideally like this information from the inception of these accounts. If you need further information from me, or a fee, please do not hesitate to contact me on the above address, email: xxxx@xxxx or xxxxx.
If your team does do not normally handle these requests for the HSBC, please pass this letter to your Data Protection Officer or another appropriate official.
I understand that you are obliged to respond to this request within 40 days of receipt, and therefore look forward to receiving your response. They did post a list of these charges within about 14 days, there was a charge for this.

REFUND REQUEST 1
Cant find a copy of this - will post when I remember where I filed it!

STAGE 1 - RESPONSE FROM HSBC
Thank you for your letter requesting a refund of bank charges going back to 1999.

The bank does not agree with your contention that the charges that have been imposed are unlawful and are therefore unenforceable. The contract between the bank and its customers is governed by our Personal Banking Terms and Conditions. In respect of overdrafts, I would refer you specifically to clause 7.11 in Section 2. If you authorise payment that would, if met by us, lead your account going overdrawn or over an agreed limit the bank considers whether or not to make this payment and a fee is payable for this service.

Our fees and charges are clearly stated in our published price list and the circumstances in which these charges will apply are clearly set out in our terms and conditions, which you will have been provided with a copy when you opened your account.

Whilst I accept that this letter will not provide the response that you hoped for, I trust I have been able to clarify the bank's position. If you are not satisfied with the bank's response you should now refer your complaint to the Financial Ombudsman Service, as this represents our final response on this matter. Yours sincerely, Phil Beaumont"

STAGE 2 - SECOND REQUEST
He is today issuing a response to Mr Beaumont as follows:

"Dear Mr Beaumont

Response – Refund of Bank Charges

Thank you for your response reference xxxxxxxxx, to my initial request letter dated XX March 2006 for a refund of bank charges.

I note that you have specified in your response that the HSBC bank does not agree with my contention of the charges. However, I now understand that the regime of fees which you have been applying to my account in relation to direct debit refusals, exceeding overdraft limits and so forth are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer regulations.

If you say that they are not, then you will pleased to demonstrate this by letting me have a full breakdown of the costs to which HSBC has been put by as a result of my breaches, in order to reassure me that your penalties really do reflect your costs.

You also recommend that I contact the Financial Ombudsman Service. I would like to bring to your attention that it has now been confirmed that your particularly high level of penalties are considered to be unfair per se by the OFT, as reported on the 5th April 2006. HSBC’s fees are therefore presumed to be unlawful in the absence of specific proof to the contrary.

Your responsibilities

I would like to further draw your attention to the terms of the contract which your bank agreed to at the time that I opened my account. It is an implied term of that contract that you (HSBC) would conduct yourselves lawfully and in a manner which complies with UK law.

I consider that your representation that your charges are fair and reasonable are in fact deceptive, and that they have deceived me into agreeing to pay them. This concealment of the true nature of your charges has prevented me from asserting my right until now.

Next Steps

As previously notified in my original letter, I calculate that you have taken a total of £XXXXX from my account over the period specified, which I again request to be refunded.

It would therefore be appreciated if you respond to this request within 14 days of receipt, indicating your intentions by accepting my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive my refund.

May I also take this opportunity to remind you that my taking of legal action in this matter, will not only result in the above amount being refunded, but leave HSBC liable for all legal costs incurred.

I look forward to receiving your timely response.

Many thanks
Kind regards"

Trying the nice approach before legal action. If nothing within 14 days - then we will!!!

[Bookworm]

Good stuff.

But of course, you are saying "breach of contract", they're trying the "providing a service" approach.

If you authorise payment that would, if met by us, lead your account going overdrawn or over an agreed limit the bank considers whether or not to make this payment and a fee is payable for this service.

That tells me your nice approach is going to go precisely nowhere. Personally, I would go with the 7 days LBA "pay up or else", but that's me.

[LouizeM]

Good point, havent actually posted it yet - will change it to:...

"I note that you have specified in your response that the HSBC bank does not agree with my contention of the charges in that this is specified in your Terms and Conditions of Service. However, my request for a refund is that the regime of fees which you have been applying to my account as specified in your terms and conditions (in relation to direct debit refusals, exceeding overdraft limits and so forth) are unlawful at Common Law, Statute and recent Consumer regulations. I consider, therefore, that you are in breach of contract."

and then at the end....
"If I do not hear from you within 14 days of receipt, indicating your intentions by accepting my request in principle and letting me know a date by which I will receive my refund I will commence legal action against you.

May I also take this opportunity to remind you that my taking of legal action in this matter, will not only result in the above amount being refunded, but leave HSBC liable for all legal costs incurred."

[LouizeM]

Also, just as an aside....

I am a Halifax bank customer and have already requested this information from them. However, reading the Halifax forum, they are paying out no questions asked - in one case this was over 10k. Why are HSBC so different to their treatment of its customers to the Halifax? Does anyone else think its bizarre, or does the HSBC have some iron clad terms and conditions that the other banks dont??

How can there be such inconsistencies with the same kind of business?

[markd]

I don't think it's so much inconsistencies as it is arrogance!

[LouizeM]

Maybe its luck of the drawer which clerk you get in which company....

[ukdickie31]

Go for it. Keep plodding on and stick to your guns. It's a game remember. The banks expect some people to drop out.

Best of luck !!

[LouizeM]

OK now just got a letter from Allen Laidler - it says:

"Thank you for your letter.

I can confirm that the Bank's position has been clearly stated in our letter dated XXXXXX2006. This letter constituted our final response with regard to this matter and adsvised that should you remain unsatisfied, you have the option to refer to the Financial Ombudsman Service as detailed in the leaflet provided.

Yours sincerely
Allen Laidler
Service Quality Manager, Leeds"

So that brings to a close our comms with HSBC. Can you please direct me to the procedure/letter/process that I need to do to get the £1k back that they owe?

Cheers

[LouizeM]

They have responded, wont budge.

[nickmack]

Look in the library for templates.

Stick to your timetable. When the 14 days you have given them is up, no need to correspond further with them. Start the Moneyclaim online.

[ukdickie31]

It's time for Moneyclaim.

You have done stage 1 and 2.

You must keep going.

Have a look in the Library

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk...read.php?t=634

Adjust this to be specific for yourself and play around with the words until you are happy. Make sure you include interest as per the spreadsheet and also file for costs as well.

You may find your £1000 turns into £1500 !!!

Once you have filed the claim, make sure you PM one of the moderators with the file number, bank and amount claimed.

Expect them to acknowledge the claim, state they will defend but settle before they even set a date to defend. They will not want to go to court.

Don't bother with the Ombudsman.

If you give up now, you play right into their hands !!!

[Spiceskull]

Yes - good luck.

[LouizeM]

Started the claim with Moneyclaim (really easy website - brilliant!!)

Amount: £1400 (approx)

Lets see what happens now

[LouizeM]

HI, Got a letter today informing that it has been acknowledged, by DG Solicitors, Edgebaston, Birmingham - with the box checked stating "I wish to defend all of this claim" - signed Deborah D'Aubney.

The Northampton cover sheet indicates that "The defendant now has 28 days from the date of service of the claim for to file a defence".

OK chaps, can you please advise what I need to do now?

Louize

I have merged your threads, as you need to keep to 1 thread for each claim or it will get too confusing for everyone.

Thanks

Louise

[dave]

Do nothing.

The next step will be the allocation questionnaire - fill it in when you get sent it from the court, then wait.

Nothing more for you to do.

[overcharged_consumer]

Hmmmm, do they always tick this box when they acknowlege or is this a new thing for HSBC? From reading previous threads it seems that they usually acknowlege and then settle but could this be the start of a new tactic to see just how far the claimant is willing to go?

OC