court action re non refund of a flight cancellation

[harry3488]

I have got 2 jet tickets booked for September.
I now have to cancel my holiday, Jet 2 will not refund any of the money I have paid for the flights.

They have openly admitted they will re sell the seats when I cancel, and because I booked so early they will make a profit doing this as the flight I am on is very popular.

I am considering taking them to the small claims court over this with a defence based on the above, does anyone have any advice or know if this has been done before?

[ladybird17]

depends on the T&C's under which you booked your ticket.

[Bookworm]

Originally Posted by ladybird17

depends on the T&C's under which you booked your ticket.

Wrong.

It will depend on many factors, not least of all the concept of unjust enrichment, and the UTCCR 99, and the mitigation of loss.

Harry, have a read here:
Jet2.com - £110.50 for name change

Although the above relates to a name change, most of the arguments I wrote in post # 20 could be used.

The main difficulty would be proving that they have re-sold your seat, which at the top of my head, you'll only be able to do by trying to re-book it on the day before, and if it comes back with "no seats available", there's your proof that the airline lost NOTHING by your cancellation, and that the refusal to refund anything amounts to unjust enrichment, as it is pure profit.

Notwithstanding the above, you are at the very least entitled by law to the refund of the airport tax, etc... See here:
Ryanair - getting your taxes back?
and the arguments used by Thailand.

and finally, read the arguments put forward by RosieCotton here:
Cancellation Charges

(lady knows what she's talking about! )

and decide how you want to proceed.

I am about to start on Easyjet myself for £65 for a name change, same flight, nothing else different. I'll get my own thread on it started once on its way.

[ladybird17]

Thanks bookworm - I only said that as I lost a similar case with an airline cancellation. I did win back my taxes, but not the cost of the flights. And it all hinged on the T & C's relating to the ticket I'd purchased. So I'll know in future!

[Bookworm]

Did you now?

That could be useful for future reference, not least to see where it could get picked at for where it went wrong (no offence!), do you still have all the details, Particulars of Claim, defence, decision, etc...??? If yes, would it be a big imposition to ask you to create a thread for reference with all the info on it?

[ladybird17]

First of all, I would have no problem in someone picking holes in what I did - I'd be be grateful!

Secondly, unfortunately, this was a couple of years back and I don't have the paperwork any more. In fact what with me being a serial "suer" and a (very) frequent traveller I can't even remember which airline it was - either Ryanair or Virgin, or it might have been another one. (Not being much help here am I?)

It didn't go to court, I was advised to accept the taxes (which of course I knew I was entitled to) and I just put it down to experience.

[Bookworm]

Ah well, that was worth a try... Never mind, thanks for answering anyway!

[harry3488]

I was thinking, would the airline fight this if you had the balls to take it to the 11th hour.
Obviously costs would not be an issue so all I stand to lose is £30 but the airline would have to pay for their solicitors and also if they lost it might set a dangerous precendent for them so they may well quietly pay up

[Bookworm]

No "dangerous precedent", it's small claims court, precedents can not be set in small claims.

They may well settle quietly to save the costs of appearign in court for such small amount, yes. You should however prepare for court as if it was going all the way, this way, there can be no nasty surprises.

[NFMac]

Of course precedents can be set in the small claims. It's an informal procedure but still a full court hearing with a proper (District) Judge. It's the lowest form of court but still legally binding.

I would strongly recommend not issuing a claim. You will be exposed to your court fees but also to the opposite side's travelling costs if you lose. There's also the (slim) chance that you may have to pay their full legal costs if the Judge considers your actions unreasonable.

This forum always says that it's almost irrelevant that you agreed to the terms and conditions because they could be considered to be 'unreasonable' due to the Unfair Contract Terms Act. I disagree strongly with this but can't be bothered to go through the discussion again as it's there on other posts.

I would strongly recommend that you read the post titled '£110.50 for a name change' where I posted much the same as above but was argued against. That person ended up going to court and lost and had to pay travelling costs of the other side.

[Bookworm]

Originally Posted by NFMac

Of course precedents can be set in the small claims.

Of course, they can not. Where do you get your knowledge of law?

The ONLY way a precedent can be set in Small Courts is if you were to ask for a declaration when filing. Why do you think the courts have been pushing for a bank charges case to be pushed to Mercantile Court? So that a precedent could be set. If precedent could be set in small claims, by now, we would have a decision on bank charges, based on the case I won back in November.

[NFMac]

Sorry...knowing the general knowledge of the posters on this board, you're quite right I should have clarified my statement. County Court decisions, if reported, are expected to be followed by other District Judges unless there is good reason not to do so. In my opinion, in lay terms, this equals precedent.

Back to the point; your continuous suggestion that Ts and Cs - in effect - 'don't count' because you can always say that they are 'unfair' does a disservice to people seeking opinions on this board.

[Bookworm]

I have NEVER said that T&Cs "don't count". I would be grateful if you don't mis-quote me.

I have said, and will keep on saying so, that UNFAIR terms are unlawful. And that terms deemed unlawful are non-enforceable. I'm not making it up as I go along, by the way, it comes straight from the UTCCR 99, and the UTCA 77, and of course, of over 100 years worth of law cases on penalties.

As for the "disservice" I do... Well, that is your opinion, of course.
I think, however, that the thousands of people I have helped reclaiming their charges, and win other cases consumer-related, might disagree with you. But we have a complaints procedure in place, and if you have issues with my usefulness, I suggest you report me, and ask for Admin to deal with this accordingly.

Incidentally, you are quite mistaken in your assumption about County Court decisions. Each County court case HAS to be decided on individual merit. I really do not know where you get that misguided idea that it is not the case.

Oh, and the fact that ONE person has lost their case does not mean that the next one (or many previous ones for that matter) will not win. One judge's interpretation is different from the next. The arguments put forward by one claimant differ from the next, and that can make all the difference.

Remind me again: What brings you here? 16 posts, and every one of them with the aim of putting people off trying to assert their rights, no thread of your own... Hmmm...