Do I have a problem (ABBEY)

[ICY]

Have had to have new boiler fitted at home, insurance company sent me a cheque, which came on wednesday, the plumber fitted the boiler on wednesday, I gave him a cheque for £1200 which is the same amount that the insurance companies cheque was for.
Both my cheque and the insurance cheque were put into the bank on wednesday, it is showing my clearance date as 6th may (bloody bank holidays) All good and well.

UNTIL

looks at my account online today, the balance is showing that the cheque I wrote has been taken from my account, (supposed to take 3 days to clear cheques) however the funds from the insurance cheque I put into my account is not showing as cleared.

BUT

when I click on statements it is showing as the cheque I wrote not come from my account yet, so my online account is telling me two different things.

Not sure if I can get any cash out yet or not, but the big problem is obviously this is bank holiday weekend, I do have enough in my account with a bit to spare to get me over the weekend, however if they go off my avail that is showing online that mean I cant get to my cash.

The second problem is am I going to receive charges for this, it is something I have no control over, the second I got the cheque I put it into my account, but had to get the boiler fixed, we have had no heating or hot water for nearly two weeks, and wednesday was the only chance to get the new boiler fixed until tuesday next week, so after put cheque into my account I gav the plumber cheque for the works.

I dont want to ring them as last time I spoke to them I couldnt understand a word they were saying, and got a very arrogant person on the other end of the phone, I am not going through that again, I am trying to keep my blood pressure under control as it is.

[Mistermind]

Today is Friday, 2 days after you deposited your insurance cheque, and 2 days after you handed over your personal cheque to the boilerman (who evidently hotfooted to his branch and deposited your cheque same day).

Your bank's IT system will know you deposited on Wednesday. Some banks will show such a deposit instantly but will not permit drawing against it until cleared 3 working days later. If I remember right Lloyds will not show the deposit of this cheque until clearned. In both instances the banks will not authorise ATM withdrawal against this deposited but uncleared cheque.

Until the boilerman's cheque physically appears on your account, a penalty charge is unlikely to arise, nor will the question of bouncing same. Not sure with your bank whether they will manually give leeway for your deposit, and override the penalty charge if or when that arises. Worth asking. Details maintained for ATM authorisation is always more up-to-the-minute than online statements, so I am afraid no ATM for you this weekend.

Do suggest you have a word with your assistant manager. He would know about this kind of situation, he could also have a vulnerable boiler at home, and your insurance cheque was good. He will have an authorising code to informally override IT barrier for 1 day, hopefully without charging you.

Originally Posted by ICY

looks at my account online today, the balance is showing that the cheque I wrote has been taken from my account, (supposed to take 3 days to clear cheques) .

The personal cheque you wrote will debit your account immediately it becomes known to your bank's IT system -- unless your bank has reason not to honour said cheque.

The insurance cheque you paid in will as a matter of hard-and-fast rule be deemed uncleared for 3 banking days. If the insurance cheque were drawn on the same branch as yourself, then the insurer is debited same day, but you only get the benefit from it 3 days later. The bank enjoys use of £1200 funds for 3 days free. Heads they win, tails they do not lose.

[ICY]

Thanks for the informed reply, the no cash thingie is a bit of a pain but not a major deal, could do with it but if its not there then not a biggie, the main thing is that I wont get charged.

[ICY]

Bad news, got letter this morning.

Dear ICY

I am writing to tell you that you didn't have enough money in your account to cover one or more payments you made recently. You'll see which at the bottom of this letter (cheque for boiler) . This happened because the cheque(s) you paid in were not available on time.

On this occasion we have agreed to your Instant Overdraft request(s) and have made payment(s) for you. As you have used our Instant Overdraft service to request that we make payments an Instant Overdraft monthly Fee and Instant Overdraft Request Fee(s) will be taken from our account.

We'll let you know how much you'll have to pay in your statement at least 2 weeks before we take the money from your account. Details of all our Service Fees and interest rates can be found in our Price List. If you need a another copy you can request one at any time in your local Abbey branch or take a look on abbey.com.

Its a good idea to go back under the Advance Overdraft limit we've agreed with you as soon as you can, as you will be charged an Instant Overdraft Monthly Fee for each month that you continue to be overdrawn beyond your Advance Overdraft limit, and interest at our Instant Overdraft rate.

If you don't have the money to put into your account just now, or if you have any other questions, please give us a call.

Dont forget that were here to help you manage your money - if you'd like advice on any area of your finances please let us know.


SO they think they are going to charge me, do they.
Looked at my online bank statement and AT NO TIME since putting the insurance cheque in and it clearing did my account go over my AGREED overdraft, have a look below at a screenshot of my account, bear in mind my overdraft limit is £950, can someone explain how they can possibly charge me for going over my agreed limit, when according to my statement i haven't ? ? ? ?

How should i tackle this? after looking on there website they are going to charge me £55. Whether they think I have gone overdrawn over not, my statement says not, surely thats where the charges would be justified if stmnt shows no charge then can they legally send this letter saying they are going to take £55 from me.

[Mistermind]

Originally Posted by ICY

looks at my account online today, the balance is showing that the cheque I wrote has been taken from my account, (supposed to take 3 days to clear cheques) however the funds from the insurance cheque I put into my account is not showing as cleared.

BUT

when I click on statements it is showing as the cheque I wrote not come from my account yet, so my online account is telling me two different things.

Icy,

You first posted on May 2nd at 10:43 am. From the above I inferred the "available balance" (e.g. for ATM withdrawal) had made allowance for the boilerman's £1200 cheque (bank IT had already seen it coming through the cheques clearing system, and protectively lowered your ATM authorisation threshold), but your online statement had not shown the boilerman's cheque. It is not known if later the same day that cheque did or did not appear on your online statement.

Most banks WILL show all incoming cheques first thing in the morning, they can then bounce if they wish up to say 3:30pm. If you have any proof (timestamped screen print?), or can induce the bank to own up, that up to the end of banking day May 2nd, your online statement did NOT show the boilerman's cheque, then you have a case. Your misleading online statement led you into a false sense of security, not allowing you the chance to rush to the bank and pay in to meet the boilerman's cheque. How can the bank claim you made a de facto request for "instant overdraft" when your online statement as good as said "no need for overdraft"?

Your offline statement does show the boilerman's cheque landing in your account on May 2nd resulting in a balance of £800 o/d, effectively £2000 o/d as your pay-in of 30th April had not cleared. The case for the bank is that if your insurance cheque had bounced, they would be left holding the baby. So technically you had exceeded your o/d limit, albeit for one day.

Bank online statement will be administered by IT types in bank HQ, and there is no way branch managers will argue with IT. If you write making your case that you were proactively misled by the bank's online statement throughout(?) May 2nd denying you the chance of a remedy, possibly invoking the names of OFT and FOS, hopefully your bank will cave in partially or fully, or Abbey head office now cap in hand for cash rescues from the Treasury, will deem it better to settle quietly.

Good luck.

[ICY]

The incoming cheque was showing as soon as i put it into the bank iirc

[Mistermind]

Not sure what iirc stands for. Bank practices vary, some will not display a cheque deposit until the day it is cleared. Abbey evidently displayed it immediately, but the statement entry clearly showed the uncleared funds to be not available until 6th May. Did the online statement have space to display the same clause? Abbey stands on solid ground that on 2nd May your cleared balance would have been £2000 o/d if they honoured the boilerman's cheque -- which they did.

The 3-day wait was known to you. What was withheld from you, at least on the online statement around 10am, was the information that the boilerman's cheque was deemed to have arrived in your account on Friday 2nd May, not just travelling forward in the interbank cheque clearing system.

In so doing Abbey had time to consider until say 3:40pm whether to bounce the boilerman's cheque. By contrast you were denied the option to choose a remedy. Instead Abbey chose it for you -- they assumed you had requested an

"Instant Overdraft monthly Fee and Instant Overdraft Request Fee(s)".

It was not their decision.

[ICY]

(iirc - if I remember correctly)

Havent had the paper copy of statement, the ones hsown above is a screen capture of my online account.