Rats !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by Gilbert_O'Sullivan

Who mentioned the gays? It was you, so that shows your own opinions!

Get a grip, who on earth wants to befriend a dirty, stinking rat, apart from you and Michael Jackson with his rodent Ben!

Rats should be killed on sight, no ifs or buts.

The thread seemed to have moved onto a number of different topics that are now heated and nothing to do with the rat question.

I am requesting a mod close down this thread with immediate effect.

[schrodingers cat]

i`ll simplify this debate then
Is it right to cause anything to suffer and if so what and why ?
personally i think nothing that is innocent should be made to suffer and i define innocent as that which goes about its daily life and causes no malicious suffering but i`m sure if your pedantic you can pick holes on my definition even tho you will surely know what i mean.
animals that are not self aware cannot in my opinion cause malicious suffering with the possible exeption of cats who seem to relish torturing their victims and are the only other species that i know of besides humans that see killing as sport but i`d put that down to they are hunters and do not have the intellect to see what they are doing unlike humans so they also should be free from retribution
on the other hand there is that guy who recently battered that child to death in his case as in the case of every other human who causes misery on that scale i think he should get exactly what he gave out an eye for an eye as the religious people put it
and mr sullivan it was an assumption based on what your previous post said that is "indescriminate shenannigins" if this wasn`t a referance to peoples sexual behaviour then what was it ? as there is nothing else that i know of that was a means to spreading aids that would fall into that catagory and as it was the popular misconception by the mindless that this was the sole fault of the gay fraternity i assumed that that was what you meant if this was not the case i apologise
can you please point out to me where i actually said i wanted to befriend this rat
I LET IT GO COS IT WAS GOING TO BE TORTURED AND NOT KILLED HUMANELY is that clear enough for you
suffering of anything should be prevented and if they have to die then lets do it with as little misery as possible
I`d love to debate this further but it will have to wait untill tomorrow as i`m going out for dinner vegetarian i may add

[schrodingers cat]

Originally Posted by Monty2007

The thread seemed to have moved onto a number of different topics that are now heated and nothing to do with the rat question.

I am requesting a mod close down this thread with immediate effect.

please do its getting ridiculous

[postggj]

before this thread is closed down i would like to make a quick point

has any one posting worked in the catering trade
rats/mice are a big problem, they are survivors
restaurants employ pest control but they can be never beaten, what ever measures are in place

ime not going ito the nasties they carry, but think about it
poisend bait and air rifle are used, but only contain the problem, not eradicate

they are classed as vermin and desearve all they get, but that is why pest control measures are in place, to act with in the law on culling.

what needs to be addressed is why the rats are on the increase.
my number 1 reason is bin collections every two weeks to save money.
go back to weekly and let nature take its course as the food suply will be limited

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by postggj

before this thread is closed down i would like to make a quick point

has any one posting worked in the catering trade
rats/mice are a big problem, they are survivors
restaurants employ pest control but they can be never beaten, what ever measures are in place

ime not going ito the nasties they carry, but think about it
poisend bait and air rifle are used, but only contain the problem, not eradicate

they are classed as vermin and desearve all they get, but that is why pest control measures are in place, to act with in the law on culling.

what needs to be addressed is why the rats are on the increase.
my number 1 reason is bin collections every two weeks to save money.
go back to weekly and let nature take its course as the food suply will be limited

Dear Postggj
This is the first sensible comment (apart from mine) that has been posted, you obviously are well qualified to comment, given have have had rat problems in the past and your suggestion is very good but relies on the collection of the (food) source. What about "humaine" methods of culling?

[schrodingers cat]

Originally Posted by postggj

before this thread is closed down i would like to make a quick point

has any one posting worked in the catering trade
rats/mice are a big problem, they are survivors
restaurants employ pest control but they can be never beaten, what ever measures are in place

ime not going ito the nasties they carry, but think about it
poisend bait and air rifle are used, but only contain the problem, not eradicate

they are classed as vermin and desearve all they get, but that is why pest control measures are in place, to act with in the law on culling.

what needs to be addressed is why the rats are on the increase.
my number 1 reason is bin collections every two weeks to save money.
go back to weekly and let nature take its course as the food suply will be limited

i agree that something has to be done and no doubt that will involve killing them the only point i was trying to make was it should be done with as little suffering as poss somehow it all got lost somewhere along the debate
S.C

[postggj]

when i left the forces i became qualified as a chef
i worked in clarkenwell ec1,
thats by the smithfield meat market and is a very old part of london. ime talking about the sewer system.

we had every measure in place to deter them, but every morning there were signs.
pest control were in every week.

even the enviromental health agrees with the problem

he said when we are all gone the only thing remaining would be rats and cock roaches.

the problem in that case has not increased as trade waste is collected every day.

since bin collections every two weeks, in local towns , has exploaded.

how many people have seen rats in broad daylight, they are no longer afraid as ample food suply.

why are the councils allowed to put peoples health at risk through cost cutting. and why is the goverment keeping quiet.
ill tell you why

keeping council tax bill low

[schrodingers cat]

sorry people i`ve got to go i`m late already council tax is gonna be a long one personally i`d tax the rich more be it council tax or whatever i dont care i`m not rich and if i was i`d be a bit more generous than people who are lucky enough to have no financial worries
S.C

[Gilbert_O'Sullivan]

Blooming do-gooders. Just because others have a different opinion, ie rats should be exterminated on sight, we have to listen to how we should treat rats as if they were an endangered species.

They are filth, did you know rats are incontinent and leave a trail of disease in their wee wherever they scurry too?

I wouldn't want to go to your house!

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by Gilbert_O'Sullivan

Blooming do-gooders. Just because others have a different opinion, ie rats should be exterminated on sight, we have to listen to how we should treat rats as if they were an endangered species.

They are filth, did you know rats are incontinent and leave a trail of disease in their wee wherever they scurry too?

I wouldn't want to go to your house!

I read of one case where someone contracted Limes disease which is spread in rat's urine.

I certainly would not want to hug one but some people do/will - each to their own................after all who and I to judge?

[robin9342]

Originally Posted by Gilbert_O'Sullivan

Blooming do-gooders. Just because others have a different opinion, ie rats should be exterminated on sight, we have to listen to how we should treat rats as if they were an endangered species.

Bit of an exaggeration there. Yes, rats are not the most pleasant of creatures and yes, they spread disease and must be controlled. So do many other wild animals. The whole point of this thread was to discuss the method of dealing with them.

A rat can be killed quickly with a pellet gun or spring trap. There is no justification to deliberately cause any animal unnecessary pain. In fact, it is against the law to do so. (See my earlier post) I am of the opinion that anyone who takes pleasure in extending the suffering of an animal has some kind of psychological problem!

[schrodingers cat]

Originally Posted by Gilbert_O'Sullivan

Blooming do-gooders. Just because others have a different opinion, ie rats should be exterminated on sight, we have to listen to how we should treat rats as if they were an endangered species.

They are filth, did you know rats are incontinent and leave a trail of disease in their wee wherever they scurry too?

I wouldn't want to go to your house!

Something wrong with doing good is there ? I wrote the original post i most certainly didn`t invite you in on it to question my moral opinion and you seem to have a problem comprehending the english language,my point was and still is it should be done with compassion,i dont want them as mates i dont have them living in my house or any other of the bizzar scenarios you seem to be making up and i dont live in a house anyway i live under a mountain and occasionally come out to play my flute so i can get all my rat buddies to follow me back to my mountain where they will most certainly be more welcome than youself.i`m going to unsubscibe from this thread now,it just seems to be decaying into petty bickering and i`ve found out what i needed to know.what was happening is against the law.
next time you come across a thread that you cannot help with just carry on to the next one and maybe you can do someone some good dont hang around to force your unwanted opinion down someone`s throat
S.C

[Gogivit]

Monty is right to suggest that we all live within 10ft of rats because some selfish humans discard their unwanted take aways on the streets! With regards to the diseases caused by them, I am still 41 years later looking to find a human that has been infected by them!

Gilberts comment "no ifs no buts" frightens me-but hey I believe in what goes around comes around- I picture a 8ft mega rat chasing Gilbert down his highstreet...

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by schrodingers cat

Something wrong with doing good is there ? I wrote the original post i most certainly didn`t invite you in on it to question my moral opinion and you seem to have a problem comprehending the english language,my point was and still is it should be done with compassion,i dont want them as mates i dont have them living in my house or any other of the bizzar scenarios you seem to be making up and i dont live in a house anyway i live under a mountain and occasionally come out to play my flute so i can get all my rat buddies to follow me back to my mountain where they will most certainly be more welcome than youself.i`m going to unsubscibe from this thread now,it just seems to be decaying into petty bickering and i`ve found out what i needed to know.what was happening is against the law.
next time you come across a thread that you cannot help with just carry on to the next one and maybe you can do someone some good dont hang around to force your unwanted opinion down someone`s throat
S.C

I thought that I was doing some good, although I am through with the rat debate. I think that you have concluded:

1. Rats should NOT be allowed in food factories:- as pointed out above they are capable of spreading diseases (some live in sewers and they have the bubonic plague/black death as witness to their potential devastation).
2. They should be culled in a humaine way:- there was some differences of opinion here but that's democracy for you!
3. They can become good companions:- this relates to the domestic rat since a sewer rat would take you finger off (they don't know any better).

The bit abouts AIDS, gays and other (non rat) stuff was off topic and I won't be commenting.

Good rattings to you all!

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by Gogivit

Monty is right to suggest that we all live within 10ft of rats because some selfish humans discard their unwanted take aways on the streets! With regards to the diseases caused by them, I am still 41 years later looking to find a human that has been infected by them!

Gilberts comment "no ifs no buts" frightens me-but hey I believe in what goes around comes around- I picture a 8ft mega rat chasing Gilbert down his highstreet...

Rat's carry a host of ticks and fleas, mainly due to the fact that they live in sewers etc, the domestic ones are popular pets and they do clean themselves (unlike DCA's - lol). I found this site which certainly has it in for them:

Diseases Caused By Rats

	Debt collection library Follow this link to our debt collection library. This library contains templates and advice for dealing with debt collectors who act oppressively or unfairly. This library is work in progress and will be built up over the next few weeks. 17.03.09

[schrodingers cat]

Originally Posted by Monty2007

I thought that I was doing some good, although I am through with the rat debate. I think that you have concluded:

1. Rats should NOT be allowed in food factories:- as pointed out above they are capable of spreading diseases (some live in sewers and they have the bubonic plague/black death as witness to their potential devastation).
2. They should be culled in a humaine way:- there was some differences of opinion here but that's democracy for you!
3. They can become good companions:- this relates to the domestic rat since a sewer rat would take you finger off (they don't know any better).

The bit abouts AIDS, gays and other (non rat) stuff was off topic and I won't be commenting.

Good rattings to you all!

the doing good remark was not aimed at you it was aimed at the blooming do gooders remark by mr o sullivan,i found your input helpful and your summary was correct tho i really dont want them as conpanions,dogs do me fine
S.C

[Gogivit]

Monty2007 your points are very valid. It should be noted that after this debate- we all agree that rats if when caught should either be re-settled or be disposed of humanely. Not via being boiled to death!

[Monty2007]

Originally Posted by Gogivit

Monty2007 your points are very valid. It should be noted that after this debate- we all agree that rats if when caught should either be re-settled or be disposed of humanely. Not via being boiled to death!

Cheers - I feel I have contributed.........

[Gilbert_O'Sullivan]

As I said in my first post I splatter rats with a shovel if my cat brings one home to play with. It's a quick death as all the rat will know is his arse going through his head.

If somebody poured boiling water over one to kill it and it agonised to death I wouldn't have a problem with it, although I would take no joy either.

Rat pellets are an agonising death but that's legal.

We all should kill rats instead of inviting them home for tea and crumpets like schrodingler cat.

[robin9342]

As I said in my first post I splatter rats with a shovel if my cat brings one home to play with. It's a quick death as all the rat will know is his arse going through his head.

Which is valid as the rat will be unlikely to suffer (though I fail to see the humour in killing an animal)

If somebody poured boiling water over one to kill it and it agonised to death I wouldn't have a problem with it, although I would take no joy either.

To kill an animal in such a manner would indicate to me a flaw in that persons character. And its illegal!

Rat pellets are an agonising death but that's legal.

True, but the person killing the rat is not likely to be taking sadistic pleasure from it. And in many cases, especially where there is a large infestation, poison is the only viable control.

We all should kill rats instead of inviting them home for tea and crumpets like schrodingler cat.

Now you are just being antagonistic!